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Hi there

I have a group of friends who are just starting out with the table top game (although they all know more about the game than me; they have played dawn of war and know a lot of the games backstory etc.)

I've been helping them paint and assemble their models and their board and I'm not so sure about the game itself yet, but I'd really like to get into the model painting.
The races they play are space marines, chaos space marines and necrons and we have another friend who might be joining us with dark angels(?)

The reason I'm turned away by the idea really is the cost of it. The models and codex, etc. We share our resources like glue and paints, and we buy a majority of our models second hand and strip them, but still. It's my boyfriend who's roped me in and I just am not sure if I'd actually enjoy the game as much as assembling the models, as I know so little.

Race wise anyway, I really love the tyranids. They are very cool. They're the thing I saw in the model shop and went 'wow!' at. I also quite like the space wolves, and the dark eldar.
The orks look like their play style is very fun too though.

I was just going to get some second hand tyranids to strip and paint for fun but it seems like you need a lot of them, and it seems like they have a hard learning curve. (I picked up dota 2 quickly enough so even though they are nothing alike lol I presume with my friends help I could learn)
I don't really want space marines.

TLR what race should I start out with for 40k, keeping in mind the cost, difficulty and friends I have already playing?
Is it worth even picking up or should I just paint the models for fun?

Thanks <3

Welcome to dakka dakka. There is no cheap army really. I'd just paint what you like. And buy online for a discount.

Tyranids are arguably the worst army to play right now - huge number of minis needed to play, which in turn costs a lot of money, and a lot of assembling and painting effort. It'll take years to finish. Or you can go down the route of lots of big monstrous creatures, which is cheaper faster and looks cooler.

However, as mentioned before, Nids are the worst because they got bent over and taken advantage of for the past couple years - their army book (codex) has been getting more underwhelming with every update and the main rules itself have made life harder for them.

If you are looking to save money, buy Grey Knights. An elite army that consists of very few models, but very powerful ones that are excellent jack of all trades. It wont cost much to field an army (1 box of 5 grey knight terminators, 1 box of 5 grey knights, 1 inquisitor, 1 vindicare assassin and 1 dreadknight is all you need for a 750 point army) and they have some really cool background and look awesome.

Remember - 40k isnt about winning. It is about collecting, assembling, painting, reading the background, admiring the artwork, creating an armylist, and playing the game and having fun with your friends over a nice battlefield.

oh and buy your stuff from discount stores like waylandgames instead of gw direct

Hello, welcome to dakka. 40k is expensive yes but it's something you'd never leave even after you have said "I'm done with this game". I know a lot of people who leave but will always come back to buy their respective army's models every time a new release comes out. There isn't really a logic as to why but 40k is sort of like a drug TBH.

Anywho, tyranids are generally coming back from being less than great due to 7th edition. Bear in mind that if you play tyranids, you won't get any allies ( Ie: you cannot use your friend's models and such in your own army ) since tyranids are hungry hungry bugs that eat everything that isn't a tyranid.

Most races would have a similar learning curve relative to each other but honestly, if you like an army, play it. You will not regret it even if you lose or win since you are going to have genuine fun with your army. Start off playing non-competitive friendlies first to get your feet grounded then move on to building a list that has a 50% win rate at least ( this is just so that you don't get bored of getting stomped every game ) but I wouldn't recommend a WAAC type netlist ( go figure why ).

All in all, 40k is a great hobby to get into but remember that the game isn't really what 40k is about. In our group, 60% of it is the list building, fluff writing and generally storytelling of the 40k universe, 30% is the painting and converting and maybe 10% is actually playing.

Have fun

meaples wrote:
Anywho, tyranids are generally coming back from being less than great due to 7th edition. Bear in mind that if you play tyranids, you won't get any allies ( Ie: you cannot use your friend's models and such in your own army ) since tyranids are hungry hungry bugs that eat everything that isn't a tyranid.

you seriously need to catch up on 7th edition rumors and news, dude.

meaples wrote:
Hello, welcome to dakka. 40k is expensive yes but it's something you'd never leave even after you have said "I'm done with this game". I know a lot of people who leave but will always come back to buy their respective army's models every time a new release comes out. There isn't really a logic as to why but 40k is sort of like a drug TBH.

Anywho, tyranids are generally coming back from being less than great due to 7th edition. Bear in mind that if you play tyranids, you won't get any allies ( Ie: you cannot use your friend's models and such in your own army ) since tyranids are hungry hungry bugs that eat everything that isn't a tyranid.

Most races would have a similar learning curve relative to each other but honestly, if you like an army, play it. You will not regret it even if you lose or win since you are going to have genuine fun with your army. Start off playing non-competitive friendlies first to get your feet grounded then move on to building a list that has a 50% win rate at least ( this is just so that you don't get bored of getting stomped every game ) but I wouldn't recommend a WAAC type netlist ( go figure why ).

All in all, 40k is a great hobby to get into but remember that the game isn't really what 40k is about. In our group, 60% of it is the list building, fluff writing and generally storytelling of the 40k universe, 30% is the painting and converting and maybe 10% is actually playing.


Have fun

This probably explains it.

