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Grunted wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:


Here's comparing the two normal AoS humans to a bloodreaver. Note how even within the context of only AoS releases how fething big those guys are; they are not at all meant to be normal human size. This is what leads to the "scale creep" myth; misinformed comparisons of base humans to minis which are very much not.

They're basically the same size my man, the difference in their height is bordering on negligible.

And as a counter point to the argument, I present a comparasion of the new Lumineth Spearmen to the old High Elf Spearman. Rather clearly one can notice, that one is noticeably bigger, nearly a head taller whilst not standing up straight, and significantly bulkier.

Certainly won't catch me making the same argument in regards to elfs or dwarfs. I'm with you on that one.

I wouldn't even say AoS is 28mm, '28mm heroic' is the marketing lingo but really it is more like a 30mm scale. I only point out that is where WHFB was too; the (human) scale has remained largely consistent from 7th edition WHFB to now. But there was absolutely scale creep over the time of WHFB.

What has really happened in AoS is miniatures 'speading out' to make use of the space the larger bases & skirmish formations afford them. WHFB minis had to stay in their box, though obviously a growing number of kits struggled to do that, and what I expect out of TOW is larger base sizes on average with only some particularly small units at 20mm square.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Grunted wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Cool story with the warcry midgets, not sure why they count but my examples didn't. Speaking of picking and choosing, here are to my knowledge the only two humans ever actually released under AoS proper.

None of the models in your image were actually released for AoS, and it is an extremely dishonest comparison. If your point had merit you wouldn't be afraid to compare analogous minis with similar poses and no basing boosting their height. Every Warcry warband has been released for AoS proper as well, showing further lack of knowledge as to the product line. The entire premise and drive of your argument is to prove a point, not to actually figure out what is true.

In turn, if your point had merit, you wouldn't simply ignore my own personal argument. But clearly, you must know that.

I don't type at light speed mate...

My apologies, I was under the impression that you weren't going to respond to it, as you've already made your post.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:



I think Chaos Dwarves were well and truly dead long before 8th, I'd bet we see Codex Squats before we see the return of Chaos Dwarves.

I dunno. They have been heavily hinted as the first DLC race for Total Warhammer 3. That could lead to them being resurrected, just like it led to Cathay/Kislev being a thing.

Schmapdi wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:



I think Chaos Dwarves were well and truly dead long before 8th, I'd bet we see Codex Squats before we see the return of Chaos Dwarves.

I dunno. They have been heavily hinted as the first DLC race for Total Warhammer 3. That could lead to them being resurrected, just like it led to Cathay/Kislev being a thing.

There's actually voice files for them in the game that were datamined, so they're 100% coming (to TW at least).

Be careful though. Games can be full of bits of content made for things that never appear. Diablo 1 and 2 had bits of expansions for characters/classes that never got finished and put into the game.

So sometimes data-mining the game and such can turn up some interesting bits of development that were shelved or planned and never developed or which were done possibly as an experiment or just for fun and just left in there.

There's a loading screen quote which explicitly states they are coming. We've also had more than a few pieces of evidence and hints that they will get a battletome in 3rd. Big question is will those kits (if they are indeed on their way) be made to do double-duty for TOW?

Legion of Azgorh was also a playable army in 8th, though admittedly a practical impossibility for most given the limited all-FW roster.

Plus the Dark Lands are on the map, are huge, and are also empty.

It's one thing to have a bit of coding for extra characters in Diablo (I remember them!), it's another to go to the expense of paying voice actors to record lines.

Schmapdi wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:



I think Chaos Dwarves were well and truly dead long before 8th, I'd bet we see Codex Squats before we see the return of Chaos Dwarves.

I dunno. They have been heavily hinted as the first DLC race for Total Warhammer 3. That could lead to them being resurrected, just like it led to Cathay/Kislev being a thing.

There's also hint of legions of Hashut worshipping duardins this year. Sounds a lot like new force coming to AoS later...

