Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hi all!



With our upcoming wargame, Warthrone, round the corner, Avatars of War has switched from doing only heroes, to developing full fantasy armies.

AoW is still a small company and developing a full fantasy army is a very big project. Thanks to the development of the WarCast medium, we can create multipart plastic regiments with a very reasonable investment, however, our investing capability allows us to sculpt and produce only a small fraction of what would be a totally complete Dwarf army.

We have created the Dwarf Army funding campaign with the goal of being able to create and release an awesome & complete full Dwarf Army!

If you'd like to help us with the Dwarf Army project check out the Dwarf Army funding campign at Indiegogo.com here:
http://www.indiegogo.com/aow-dwarfs?a=586327

Thanks so much!
AoW Team

For some bizarre reason indiegogo is work blocked, but I'll have a look after work.

If I would back such a project or not relies totally on warthrone as I no longer play Warhammer fantasy, but in general, colour me interested.

As long as you have fixed you shipping/production problems with your previous work......


Although I must say, while dumping $25 for 10 models aint bad, I find it a bit hard to invest too much into this. All we have so far is just concept art. Not saying you are bad at translating concept art into actual models, but some people might not want to jump into the larger investments without anything physical for representation (such as 3 Ups/Renders) beyond your current selection

kenshin620 wrote:As long as you have fixed you shipping/production problems with your previous work......

That's the BIG 'if' for me.

IF they have, I'm in.

Not sure what assurance we'll be given though...

Hmm... If Avatars of War had shares available (as a private company), I would definitely put some money in.

As it is, I am loathe to put money into this where it could be tied up for over a year depending on what I want off the list and how quickly he actually produces everything and gets it for sale. This is a time value of money issue really for me.


No offence to Felix, but could he not take small bank loans every 4 months say and do this in stages?

I wouldn't be surprised if they're already doing that and use this as *another* avenue of fundraising.

What the hell is with all these kickstarters lately? Fools and their money parted....

Grimstonefire wrote:No offence to Felix, but could he not take small bank loans every 4 months say and do this in stages?

Spain's banks' are going to the dogs sadly I'm not sure he would get a loan right now or even in the short term future the interest rate for short term loans are ridiculous atm.

Kurgash wrote:What the hell is with all these kickstarters lately? Fools and their money parted....

What are you talking about?

Do you have links to any projects that people have talked about here that have turned out to be scams?

Kurgash wrote:What the hell is with all these kickstarters lately? Fools and their money parted....

Makes me question all these 'low price' model companies who can't seem to make enough profit to re-invest into their own company to make new products. Asking the customer to assume all the risk while they get all the potential profit is a business model I was not aware worked because customers should be smarter than that.

I do not pre-pay for product and I will definitely not promise money to fund the R&D and production of the product I have pre-paid for.

Make a product I want to buy and ship it to me quickly and I will give you my hard earned money.

I see.

Well, that's the beauty of Kickstarter and Indiegogo - if you don't like the project and are worried about the 'risks', don't back it!

It is a great system!

People can get early copies, free stuff, etc. if they want, and those that don't, won't!

Good luck with it guys! That is some truly fantastic artwork you are showing there!

Some decent deals, but I have no use for fantasy dwarfs.

Well your minis are always very well sculpted, so I'm ever so slightly intrigued. Hope you manage to get it off the ground.

nkelsch wrote:

Kurgash wrote:What the hell is with all these kickstarters lately? Fools and their money parted....

Makes me question all these 'low price' model companies who can't seem to make enough profit to re-invest into their own company to make new products. Asking the customer to assume all the risk while they get all the potential profit is a business model I was not aware worked because customers should be smarter than that.

I do not pre-pay for product and I will definitely not promise money to fund the R&D and production of the product I have pre-paid for.

Make a product I want to buy and ship it to me quickly and I will give you my hard earned money.

I think you do not understand how business actually runs. Before anything happens - it needs to be funded (well except for internet start ups where everyone thing thinks they have a pot of gold). Maybe $56k is pocket change but to small companies, who might have a monthly expense cost of $5k to $10k...6 months to a year's worth of cost is a big deal. So finding capital is hard.

Kickstarter is capital investment for the kitchen, small change that no bank will touch (because they will not make any money on it) but is worth it to 'investors' who might get products they want.

This wouldn't happen unless we are willing to help fund the effort. It's that simple.

