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 axisofentropy wrote:

 ZergSmasher wrote:
So, seeing the list that won the first heat of the Warhammer GT,.

where's this list?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Found it https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/10/16/the-grand-tournament-heat-1-the-roundup/

They must have a different meta out there. I don't think that would do so well at a major US event.

I'm not so sure. We already know the Guilliman Gunline is pretty nasty right now. This spreads the heavy weapons across 6 units that have to be killed to the last man to silence them. And 6 Razorbacks will do terrible, terrible things to hordes, especially with Bobby G giving them rerolls like that. Dark Angels don't get the benefits of Bobby G, but we can approximate them with Azrael + Primaris Lieutenant. When I go back to playing with my Dark Angels (probably next year since I'm currently working with my Chaos Marines/Death Guard) I do intend to give it a shot.

One thing we don't really know (unless I missed it somewhere) is what the other lists in that tournament were. If they were all fluffy lists rather than optimized competitive lists then we can conclude that this list is really not that good.

I do know the guy that won has a youtube channel and plays in a lot of tournaments. He's pretty good. I watched a report on a major even he went to towards the end of 7th and just barely missed making it to the final tables with Dark Elder which was not a great army then. IIRC it was in America to. One of the guys from Wobbly Models was in the report.

That being said, I'm not sure if the list was that good or he was. And like you said, if the other list are of the fluffy variety it could make a huge difference.

The biggest problem I see is trying to replicate it with Azzy just because everything needs to be in his bubble. I may be wrong but doesn't Bobby G let all smurfs reroll 1's and those within 6" reroll everything? For hits and wounds? I feel like that could make this list more viable for them over us just because they can spread everything out and still benefit where we are hamstrung to 6". Just my two cents though.

 ILegion wrote:
I do know the guy that won has a youtube channel and plays in a lot of tournaments. He's pretty good. I watched a report on a major even he went to towards the end of 7th and just barely missed making it to the final tables with Dark Elder which was not a great army then. IIRC it was in America to. One of the guys from Wobbly Models was in the report.

That being said, I'm not sure if the list was that good or he was. And like you said, if the other list are of the fluffy variety it could make a huge difference.

The biggest problem I see is trying to replicate it with Azzy just because everything needs to be in his bubble. I may be wrong but doesn't Bobby G let all smurfs reroll 1's and those within 6" reroll everything? For hits and wounds? I feel like that could make this list more viable for them over us just because they can spread everything out and still benefit where we are hamstrung to 6". Just my two cents though.

IIRC, he only lets friendly Ultramarine units within 6' of him re-roll all failed hit and wound rolls.

EDIT: Azrael lets you re-roll all failed hit rolls. The Lt. lets you re-roll wound rolls of 1.

 Red_Five wrote:

 ILegion wrote:
I do know the guy that won has a youtube channel and plays in a lot of tournaments. He's pretty good. I watched a report on a major even he went to towards the end of 7th and just barely missed making it to the final tables with Dark Elder which was not a great army then. IIRC it was in America to. One of the guys from Wobbly Models was in the report.

That being said, I'm not sure if the list was that good or he was. And like you said, if the other list are of the fluffy variety it could make a huge difference.

The biggest problem I see is trying to replicate it with Azzy just because everything needs to be in his bubble. I may be wrong but doesn't Bobby G let all smurfs reroll 1's and those within 6" reroll everything? For hits and wounds? I feel like that could make this list more viable for them over us just because they can spread everything out and still benefit where we are hamstrung to 6". Just my two cents though.

IIRC, he only lets friendly Ultramarine units within 6' of him re-roll all failed hit and wound rolls.

EDIT: Azrael lets you re-roll all failed hit rolls. The Lt. lets you re-roll wound rolls of 1.

Rowboat Girlyman also lets you reroll 1's to hit within 12" of him for any Imperium units, including but not limited to Ultramarines. It's part of why he's so friggin' powerful in Imperial Soup lists. I've even toyed with the idea of bringing Bobby G with my Dark Angels, but Azrael does a lot more for us, and if we need close combat power we can ally in Celestine.

Dark Angels codex before Christmas. We'll start a new tactics thread upon release.