As is we got squats in 40k already so time for CD They might not look at all like chaos dwarves of old and be more like fat humans in look much like votann are just bulky humans in 40k but they will still be called chaos dwarves.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Plus the Dark Lands are on the map, are huge, and are also empty.

It's one thing to have a bit of coding for extra characters in Diablo (I remember them!), it's another to go to the expense of paying voice actors to record lines.

It's worth considering GW's involvement as well. We know from Kislev and Cathay that GW does the groundwork on design, so you don't just have the cost of voice work for Creative Assembly, they'd expect to get something workable from GW before they ever shell out for it. And if GW did all that work, what are the odds they'd have second thoughts later on?

tneva82 wrote:

Schmapdi wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:



I think Chaos Dwarves were well and truly dead long before 8th, I'd bet we see Codex Squats before we see the return of Chaos Dwarves.

I dunno. They have been heavily hinted as the first DLC race for Total Warhammer 3. That could lead to them being resurrected, just like it led to Cathay/Kislev being a thing.

There's also hint of legions of Hashut worshipping duardins this year. Sounds a lot like new force coming to AoS later...

As is we got squats in 40k already so time for CD They might not look at all like chaos dwarves of old and be more like fat humans in look much like votann are just bulky humans in 40k but they will still be called chaos dwarves.

To be fair, in case of GW's space dwarfs they are established to be abhumans rather than a completely removed species. GW is somewhat justified to give that a nod by making them look more like humans.

And we already have Fyrslyrs, Kharadron and at least one Warcry Chaos Dwarf, so it's not like GW doesn't have a template to follow.

Looking at the Kharadron on the last page though, GW might struggle to put embiggened dwarfs on 20mm bases. They kind of managed with Longbeards and Ironbreakers, but those aren't all that fresh anymore and I expect the basing issue to have far more potential for unforeseen change than the exact shape of any new dwarf. We still don't have a clue what kind of basing The Old World is going to have.

*wrong post*

Sir you said "Fyrslyrs" then it is actually "Dyreblood Skullfyreslyres (tm)"!

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Sir you said "Fyrslyrs" then it is actually "Dyreblood Skullfyreslyres (tm)"!

As random as this place is to remark on it, I have every reason to feel half vindicated. Since GW started translating names again, which must be a rather recent development, the Fyr part is canonical in the German version.

NuGW is not a lie, people! They're listening. Unfortunately for all of you, they're listening to me!

I'm not sure the last image disproves scale creep. but maybe points to GW being erratic in their own scale. The recent Vampire underworlds crew being the most blatant. Which is a shame considering the models are amazing.





I couldn't find the picture of these vamps compared to Vlad, but they tower over him.

Is that scalecreep or are AoS Vampires just Big?

The vampires generally have been described as not easy to recognize passing off as humans so...

 Rihgu wrote:
Is that scalecreep or are AoS Vampires just Big?

Do AoS vampires still have to conceal themselves amongst the population? Seems like being a literal giant would be a bit detrimental to that.

Looks more like wrong scaled.

The size difference of the new Vampires is real (and stupid), but it's worth pointing out that because of the way the advancing Vampire Counts skeletons are posed, this may be the single worst possible angle to take a photo as it makes the skeleton look smaller than it is. The scale issue exists, but these photos aren't fit to represent it in a meaningful way.

Grail Seeker wrote:
I'm not sure the last image disproves scale creep. but maybe points to GW being erratic in their own scale. The recent Vampire underworlds crew being the most blatant. Which is a shame considering the models are amazing.





I couldn't find the picture of these vamps compared to Vlad, but they tower over him.

So the new Vampires are like Primarchs in a size comparison to their Undead grunts?

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

 Rihgu wrote:
Is that scalecreep or are AoS Vampires just Big?

Do AoS vampires still have to conceal themselves amongst the population? Seems like being a literal giant would be a bit detrimental to that.