BTW - contributed. Already bought your berserkers and they are phenonmenal. So more dwarfs of the same quality sign me up...

And besides that, really nkelsch, noone is making you buy *anything* and as you might notice there's plenty of us who love this kind of funding and community involvement. Of course you're entitled to your opinion but generally, when I see something I don't like or don't have interest in, it just doesn't get my money. this doesn't hurt you in any way, why the harsh response? rly, the interwebs....

I feel that AoW is one of the few smaller companies producing a quality line of mini's for fantasy at reasonable prices.
With GW's prices constantly going up and my income being pretty much static,these alternative mini's and games are exactly what i need.

Would LOVE to see AoW producing a whole Dwarf army, as I've had the basis of a tiny GW one for ever now, and it'd be nice to expand it with elites (that I won't buy from GW in Metal, or at eventual Goldsword pricing when/if they come out in plastic). And AoW are pretty much the only non-GW company that matches GW style.

BUT

I'm a bit confused by the listing. Are all the dwarfs in the "planned" category already funded and in development? OR are they what get covered by the initial 20,000?

And then the stuff with the $ amount next to it are stretch goals above and beyond that first $20k?

Either way - great news. Good to see AoW growing enough that they can start producing armies. (Which they were well enough on their way already, but this could speed it up quite a bit).

A good week for Kickstarters for the mini industry. I wonder if they all purposely planned it for a time when GW customers would be the most disgruntled? Cause that's really smart if they did.

I don't think it could be possibly "planned in advance" but it is certainly a good time to offer a quality alternative to GW!

Alpharius wrote:I don't think it could be possibly "planned in advance" but it is certainly a good time to offer a quality alternative to GW!

Why not? The GW summer price rise kicks in every year around June 1st.

I just read in the Farmer's Almanac "When GW prices do rise, it's time to plant your corn."

Not a dwarf fan (fine models though) but once you get to the ogres I'm all in!

I am gonna hold out for the bit, after pledging 200 already today on mantic and sedation and its gonna be a tight weekend cause these all hit at the same time.

If it gets closer at the end, I will probably be in though.

If I had any money to invest I would as your work is great. I do hope that you get the project off the ground as well as your army of the apocalypse, and at a better price than GW's regiments.
Please do not go down that road, your characters are about the same at the moment, but would love to see them in your warcast too for the cost.

Also any previews or anything on the rules to see if it is a system I as a gamer would play? When selling to gamers, show them it is something they would want, they will come to you

I'm seriously tempted to chip in on this.

You guys produce the best traditional fantasy dwarves on the market - bar none.

I wish AoW had waited a few weeks... My budget already went to some other company's kickstarter.

Dwarfs vs werewolves in the same month? My poor wallet!

Would be great to see sketches of the Living Ancestor before I throw my money into the ring. Would also like to see the crossbows, the wallet is sitting precariously on the fence at the moment.

Still weird that they plan a whole new Warcast Dwarven Army when their Warcast manufacturing capacity is not even capable to fill the current orders of just one kit for months, let alone produce enough for offering them to distributors.

Guess they would already have had enough money when they followed their 2 year old plan to release plastic Witch Elves, a market that Raging Heroes has now served with enormous success.

Perhaps they plan to use part of the investment to increase their Warcast production capactiy?

Still - I've noticed the AoW-gogo isn't exactly setting the world on fire. And I think you've touched on part of the problem - we have no timetable for any of this. The page already listed a half-dozen units in the "planed" stage - then there's a dozen more to raise funds for. Even if they get all the money - it's going to take ages for these to all come out.

Plus Indiegogo being not as popular, and people being tapped out from supporting Sedition Wars and Mantic (not to mention Ogre and Zombicide not all that long ago).

And I think TBH - the rewards are a little lacking. For a little over $40 you can order the current Warcast kits (with free shipping if you buy two or more). Yet the first reward level is $25 for 10 (plus $5 shipping), and it only gets slightly better from there.

Yeah, that's the problem for me- mikhaila actually carries the dwarf unit in his store (or did last time I was up there) and I don't think it cost more than doing this plus paying for shipping...

I really think they should have waited until their warcast issues were worked out... this would have tempted me!

But I agree that perhaps they were/are hoping to use this to buy a better machine to cast with... I don't think they're going to reach the goal, though. Better to deliver on the outstanding warcast orders, then do this again.

I sponsored -- I'd like to see more competitors to GW (other than just Mantic), and I love the style of the AOW dwarves.