Yup, I can't wait. I hope the Deathwing get some extras and some sort of count as troops, count as scoring units under certain circumstances, like maybe if Belial or HQ with term armor is chosen.

 axisofentropy wrote:
Dark Angels codex before Christmas. We'll start a new tactics thread upon release.

I saw that announcement and was like "SQUEEEEE!"

I sure hope we get the Lion, cheaper bikes and terminators (we know we'll get a price drop on fists), and better psychic powers. Another thing I'd like to have back is better overwatch. I miss our old 7th edition Grim Resolve.

I wouldn't expect terms or bikes as troops as this did not happen for Eldar for Iyanden or Saim Hann. I do wonder if there will be a chapter tactic for just Ravenwing or Deathwing.

I'm mainly looking forward to cheaper units, interesting strategems, and expanded psychic deck.

As for the Lion, I don't expect to see him which is a shame.

So I went ahead and bought an army before the codex came out. I got it all on ebay so it was pretty cheap. I got:

8 bikes
1 melta attack bike
1 lascannon fist dread
1 DV tac squad
2 DV DW termy squad
The DV characters
1 old metal captain
1 metal sammy bike
5 DW Knights
1 DW Command Squad

My goal for this army is painting and casual play. Anything you suggest to add?

 Egyptian Space Zombie wrote:
So I went ahead and bought an army before the codex came out. I got it all on ebay so it was pretty cheap. I got:

8 bikes
1 melta attack bike
1 lascannon fist dread
1 DV tac squad
2 DV DW termy squad
The DV characters
1 old metal captain
1 metal sammy bike
5 DW Knights
1 DW Command Squad

My goal for this army is painting and casual play. Anything you suggest to add?

Possibly one or more of the flyers, especially a Dark Talon. Those are pretty solid. Also, the special characters are pretty solid as well (Azrael especially, but the others are good too).

http://natfka.blogspot.gr/2017/11/rumors-dark-angels-leaks-and-codex.html?m=1

Damn just read through this new leak post. Whats your thoughts on this leak guys? I mean it seems way too powerful to be true. And Lion's abilities seem nuts.

Noneisbackhere wrote:
http://natfka.blogspot.gr/2017/11/rumors-dark-angels-leaks-and-codex.html?m=1

Damn just read through this new leak post. Whats your thoughts on this leak guys? I mean it seems way too powerful to be true. And Lion's abilities seem nuts.

Seems like bs, regain CP on a 4+, that too powerfull. I once played against guiliman but instead of warlords trait that returns cp on 5+ we played it as a 4+ and thats just crazy.
Other than this ability he seems ok, guilliman has the invul 3+ also, so its fine that lion also has it, giving rerols to unforgiven is actually crap, since those are only deathwing and some characters, but it fits with his personality since he had issues with trusting people

The blade master ability seems broken, that will be an insane amount of attacks.

firing overwatch at full BS for just 1 CP,or firing twice for 2cp, i'm not believing that

Noneisbackhere wrote:
http://natfka.blogspot.gr/2017/11/rumors-dark-angels-leaks-and-codex.html?m=1

Damn just read through this new leak post. Whats your thoughts on this leak guys? I mean it seems way too powerful to be true. And Lion's abilities seem nuts.

yeah the relic banners are too good to be true. they're good guesses tho.

Noneisbackhere wrote:
http://natfka.blogspot.gr/2017/11/rumors-dark-angels-leaks-and-codex.html?m=1

Damn just read through this new leak post. Whats your thoughts on this leak guys? I mean it seems way too powerful to be true. And Lion's abilities seem nuts.

Total nonsense and utterly fake IMHO

While I want to believe that leak, I know for a fact that it is WAY too powerful to be real. The relics are crazy, the Lion's abilities are way too good, and the stratagems are too good for the CP cost. That being said, it would be cool if the relic banners did in fact show up in the codex, in more realistic fashion of course. Maybe the Standard of Devastation could just grant rerolls to wound or something instead of double shooting. And it would be nice if we get the Lion and he's balanced well, not the undercosted craziness of Guilliman or Magnus.

Quick question about Biker Loadout:

Do they keep their bolt pistol if I add a special weapon (e.g. plasma gun)?

--> the index states, that they may "exchange" their pistol for a chainsword, but "take" a special weapon.
Does this mean, a bike keeps its pistol and gains a plasma gun resulting in 3 usable weapons? (5 Bolter shots and 2 plasma shots at 12'')

Aeri wrote:
Quick question about Biker Loadout:

Do they keep their bolt pistol if I add a special weapon (e.g. plasma gun)?

