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There's always some one complaining about and quitting some game on these forums, and that's not this post. This post is about the sharp decline in Warhammer FB players and traders. When I joined Dakka, there seemed to be a good amount of both fantasy and 40k players. It was easy for me to trade a fantasy army to 40k and back again on numerous occasions. Now, it seems like every trade is fantasy models looking for 40k. Has it always been this way and I was just fortunate in the past to find fair trades, or is there an exodus from WHFB? I personally am currently trying to trade 2 decent sized fantasy armies, and am even offering to sell them at half of retail and I'm having no luck (and these are mostly unpainted, some un-assembled models! I for one am not leaving fantasy, and am merelyy trying to part with some extra armies as I have settled in with my two favorite armies, but are a lot of people leaving the hobby? I'm just looking for some information. Thanks all

The sky is falling! The sky is falling!

Listen, right now, with a new (and apparently controversial) 40k release, the apparent drop in Fantasy is more likely due to an increase in 40k traffic. Let it settle down and you'll see.

Just a little action/reaction.

Action: 6th edition just hit. The starter set just hit.

Reaction: Stuff that worked in 5th edition doesn't now, so people are either dumping entire squads/armies, or picking up new weapons that work better now.

Action: The Chaos codex and the Horus Heresy IA book are both going to be hitting VERY soon.

Reaction: People are realizing that their either need money for these new toys or space for these new toys, and need to dump some of their existing toys.

After a few months, things will settle down. That, or people REALLY dislike playing 8th edition now.

8th edition completely killed Fantasy in my area. Tournament attendance went from 50+ to maybe 8 people on a good day.

I like Fantasy in principle, but 8th was a bit of a turn off for me. The rule changes seemed geared to selling models rather than creating an atmospheric game, magic got very silly and suddenly every army had to have big arse monsters.

I didn't like the background changes either i.e. everywhere is now chaotic to some extent - rivers of blood, magic trees etc etc. Made we wonder how they grow crops

I don't know - there's definitely a sharp spike in 40k buzz with the new edition and all, but I quit WHFB shortly after 8E hit and I know I'm not the only one, most of the people I used to play it with have dropped it too. I personally think there is a decline in overall WHFB activity, but it'd be almost impossible to really measure it with all the 40k excitement going on. I guess we'll see in a few months? It'll be easier to tell when there's a sizeable WHFB release.

Certainly in my area the number of people starting up or even continuing fantasy has been dropping since 8E, no idea how widespread that is though. Right now my GW has almost as many LotR players and considerably more specialist gamers.

Im a fantasy player who has just crossed over into 40k and im utterly blown away at how much better 40k is imo. Ive only gotten through about half of the 40k rule book so far and im already buying/building models, converting models, and using green stuff. Havent even played a game yet but i know its going to be better than fantasy. (or maybe im just bored with fantasy). The depth of 40k is astonishing and ive only scratched the surface. I agree with your point in trading fantasy for 40k. I think 40k has a better resale value and i think trades reflect that as well. It also could be 40k weather right now. New book new models new codeces on the borizon. Everybody is scrambling to get models increases the demand.

Personally I love the setting and miniatures for fantasy, I just don't like the game (I don't like big regiment blocks on the best day, and I'm not into the 8E ruleset at all) so my WHFB consumption is limited to the odd really nice mini for painting purposes and anything I pick up with the intention of making a Mordheim warband or stocking my WHQ dungeon with.

Ineedvc2500 wrote:
Im a fantasy player who has just crossed over into 40k and im utterly blown away at how much better 40k is imo. Ive only gotten through about half of the 40k rule book so far and im already buying/building models, converting models, and using green stuff. Havent even played a game yet but i know its going to be better than fantasy. (or maybe im just bored with fantasy). The depth of 40k is astonishing and ive only scratched the surface. I agree with your point in trading fantasy for 40k. I think 40k has a better resale value and i think trades reflect that as well. It also could be 40k weather right now. New book new models new codeces on the borizon. Everybody is scrambling to get models increases the demand.

