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Just checking this one because it seems too good to be true. If my Big Mek hops in a Stompa, does it now count as obscured? I don't see any reason why not, but auto cover saves for ginormous walkers seems a bit too powerful.

Bludbaff wrote:Just checking this one because it seems too good to be true. If my Big Mek hops in a Stompa, does it now count as obscured? I don't see any reason why not, but auto cover saves for ginormous walkers seems a bit too powerful.

It sure does and and has a huge 6" bubble around it

I just did a battle report on it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UcMPFuslAU

Correct me if im wrong as i don't play much apoc, but dont super-heavy walkers have some rule saying its impossible for them to get a cover save?

Defiler37 wrote:Correct me if im wrong as i don't play much apoc, but dont super-heavy walkers have some rule saying its impossible for them to get a cover save?

Why is it our job to correct you! jk I don't know never seen it please give me a page number if you find it.

There isn't one.

It works just fine and is just as crazy as it sounds.

Venomthropes + Heirophant is one of my recent favorites, for similar reasons.

I'm going to have to throw a "No they can't" out here...

The rules for KFF state that vehicles count as obscured.
A Stomper is NOT a vehicle.

A truck is a vehicle:
Unit Type: Vehicle (Fast, Open-Topped)

A Stomper is not:
Unit Type: Super-heavy walker

So the KFF would have no effect on a stomper.

grendel083 wrote:I'm going to have to throw a "No they can't" out here...

The rules for KFF state that it vehicles count as obscured.
A Stomper is NOT a vehicle.

A truck is a vehicle:
Unit Type: Vehicle (Fast, Open-Topped)

A Stomper is not:
Unit Type: Super-heavy walker

So the KFF would have no effect on a stomper.

A super-heavy walker is a type of super-heavy vehicle and super-heavy vehicles follow all the rules for a normal vehicle except where noted otherwise (Apoc book, pg 92).

So yes, a super-heavy vehicle (including super-heavy walkers) do benefit from a KFF.

Two things:

1) the Super-Heavy walker rules are just a sub-section of the main Super-Heavy Vehicle rules in the apocalypse book, so they are still vehicles.

2) the Dred-mob apocalypse formation requires one of the walkers to carry a KFF (modified with a 12" range, but it's still a KFF) and that formation can specifically include Stompas.

Ah fair enough. I stand corrected.

Damn, part ninja'd by Yakface!

Not that it matters much, D strength weapons ignore cover.

juraigamer wrote:Not that it matters much, D strength weapons ignore cover.

Actually, they don't. D Weapons ignore models being obscured by cover. The KFF provides a cover save without the unit being obscured... so the D Weapon rule would have no effect on it.

And the KFF provides obscurement to vehicles, plus D weapons ignore cover against infantry in the same way.

juraigamer wrote:And the KFF provides obscurement to vehicles, ...

Actually, yes, it does.. Was mis-remembering the wording. Carry on

It's ok, I have only played 1 apoc battle in my life.

Str D weapons with ap 1 are freaking stupid good.

There aren't that many of those, though. Most destroyer weapons are AP2.

Now imagine a Great Gargant with a KFF.

You'd take an absolute age trying to get down the shields with cover saves on top.

It's not crazy, it's ork logic.

Come on people.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Jidmah wrote:There aren't that many of those, though. Most destroyer weapons are AP2.

Oh Mr. Manta~

Jidmah wrote:There aren't that many of those, though. Most destroyer weapons are AP2.

Oh Mr. Manta~

Just wanted to chime in adn say KFF is awesome. really really awesome!

juraigamer wrote:

Jidmah wrote:There aren't that many of those, though. Most destroyer weapons are AP2.

Oh Mr. Manta~

And much more beyond just that model. Too bad I need a car or I might have a manta of my own...

I wouldn't exactly use the most expensive model in the game as a measuring bar

You usually see warhound titans, stompas, bane blades and phantom titans (or equivalent) at apoc games, plus a few super-heavy fliers, like the Thunderhawk, Ork Bommer or a Lynx. Everything else is really fancy and rarely found in great numbers.

Plus, you have the battle formation, I believe it's the Dreadmob, that actually adds a KFF to models within a certain distance to 'the big dredd"

It's a mix of stompers, deffdreads, and units of killer kans. Biggest one gets the KFF.

grendel083 wrote:I'm going to have to throw a "No they can't" out here...

The rules for KFF state that vehicles count as obscured.
A Stomper is NOT a vehicle.

A truck is a vehicle:
Unit Type: Vehicle (Fast, Open-Topped)

A Stomper is not:
Unit Type: Super-heavy walker

So the KFF would have no effect on a stomper.

This

Disregard the above.

So lets see, it is not a vehicle, it is a super-heavy walker, which conveniently is a type of Super-heavy vehicle (per page 92 of the Apocalypse rulebook). Got it. It's a vehicle but not a vehicle...so Schrodinger's Vehicle?

thefarseerofnorthryde wrote:

grendel083 wrote:I'm going to have to throw a "No they can't" out here...

The rules for KFF state that vehicles count as obscured.
A Stomper is NOT a vehicle.

A truck is a vehicle:
Unit Type: Vehicle (Fast, Open-Topped)

A Stomper is not:
Unit Type: Super-heavy walker

So the KFF would have no effect on a stomper.

This

Super-Heavy is a vehicle type. End of story.

Yes I was proven wrong (I'm sure I mentioned that a couple of posts down).
Disregard my earlier (incorrect) comment.

Jidmah wrote:

juraigamer wrote:

Jidmah wrote:There aren't that many of those, though. Most destroyer weapons are AP2.

Oh Mr. Manta~

And much more beyond just that model. Too bad I need a car or I might have a manta of my own...

I wouldn't exactly use the most expensive model in the game as a measuring bar

You usually see warhound titans, stompas, bane blades and phantom titans (or equivalent) at apoc games, plus a few super-heavy fliers, like the Thunderhawk, Ork Bommer or a Lynx. Everything else is really fancy and rarely found in great numbers.

This is off subject, but I beleive the Imperator Titan is the most expensive model, in both points cost and money. (There is a third party company that makes it and I beleive its about $5,000)

I have yet to find any company that sells emperor titans, barring those who would build anything you want if the money is right.

Fine, give your Stompa a 4+ cover save I will use a similarly apoc-broken unit and charge my scarabs into it.

IIRC Entropic striek was not FAQd for super heavies so if they kill the rear armour once the whole thing wrecks.