--> the index states, that they may "exchange" their pistol for a chainsword, but "take" a special weapon.
Does this mean, a bike keeps its pistol and gains a plasma gun resulting in 3 usable weapons? (5 Bolter shots and 2 plasma shots at 12'')

I believe they do keep the pistol, but you can't use a pistol in addition to other weapons in the shooting phase. Which is why I go with the chainsword on my bikers so that they aren't completely toothless in CC.

I thought you can now shoot every weapon on a model?!

Aeri wrote:
Quick question about Biker Loadout:

Do they keep their bolt pistol if I add a special weapon (e.g. plasma gun)?

--> the index states, that they may "exchange" their pistol for a chainsword, but "take" a special weapon.
Does this mean, a bike keeps its pistol and gains a plasma gun resulting in 3 usable weapons? (5 Bolter shots and 2 plasma shots at 12'')

yes they keep it but can't shoot pistols along with other weapons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Aeri wrote:
I thought you can now shoot every weapon on a model?!

check the pistols section of the 8 page basic rules

Trying to think of a different way to play my Dark Angels. This isn't really all that different but I have most the models so figured why not see if I can get more than the Primaris LT into my list. Thoughts?

Battalion
Ezekial
Librarian
Scout squad - 4 sniper rifles
Scout squad - 4 sniper rifles
Scout squad - 5 sniper rifles
Apothecary
4 x assaultbacks

Spearhead
Azreal
Primaris LT
Darkshroud
3 x 5 man hellblasters with plasma incinerators
Dark Talon

Pretty straight forward. Azzy, LT, Librarians, and Apoth walk forward with the hellblasters doing their thing. Figured the Dark Shroud can fly in circles advancing for jink save while providing the -1 hit bubble.. Scouts screen and assaultbacks do their thing. I know it isn't super competitive but do you think it'd be good enough to put up a fight at the FLGS?

Gonna play my first 8th edition tournament this weekend guys and this is the list i've came up with.

Battalion Detatchment:

HQ:
-Azrael
-Primaris Lt.

Troops:
-Scout Squad-5 sniper rifles, camo cloaks
-Tactical Sq- Plasma cannon, combi-plasma
-Tactical Sq-Missile Launcher

Elites:
-Culexus Assasin
-Deathwing Ancient- TH-SS
-Deathwing Knightsx5
-Reiver Squadx5

Fast Attack:
-Darkshroud

Heavy Support:
-Hellblaster squadx5-plasma incinerators
-Predator-Autocannon,2xLS,Hunter-missile
-Predator-TL,2xLS,SB

Flyer:
-Dark Talon

Whats your thoughts on the list guys? Tactic wise i'm using the Reivers and the knights for some Deepstrike objectives catch since in many games the Azrael bubble tact didnt help much cause of its low mobility. Im gonna use the Azzy for a small bubble alongside with Primaris Lt-predators-darkshroud and maybe culexus.Also some of the tactical for area denial, and the rest of the units for securing objectives.

I'd be worried you won't have enough of a screen to protect the gunline with what's in here right now. I usually use 3 units of scouts as the first line to use their scout move to block stuff out way up ahead then have a second line to screen behind them. I use assault razorbacks but something here would be good. As it stands your gunline would be pretty vulnerable to deep strike or someone doing something like casting warptime on a fast moving unit to get that unit into the thick of your guns pretty quickly.

And ymmv but I've found the only really effective way to run DW Knights is in a land raider, preferably a crusader. These guys are expensive so you want them in combat where they shine. Good chance that if you deep strike them they will fail the charge and just be kited around the rest of the game without ever doing much. And they are a rather an expensive unit just to use as an objective grabber.

1500 point tournament coming up. Thinking of running this list. Feel like it covers most threats. Went flamers as i had a few points i didn't know what to really do with....

Sammuel
5 ravenwing bikers, power sword, chainswords, flamer
5 ravenwing bikers, power sowrd, chainswords, flamer
4 black knights, melta bomb
4 black knights, melta bomb
4 black knights, melta bomb
Darkshroud, assault cannon
Nephilim, twin lascannon

Let us know how this works please! I want to know how a pure ravenwing army does.