I find this comment interesting, as several years ago I would expect almost the exact opposite of this comment, although 40k (at least locally) still seemed to be the dominant game in number of players, many felt that WHFB was the 'deeper' of the two in both setting and rules. I think this was, at the time, due to the quality of the rules and a feeling that the lists were both more balanced and more interesting. (At the time most WHFB army books had the 'core' list and then some sort of fun Appendix material to make a variant. For example, Lizardmen had the base list to represent the Slann-ruled ancient empires in the NotSouthAmerica region of the WHFB world, then had a list represent the variant more primitive lizardmen of the NotAfrica region. I think it was mainly that the 'Old World' list was buitl arount he tiny skinks while the 'New World' got the larger trooper lizardmen.

BOLS had a recent news article on GW's sales numbers. Fantasy is definitely sucking hind tit.

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2012/09/legalwatch-games-workshop-vs-chs.html

My FLGS dropped fantasy completly from the game lineup.
Not sure why, but alot of fantasy stuff finds its way into the bargain bins.

8th Definitely killed Fantasy in my area too. Funnily enough, while 8th edition Fantasy is the only one I've truly enjoyed playing, I really don't like 6th edition 40k (which has a LOT in common with 8th edition fantasy).

With others I've talked to about it where I live it's:

1. Price
2. 40K (since 6 ed. was released)
3. Playing something other than GW games

One thing which is notable is the specific aesthetic which GW uses for their fantasy figures is not terribly popular in the US (and Canada from what I have seen). Not sure when or where the split happened, but figures like the orcs, dwarves and goblins which seem to be fairly popular in the old world don't seem to get as much traction in the colonies.

Being a largely visual I am sure that that has a fair level of impact regarding the sales and level of activity. From my understanding, they are still fairly popular in the UK and Europe in general - though 40K is more so.

Fantasy is strong and growing 'round here. 40k, not so much.

i dont know about it becoming extinct but I just started playing fantasy with 2 other people (I'm high elves, another is skaven, and the third is Empire) after seeing a lot of people play it over the summer. I also noticed there were a lot of younger and newer players playing 40k making it seem more populous (even though it actually is) I also play 40k and my focus is mostly on 40k because. Another reason is, as stated above, 6th is out and they are dropping a lot of new swag so 40k will be the focus for a bit. But dont get me wrong Fantasy freaking rules.

Honestly I think it has to do with the fact that there are many more fantasy/medieval wargames out there that offer far better prices, for instance if I were to start playing fantasy/historical I would do one of the ones that has Roman's as a faction, which is probably another major detractor from the fantasy scene.

I have seen a distinct fall in fantasy players since the inception of 8th edition which is a real shame. I actually find 40k to be very boring and simple compared to a great game of fantasy. I have been trying very hard to get my friends to bring their fantasy armies out of their closets but its difficult.

I find 8E to be magic dependant etc like everyone else does but overall WHFB is a better gamiing system to me than 40k. Either 5E or 6E it dosent matter.

I wouldn't say WHFB is dying in my area rather remains the same. 40K is having its 25th anniversary year and is getting all the new shiney.

40K will wear down after a few months when people realize that "Cinematic" just means Poorly written rules like always,

WHFB can get really, really expensive. Moreso than 40k, in some cases.

Additionally, there was a lot of grumbling when 8th hit.

These two things, combined with the recent release of 6th ed, means that Fantasy is bound to take a hit.

While Fantasy has definitely taken a hit, I still think that it's quite popular, and is still well worth investing in and playing.

For a while, I stopped playing Fantasy a couple years ago, and barely looked at it when 8th came out, despite my friends who still played loving 8th. I played a few games with 8th, preferred it over 7th, and felt it went back to times of 5th edition, minus hero-hammer. But it still felt needlessly complicated. So I switched to 40k, having a bunch of friends who played that too, but in a different group.

