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I am curious what answers Daemons have to combat dark eldar venom spam. It seems that with the expense of our MC's we cannot field enough to really give the dark eldar many problems. To it, they can just as easily swamp our troop choices with shots. All in all, to win with DE vs daemons, all that is necessary, is to put everything on the board, wait for what ever wave comes down and mow it down. Unless you take fate weaver, daemons have almost no shot at winning vs DE

Have you tried spammed out Horrors and Flammers with Fateweaver. The Horrors shot out put should help deal the transports and Flammers are jump infantry which helps with your speed. Fateweaver to keep stuff alive with the re-rolls.

GimlisonofGloin wrote:Have you tried spammed out Horrors and Flammers with Fateweaver. The Horrors shot out put should help deal the transports and Flammers are jump infantry which helps with your speed. Fateweaver to keep stuff alive with the re-rolls.

They can spit out enough shots to vape fateweaver in a shooting phase. I can only make so many rerollable 3+'s. And I dont think spammed out horrors and flamers will do well against any list. Im not looking for a tailor built list, anyone can do that.

I was hoping to get some insight into how best deploy, what should be in my two waves etc

Soul Grinders are actually pretty good against DE. You also need to drop down Fiends and Seekers to catch them and get the drop on the DE. The advantage Seekers have in this matchup is they actually benefit from the 4+ wound on poison weapons - it is much lower than most weapons wound them on.

Otherwise, it is just a really hard matchup. I usually try to knock out their troops and just survive long enough to win/contest on objectives.

A lot of the more competative daemon armies spam horror's as troops. And the humble horror is probably one of the best ways for dealing with venom spam. You should net on average 1 glancing hit for 4 horrors, and then you have a 1/3 chance of doing damage with with your bolt.

Another mainstay is the tzeentch herald on chariot. 1 str 8 shot and 3 str 5 shots also helps to thin out venoms.

I would consider the following a competative daemons list.

HQ
1 Herald of Tzeentch, chariot, we are legion, master of sorcery, bolt of tzeentch
1 Herald of Tzeentch, chariot, we are legion, master of sorcery, bolt of tzeentch
1 Herald of Tzeentch, chariot, we are legion, master of sorcery, bolt of tzeentch
1 The Masque

Elite
6 Fiends, unholy might
6 Fiends, unholy might
5 Bloodcrushers, fury, instrument

Troops
5 Horrors, bolt of tzeentch
5 Horrors, bolt of tzeentch
5 Horrors, bolt of tzeentch
5 Horrors, bolt of tzeentch
5 Horrors, bolt of tzeentch, changeling

Heavy Support
1 Soul Grinder, phlegm
1 Soul Grinder, phlegm
1 Soul Grinder, phlegm

And will use it as my tactics example.

So the first question is are you going first or is the de player going first.

If you are going first I would overload the first wave with as much shooting as possible, so probably all 3 herallds, and all 5 horror squads. The idea is to drop and damage as many venoms as possible to start off with. This is so that once the fiends and grinders come in their anti-tank is less mobile (for the grinders) and their troops are out of their venoms (fiends).

If the de go first then you drop the other wave since it will be more resilient and your opponent should have turbo boosted their stuff all over the place. Go to ground with most of it if you need to the idea is to survive until your shooty stuff drops and then you can hopefully combo with the shooting units that dropped in.

I'm much less afraid of the de matchup than the gk matchup.

As others said, seekers are a good choice with their speed to catch DE. Bill Kim added Skarbrand to the mix to get rerolls to hit for his units and that worked well for him at adepticon.

I like horrors as scoring units, the shooting is not bad and the cost is still very low, and against DE armor even s4 can wreck them.

I echo Warmaster's list, but with flamers w/ bolt instead of fiends (personal preference) and dropping the Masque for another Chariot of Tzeentch kitted out the same. She isn't an IC, so she'll die to shooting pretty fast, especially the mass of firepower DE bring.
When's the last time an army had trouble killing 2 daemonettes? :|

But anyway, Warmaster's advice is solid.

Soul Grinders are actually pretty good against DE

After having three of them gunned down by darklights and blasters, I've learned that this isn't so true at all.

All three got gunned down once? That is definitely a statistically significant example, I am cutting grinders

In all seriousness, they do typically do well overall against DE. I would equip them with Tongue myself, those Raiders are hard to keep a template on and S10 AP1 means auto pen with 3+ to wreck.

I run a pure fiendweaver list and I've been able to dismantle DE. Example battlerep: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/416484.page (game 3)

Honestly, horrors, DP's with bolts, and heralds of T can knock down paper kites with ease (minus when their FF saves are on fire lol). Our units can dominate anything DE has in CC with few exceptions. Just run a lot of shooting units to drop in and down transports; the rest is easy!

calypso2ts wrote:All three got gunned down once? That is definitely a statistically significant example, I am cutting grinders

In all seriousness, they do typically do well overall against DE. I would equip them with Tongue myself, those Raiders are hard to keep a template on and S10 AP1 means auto pen with 3+ to wreck.

All three got gunned down in one turn really, other games had them dying usually from mass darklight fire as soon as they hit the field. (Not counting examples where they died due to mishaps)