Some thoughts:
Could you replace the assault cannon with a heavy bolter? It's cheaper and you'll probably be moving this a lot to keep up with the Black Knights and Sammy so it'll kind of a waste to pay 20 points for an assault cannon that will be hitting on 4+. Besides, you really want this for the -1 to hit. No need putting more points into it.

By dropping the assault cannon and flamers you should be able to stick 2 plasma guns in a bike squad. They'd probably be a lot more useful.

 ILegion wrote:
Let us know how this works please! I want to know how a pure ravenwing army does.

Some thoughts:
Could you replace the assault cannon with a heavy bolter? It's cheaper and you'll probably be moving this a lot to keep up with the Black Knights and Sammy so it'll kind of a waste to pay 20 points for an assault cannon that will be hitting on 4+. Besides, you really want this for the -1 to hit. No need putting more points into it.

By dropping the assault cannon and flamers you should be able to stick 2 plasma guns in a bike squad. They'd probably be a lot more useful.

Hmm.. true. I had some concerns with how often we are seeing armored company lists. Perhaps adding meltaguns to the bikers would be a good way to help mitigate that threat. I know for sure, dropping the assault cannon, i can toss a melta into each squad. maybe 2 into each.

Something else to consider. You can also move and advance the Dark Shroud in circles. They tend to be targeted pretty early so a jink save wouldn't hurt.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I say in circles so you can keep that bubble where it's needy. Just have to be smart with how you move it so it doesn't get charged and stuff.

Righto peeps, new to playing DA and somehow I've ended up with four (yes four) lots of the Dark Vengeance Dark Angel lots

Given whats in there, and a small budget to add to it, how would you recommend creating a 1k and 1250pts list to get me started?

 Tooooon wrote:
Righto peeps, new to playing DA and somehow I've ended up with four (yes four) lots of the Dark Vengeance Dark Angel lots

Given whats in there, and a small budget to add to it, how would you recommend creating a 1k and 1250pts list to get me started?

To start with, convert one of the Company Masters to be Azrael. He's very key for Dark Angels right now. If you want to run a Battalion, take three of the tac squads, perhaps keep at least a couple of them at 10 men and put them near Azzy for the rerolls to hit. Take a Libby as your second HQ (maybe even convert one into Ezekiel or at least proxy until you can come up with the actual model).

Here's a possible list at 1k:

This list would be a good starter since all it needs is the models from the Dark Vengeance sets, with perhaps some very basic conversion work to turn a CM into Azrael. Alternatively, if you don't feel like running Azzy, you could just run him as a standard CM with combi-plasma and power sword, drop the 2 extra tacs from the third squad, and put in a Razorback (if you can get one). Not super competitive, but a nice starter force. To take it to 1250, just throw in one of the Deathwing squads.

Honestly, with 4 sets of DV, you are off to a great start. I'd look for some extra special weapons to swap for the ones the models come with (some cutting will be required), although plasma is certainly good in this edition. Definitely pick up a Razorback or five, and Dreadnoughts aren't a bad buy either. Heck, get the Primaris half of Dark Imperium and that'll give you some different options, although you may not want Primaris guys right away.

https://spikeybits.com/2017/11/rumor-lion-returns-dark-angels-codex-content.html

WTF,
Lion El' Jonson, comparable with Girlyman, DS less than 9" if Ravenwing nearby, shoot twice, charge +3" for rolls... CP expensive, but man that should be devastating. This compared to BA codex leaks are way better than what we have heard for BA counterparts getting.

Xirax wrote:
https://spikeybits.com/2017/11/rumor-lion-returns-dark-angels-codex-content.html

WTF,
Lion El' Jonson, comparable with Girlyman, DS less than 9" if Ravenwing nearby, shoot twice, charge +3" for rolls... CP expensive, but man that should be devastating. This compared to BA codex leaks are way better than what we have heard for BA counterparts getting.

This one has long since been shown to be complete crap. As much as we all wish the Lion would be there and be as good as Bobby G, I don't think he's even going to be in the codex. If we get him at all, he'll be later in a campaign book or something. I actually heard a rumor that GW said there would be no more loyalist Primarchs coming back, only a few more Daemon ones (probably Fulgrim next). I hope it isn't true, as I want a cool model of The Lion!