Since then, most of my 40k buddies stopped playing, and my fantasy buddies picked up Dust Warfare instead of 40k, wanting a bit of a sci-fi aspect to try out. They found the game far superior in tactics, and attempted for weeks to get me to try it. Grudgingly, I accepted. I didn't think I'd like it, sticking to the "Warhammer is best" thought process. I was wrong-Dust is a much more enjoyable game than 40K, it doesn't lend itself to broken units, and you play what you like within the unit guidelines you pick, based on your command squads.

After starting this, I found out that my Fantasy buddies had become disinterested in GW's games entirely, largely based on prices and continuously over-complicated rules and how list-building won games, not tactics. I mentioned that I was getting the rulebook and a large quantity of models from Mantic due to their Kings of War kickstarter. My friends were willing to give it a try, in the attempt to search for a game with simpler rules that required tactics to win. Turns out, it only took one game of KoW to sell them on this game (being able to use any 28mm models helped make the sale too), and with a tight rule set, no ambiguous rules, no broken item combinations on units, simple rules with chess-like strategies, and the ability to play 3 games in a matter of a couple hours, our group decided that we were done with warhammer fantasy today. We'll keep the models we have for fantasy, but that's really only because we can use them for KoW.

I liked Fantasy, hell, I played it for over a decade at this point, so I feel I've been pretty damn invested in it (had 6000pts in Empire, Chaos Warriors and Orcs & Goblins EACH in that time period), but I'm finally coming to the realization there are other games out there. 40K didn't end fantasy for me, the other gaming companies did it for me. I recommend anyone try KoW if they are having the same complaints we did with fantasy.

Sadly my fantasy armies are sitting in the glass case, not being played.. The only battles they see now are dnd encounters lol..

There seems to be somewhat of a dichotomy between what one sees/reads and what people are reporting locally. I have heard and read much disgruntlement about Fantasy 8th Ed and how it has killed a particular local scene and not being played at someone's FLGS any more but then I ran a poll here on Dakka about people's favourite edition and 8th was by far and away voted the best. So, go figure. Like anything, I suspect people are extrapolating what their local Fantasy scene popularity is to a global level. Like anything, it will have pockets of popularity as well as pockets of unpopularity.

Officially speaking, I think recently Warmachine pushed Fantasy into third place in the league table of most played war games, in the USA at any rate.

Agreed, I would probably play Warmachine before I played Fantasy

6th edition 40k was the final nail in the coffin for 40k in my area. Ive only gotten 2 games of 6th since it was released.

This has lead to an influx of 40k players swapping over to WHFB however I am not sure if this because they didnt like the rule changes or simply because they decided to harden up and play a real game.

 Jubear wrote:
This has lead to an influx of 40k players swapping over to WHFB however I am not sure if this because they didnt like the rule changes or simply because they decided to harden up and play a real game.

I'm intrigued, tell me more about how Fantasy is a "real game" and 40k isn't.

A slew of long-time 40k players (myself included) started a fantasy escalation league near the beginning of the year. There is a lot of fantasy played at the store now.

Did anyone see this tidbit from the latest Chapterhouse case depositions?

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2012/09/legalwatch-games-workshop-vs-chs.html

Seems to indicate that a couple of years back, in the dying days of 7th edition, 40k was roughly twice as popular as WFB.

Whether 8th improved this situation or not, I'm not sure. I have heard conflicting reports and much seems to depend on your local scene.

8th ed killed fantasy. It was at its hight at 6th ed I think. 7th ed just nerfbatted magic but everything was more or less similar. 8th ed did a complete 180 while taking LSD and snorting cocaine from a warpstone covered table...

In my area, fantasy has never been strong. I have seen fantasy games played twice and talk of starting a fantasy group once (which went nowhere), in the 4ish years I have been going to my FLGS. I think one of those games was on the release of 8th edition, and I haven't seen a game since. The store still carries an extensive stock of fantasy, and it does seem to sell, so I guess in my area most of the fantasy people play at home.