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So essentially I want to get a thread started of space wolves vs space marines. Mainly ultramarines. I have been planning to start my ultramarine army for a while now and I am loving the new book I see so many different choices. I am roughly at a 1000 point list and I like have a lot of power armored guys so tacs and dev squads. But rereading the space wolves codex, do they really do it better? Grey hunters just seem to have everything going for them. They can even take a power fist that can not be challenged out. AND two special guns. Maybe I need to see more into both codices as I am very new to marines in general. I guess what I want is to be told how my ultramarines can stand to space wolves? But at the same time I half consider using my blue ultramarines as space wolves. Not too sure yet just looking for some opinions and guidance .

Ultramarines do just fine. The Chapter Tactics doctrines let them really outperform Space Wolves in tactical situations and you can get more firepower into an Ultramarine list from the choices Space Wolves don't have (TFC, Storm Talon, Centurions).

the ultramarine doctrines are very useful but I find that my greyhunters are one of the best troop choices ever, having a bolt pistol and close combat weapon (+ 1 attack right there) and having counter attack. you get thirty attacks on the charge (not including mark of the wulfen, which youd still get plus one to anyways) and thirty when being charged (provided you pass your LD roll)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I just realised that i didnt answer your question as such. Your ultramarines have there chapter doctrine which is very useful where as space wolves are very assault orientated, so why dont you takr a space wolves allied detachment? Use your ultramarines as your primary choice, then take an allied detachment of wolves, take a battle leader or wolf preist as a hq (wolf preist is ready made with his 4+ invun and his preferred enemy)
Then take a squad of blood claws (whopping 40 attacks from ten there) with said preist who now gives them preferred enemy against what you choose (infantry is always safe).
Your safe with the range of your usual SM codex and you can now have a good punch from the SW too. And they class as battle brothers to boot.

@OP: Yes, Grey Hunters are better. The only thing they don't have going for them is that they can't take heavy weapons like a Tac squad, lack a built in sgt. (which you pointed out as a strength, but also hinders them in ways [such as if you add a WGPL, they can't fit in a rhino or to fit them in with the WGPL you lose the free special weapon)], and they miss out on chapter tactics. However they gain +1A in CC and counter attack as well as extensive options of wargear that make up for their losses (Wolf standard,MoTW, and 2 special weapons).

And here is the best selling point, they gain all that for 2 extra points.

I have been struggling with making Space Wolves work in 6th ed, and I have concluded that they need allies to compete. I have been looking at allying Space Wolves with Space Marines to aid their strengths. They C:SM detachment looks like a captain, two tac squads w/ flakk in razors, stormtalon and a thunderfire. While the SW have RP, 3 GH squads in Rhinos, one squad of LFs, and an aegis Haven't tested it yet, and would love thoughts on it.