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Like the title says. Can the dance that reduces the movement distance of an enemy be used against FMCs within 12" to shrink their movement and thereby force them to stop swooping?

No reason it should not effect FMC while flying..

But if the controlling player of the FMC chooses to keep flying the game breaks I guess.

Since they 'must move at least 12 inches'. And unlike vehicle flyers they don't crash if forced to move less. If they can even move less.

I don't know how Masque's rule is worded, dose it reduce it to a flat distance, or dose it reduce the range it can move? If it only reduces the range that it moves, it can move up to 24" base.

Edit: If he FMC can't move at least 12" I would play it as it couldn't swoop that turn.

"and can only move, run, charge and fall-back D3 inches"

The choice whether to Glide or Swoop has no requirements, it's only when you want to actually Swoop that the rules have exceptions/requirements.

It would certainly stop you electing to Swoop, as you cannot fulfil the requirements to do so.

The choice to swoop or glide has no requirements. ("Changing Flight Mode, 1st paragraph pg 49).

The actual move has, however. And in that case you have 2 conflicting requirements (must move at least 12", can only move D3".

Do the requirements of the one pertain to the other? Codex > Rulebook in this case then? I.e. you swoop D3 inches.

If you dont move 12" min, you cannot swoop (its worded similarly to "a swooping MC.." - if you dont fulfill the distance you are not a swooping MC)

So if I understand people correct then

if I use the dance then the FMC is still flying until the start of his movement phase where he is forced to not choose swooping since a requirement for swooping is to move at least 12"

ok?

For me this would make masque very very valuable, because she could force enemy flyers to go around her 12" range or else they can be stranded in the open field for one turn walking at most 6" (move+run) to security or else it will be hammered with everything my army have

The masque would be valuable if she could join a squad. As she is not an IC though, and she can be easily KOd by overly strong sneezes, she is not nearly so valuable. Her special abilities are cool and shiny, but they are wasted on a package that might be killed by a paper airplane thrown too hard at her. She is literally to fragile to be valuable.

All my opinion of course.

I guess no-one would grimore her for a rerollable 3++ save?
thats pretty strong


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean, also if you fail to grimore her, its not like failing with your flesh hounds killing them all of

if you fail then you might lose 75p, if you pull it off, she could just stand in the open and dance hoping some units shoot on her instead of your troops

Since the ability also has no roll to hit, I would check and agree with the people your playing with as to if a FMC which is already swooping can be targeted.

Given it isnt an attack (no damage is caused) hard to hit does not apply

SlyasR wrote:
I guess no-one would grimore her for a rerollable 3++ save?
thats pretty strong


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean, also if you fail to grimore her, its not like failing with your flesh hounds killing them all of

if you fail then you might lose 75p, if you pull it off, she could just stand in the open and dance hoping some units shoot on her instead of your troops

Even with a grimoirred 3++, her low toughness and only two wounds means that the average marine troop squad of ten will kill her in a single round almost every time, and grimoiring her would mean you aren't grimoring something like fateweaver, a seeker squad, a hound squad or the like. And 75 points is a lot to waste. I can think of many better ways to spend them that won't keel over dead at the first strongly worded complaint.

cryhavok wrote:

SlyasR wrote:
I guess no-one would grimore her for a rerollable 3++ save?
thats pretty strong


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean, also if you fail to grimore her, its not like failing with your flesh hounds killing them all of

if you fail then you might lose 75p, if you pull it off, she could just stand in the open and dance hoping some units shoot on her instead of your troops

Even with a grimoirred 3++, her low toughness and only two wounds means that the average marine troop squad of ten will kill her in a single round almost every time, and grimoiring her would mean you aren't grimoring something like fateweaver, a seeker squad, a hound squad or the like. And 75 points is a lot to waste. I can think of many better ways to spend them that won't keel over dead at the first strongly worded complaint.

excuse me but she takes 1 wound from a marine squad of shooting

10 marines with bolters = 20 BS4 S4 shots
will inflict in average 13,33 hits
with our T3 this will inflict 8,88 wounds
with a 3++ save we take 2,96 wounds
but with a rerollable 3++ we only take 0,987 wounds in average

but in your defence say you had grimored 20 deamonettes, then you would have lost 3 of them and that's actually not a lot of points for a full shoot out.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Given it isnt an attack (no damage is caused) hard to hit does not apply

Wasnt it FAQ'd that 'hard to hit' still applies if the power needs to roll to hit?

The only way I would use the masque would be if:
A- it was a 500 pt or less game

Or

B- I deemed it worthwhile to spend 75 points and an HQ slot on the ability to disrupt one target for one turn, and redirect fire/cc from a second less important target for one turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SlyasR wrote:

cryhavok wrote:

SlyasR wrote:
I guess no-one would grimore her for a rerollable 3++ save?
thats pretty strong


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean, also if you fail to grimore her, its not like failing with your flesh hounds killing them all of

if you fail then you might lose 75p, if you pull it off, she could just stand in the open and dance hoping some units shoot on her instead of your troops

Even with a grimoirred 3++, her low toughness and only two wounds means that the average marine troop squad of ten will kill her in a single round almost every time, and grimoiring her would mean you aren't grimoring something like fateweaver, a seeker squad, a hound squad or the like. And 75 points is a lot to waste. I can think of many better ways to spend them that won't keel over dead at the first strongly worded complaint.

excuse me but she takes 1 wound from a marine squad of shooting

10 marines with bolters = 20 BS4 S4 shots
will inflict in average 13,33 hits
with our T3 this will inflict 8,88 wounds
with a 3++ save we take 2,96 wounds
but with a rerollable 3++ we only take 0,987 wounds in average

but in your defence say you had grimored 20 deamonettes, then you would have lost 3 of them and that's actually not a lot of points for a full shoot out.

To be honest I have never mathhammered it. What I have done is used her in over a dozen games and never once seen her last through one round of a squad shooting at her unless it was IG flashlights. I will also admit though that I've only gimoired her twice. In my experience grimoiring her IS a failure to gimoire something important, and if you're enemy is thinking straight, they will see this. (Tried to say that earlier, but wasnt sure if it came out right).

I did also say in my first post that it was just my opinion.

I am fairly certain the FAQ version of hard to hit would pertain to the mask.

Not necessarily, look at the ruling for Imotekh to see about "All abilities".

 Mythra wrote:
I am fairly certain the FAQ version of hard to hit would pertain to the mask.

You mean the FAQ entry that specifically applies to weapons?

 HerbaciousT wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Given it isnt an attack (no damage is caused) hard to hit does not apply

Wasnt it FAQ'd that 'hard to hit' still applies if the power needs to roll to hit?

I understand where you are coming from nosf, just I know there is devided opinion on what constitutes an attack.


I thought I would mention it as there was a thread a short while ago, while this was spercifically around if Maledictions can hit SMC's or Z Flyers the dicsussion was centered around what it meant to be an 'attack' and 'weapon'. as the FAQ states

Therefore, any attacks that use
blast markers, templates, create a line of/area of effect or
otherwise don’troll to hit cannot target them

Probably do not want to get into that in this thread, but from the lasts it was a devided opinion so thought worth mentioning to check with players before basing a list around those tactics.