AoS vampires don't have to hide at all. It is actually kind of strange that there are secret witch and vampire hunters when there are whole cities and kingdoms run by Vampires openly in the Realm of the Dead. Vampires in AoS stride out in the open and whilst there likely are those that live in secret within Cities of Sigmar and the like; the core of the faction are able to live, feed, operate and exist pretty freely.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Sir you said "Fyrslyrs" then it is actually "Dyreblood Skullfyreslyres (tm)"!

I still use the term 'Vampire Counts', even in the Age of Sigmar. Some of their faction names are just dumb and only exist for (TM) purposes. And don't get me started on the blasted High Elves.

 Manfred von Drakken wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Sir you said "Fyrslyrs" then it is actually "Dyreblood Skullfyreslyres (tm)"!

I still use the term 'Vampire Counts', even in the Age of Sigmar. Some of their faction names are just dumb and only exist for (TM) purposes. And don't get me started on the blasted High Elves.

This is pretty funny to me because it brings to mind people referring to cars as "horseless carriages" and to some extent out of touch parents who refer to every game console as a Playstation. I mean, you'll probably be right in The Old World but referring to the Age of Sigmar armies incorrectly isn't necessarily something to wear as a badge of pride. The people who never experienced anything but the Soulblight Gravelords will be like "??? okay ???"

 Rihgu wrote:
to some extent out of touch parents who refer to every game console as a Playstation

Still more in touch than the ones that still refer to everything as a Nintendo.

I started playing after Age of Sigmar was a thing, but I feel like a boomer when I read the Age of Sigmar names and just sigh.

Grail Seeker wrote:
I'm not sure the last image disproves scale creep. but maybe points to GW being erratic in their own scale. The recent Vampire underworlds crew being the most blatant. Which is a shame considering the models are amazing.

Spoiler:

I couldn't find the picture of these vamps compared to Vlad, but they tower over him.

Resident Evil 8 has told me that's just how tall vampires are.

 Shakalooloo wrote:
Resident Evil 8 has told me that's just how tall vampires are.

Now if only GW would also replicate that booty.

 Rihgu wrote:

 Manfred von Drakken wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Sir you said "Fyrslyrs" then it is actually "Dyreblood Skullfyreslyres (tm)"!

I still use the term 'Vampire Counts', even in the Age of Sigmar. Some of their faction names are just dumb and only exist for (TM) purposes. And don't get me started on the blasted High Elves.

This is pretty funny to me because it brings to mind people referring to cars as "horseless carriages" and to some extent out of touch parents who refer to every game console as a Playstation. I mean, you'll probably be right in The Old World but referring to the Age of Sigmar armies incorrectly isn't necessarily something to wear as a badge of pride. The people who never experienced anything but the Soulblight Gravelords will be like "??? okay ???"

I just think Soulblight Gravelords is a dumb name and I refuse to use it. I also still use the terms dwarf, elf, giant, orc, troll, ogre, minotaur, etc... because their New Names (TM) are dumb, too.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Rihgu wrote:
to some extent out of touch parents who refer to every game console as a Playstation

Still more in touch than the ones that still refer to everything as a Nintendo.

You kids and your nintendos. We had our Atari and the snotty neighbors had ColecoVision.

Sasorijap wrote:
So i have new information regarding the Old World for anyone interested.

I heard about this from a Mantic employee that was previously working in GW (both UK companies) I don't know the guy that well so take it with a grain of salt.

Apparently the main reason GW is bringing back Fantasy is to hurt Kings of War and Conquest. Their thinking is "if it hurts their sales good if it doesn't oh well we made a few extra quid".

Sounds like a perfectly GW thing to do.

 Geifer wrote:
The size difference of the new Vampires is real (and stupid), but it's worth pointing out that because of the way the advancing Vampire Counts skeletons are posed, this may be the single worst possible angle to take a photo as it makes the skeleton look smaller than it is. The scale issue exists, but these photos aren't fit to represent it in a meaningful way.

Maybe an old Warhammer GW Vampire vs a nuGW vampire then...