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Can you focus fire with a barrage?

Since barrage applies hits to the unit, would you be able to force models in the open, rather than those under the blast to take the wounds?

-Matt

The second paragraph on pg 19 explains it.

Furthermore, I can't see anything that would prevent a Barrage weapon from Focus Firing indirectly (which is slightly bizzare, trying to pick on models, none of whom you can see).

This could lead to some unusual outcomes, like the blast marker landing on models in cover, but the wounds being allocated to models in the open, but I can't see that it violates any rules.

Can anyone confirm that?

The blast marker must be placed over a model you are Focus Firing on. If it scatters you generate hits as normal and you apply them to models that you were Focus Firing on.

Fragile wrote:
The blast marker must be placed over a model you are Focus Firing on. If it scatters you generate hits as normal and you apply them to models that you were Focus Firing on.

Right. But if you place the blast marker on the models in the open, it scatters to the ones in cover, wounds are allocated from the centre of the marker (in the middle of the models in cover) but only those out in the open get hit (in this scenario). Nothing wrong with this; just saying...

I meant barrage indirect focus firing. Seems very odd, but I can't find anything that disallows it.

I was kicking around the idea of running a pair of griffons, and using them to snipe. Primary blast aims for model in the open (with line of sight measured from the center of the blast), 2nd blast wracks up a lot of hits. New blast FAQ would say all wounds pull based off the first shot. With large strung out units, it gives a little more control on which way kills pull.

-Matt

I think you are confusing the application of focus fire, focus fire doesn't allow you to hit specific models... You mention a cover save before rolling to hit, you opponent can only attempt cover saves for the value selected or worse. In the case of barrage if it scatters you determine which models get cover saves from the center of the blast, which depending on the position of the cover it might vary from getting any model due to having a worst cover save that the one previously mentioned or giving cover to the whole unit making your shot useless.

removing the models would be worked from the center of the blast to the closest model that gets the cover save you declared on the focus fire, pretty much you just treat the marker as a unit shooting at the models but until that moment you can determine which models get cover save, sadly you should have declared focus fired before the scatter making it pretty hard to know which models would actually get which covers.

If the marker's center fall inside the unit they don't get cover saves unless they are standing on area terrain.

 Lord Yayula wrote:
I think you are confusing the application of focus fire, focus fire doesn't allow you to hit specific models... You mention a cover save before rolling to hit, you opponent can only attempt cover saves for the value selected or worse. In the case of barrage if it scatters you determine which models get cover saves from the center of the blast, which depending on the position of the cover it might vary from getting any model due to having a worst cover save that the one previously mentioned or giving cover to the whole unit making your shot useless.

removing the models would be worked from the center of the blast to the closest model that gets the cover save you declared on the focus fire, pretty much you just treat the marker as a unit shooting at the models but until that moment you can determine which models get cover save, sadly you should have declared focus fired before the scatter making it pretty hard to know which models would actually get which covers.

If the marker's center fall inside the unit they don't get cover saves unless they are standing on area terrain.

Re-rolls to hit from the griffon give pretty good odds of the shot coming down where I want it (~56% of the time).
The idea is to force saves on models in the open, and further from the center hole, rather than having hits go into models that are close and in cover.
The exact application would be to drop the primary template in the open, and walk the 2nd shot into a higher concentration of models in cover.

-Matt

HawaiiMatt wrote:
I meant barrage indirect focus firing. Seems very odd, but I can't find anything that disallows it.

I was kicking around the idea of running a pair of griffons, and using them to snipe. Primary blast aims for model in the open (with line of sight measured from the center of the blast), 2nd blast wracks up a lot of hits. New blast FAQ would say all wounds pull based off the first shot. With large strung out units, it gives a little more control on which way kills pull.

-Matt

Matt,

Which FAQ entry says all wounds pull off the first marker? The only FAQ I can find says to work out the total wounds hit by each template and proceed to allocate wounds as normal for the models hit by each separate template. If I've read it right, in your example above the primary blast wounds are allocated to models with a cover save worse than the FF declaration, measured from the middle of the primary blast marker. Ditto the 2nd blast, except the measure is from the 2nd marker - you still get to ignore models with a better cover save than the FF though. At least if I understood the scenario properly.

Another interesting twist on the FFing indirect...

Say you have 3 models in a target unit in the open, and 7 behind a wall (4+ save). You declare "FF no save" and target the 3 in the open. The shot scatters behind the wall. With indirect fire the save is relative to the centre of the blast marker, so the 3 models you aimed for now have a 4+ cover save (the wall is now between them and the blast), and the 7 behind the wall have no cover save.

p19 says that you work out which models can have Wounds allocated to them at the time the FF is declared (and goes on to discuss the situation of Going To Ground). In this case, at the time FF is declared you're not sure which models can have wounds allocated because you don't know where the blast will land.

I assume you simply defer until the scatter dice are rolled.