Check out the battleforce sets if it's your first buy. It's a lot to spend at once but it's a great way to start off as you get a bit of money off than if you'd bought everything separate. I think you save around £30 from the Chaos Space Marines one for example. Even if you don't actually want all the stuff in it you can save about a tenner.

For your first army, I would reccommend Chaos Daemons with Eldar allies.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
For your first army, I would reccommend Chaos Daemons with Eldar allies.

Perhaps not the right place to be making those sort of jokes, the risk of a beginner taking you at your word is a bit high maybe?

@OP

You have a lot of MEQs (Marine Equivalents, Space Marines or units with very similar in game stats) in your group. Should you choose another, such as Space Wolves, you would all have armies that are fundamentally quite similar (with the Necrons being most different, but not radically) and that may lead to some fairly well balanced games, all depending on exactly what you all use in your lists of course.

Those that say the Tyranids are poor aren't entirely wrong, but one of the fundamental issues of 40K is that there is more than one "right way to play" and basically the more concerned you become with the result over the game itself, the worse they become. If you and your friends are just looking to have fun and spend some time, they'll be fine, but if one or more start to look to make lists to win, then they'll start to wilt, and quick. Despite their appeals to you, however, I'd dismiss them on the basis of you're trying to keep things low cost, and you rightly state they need an investment in many small, or multiple large and expensive, models.

Dark Eldar are a nice army visually, having received a massive makeover the last time they were updated, and are very much at the "glass cannon" end of the spectrum (highly offensive, very little durability) so can be tricky to learn, but from a painting and modelling POV, they have three distinct aesthetic themes running through the army, with corresponding playstyles, so you can have a field day with different sorts of model, and all sorts of bright colours and visually interesting colour schemes. They're not at the top of the power curve by any means, but they do have a solid solution to some of the stronger units in he game right now, and they can ally with Eldar, who are right near the top of the curve, and may be a nice evolution for your army once you're happy with your DE.

Totally didn't go and google them just now.. lol

The grey knights look pretty cool.
The thing is, cost is a big thing in this for me. I still do really like the tyranids even though you guys have said they aren't the best right now.
I just am not if it's worth me starting at all if I'm going to be playing a race I don't enjoy so much

Taken from elsewhere on dakka
Rules book.
Codex
Battle force
Hobby starter set (paints, brush, glue)
Dice
Tape measure

$345.75 US retail.



That's how bad it is for new beginners, and that's the entry-level "Baby's First 40k Game" level for tutorial-level games. And as I said in that thread, I could buy a 35-point Warmachine army (standard level games) including hobby supplies for roughly the same price.

you do realize that the hobby starter set is a colossal waste of money, right?

Also the main rulebook can be shared by a gaming group

The rules book we would be sharing.
As we are the paints, brushes, glues

Just the main army itself and the codex are the things I'm looking at right now.

Kyroboru wrote:
The rules book we would be sharing.
As we are the paints, brushes, glues

Just the main army itself and the codex are the things I'm looking at right now.

Still expensive to start. I buy very little now and paint mostly.

A few things.

Tyranids - as stated they kinda got hit with the "bad xenos, no snacks for you" bat. On the plus side they can now take allies, so you can have a fluffy army of Tyranids, and part of a Genestealer Cult.

Space Wolves, like all Space Marines, can more or less share models, especially if you just want to try them out. Seeing as how 2 people already have Space Marines you can proxy their models as SW models (or BA/GK).

Dark Eldar - a warning, these guys are a glass cannon. They either do very well, or they crash and burn.

Orks - if you can find the Infantry for cheap (look up Assault on Black Reach on eBay), the bonus is their vehicles can be made out of just about anything. Like the look of a Wave Serpent? Acquire one and then add gubbins to it and make it Orky.

The painting and assembling is the thing I enjoy the most..

How does having mixed armies work?

There are two ways it works.

1. Just take whatever, you still have to meet unit minimums (so you can't take just 2 Tac Marine models), but there is no Force Organisation Chart.

2. Allies. Each army must have (at a minimum) 1 HQ, and 1-2 Troop units (depending on Detachment type).

Either way, depending on how well the armies trust each other, depends on the sort of bonuses and restrictions in place in game.

Honestly I'd look into a different hobby. The cost is high, the rule quality is not in-line with the price and the actual game varies depending on who's using what list.
Magic the gathering is as expensive and requires less setup if you want to burn through money.

Cheaper options would include; malifaux, infinity and warmachine/hordes.

RPGs are pretty cheap too.

OP - Hey, I want to play 40k... any advice?
Rest of thread - Dunno, why don't you get into knitting instead?

Very helpful, really.

@OP - If costs are a concern, I'd suggest fielding a small elite army. Grey Knights and Dark Angels can pull a successful all-terminator force with minimal cost. I'd recommend Dark Angels better - A decent Deathwing army can be assembled easily by picking up Dark Vengeance terminator squads for cheap on Ebay.

If painting and assembling is what you like to do, then offer to do that for your little group instead - lots of people don't have the time or energy or desire to paint, someone like you who wants to paint but not play is a godsend.

If you ~all~ want to paint, then it is a little harder. I'd just get a battleforce set that can integrate with whatever the other people in the group have (so you could sell it to them later if required).

For NZBro (or NZSis) have a look at thecombatcompany.com they are in Sydney and will probably be one of the better prices you will find for new stuff - $200 and it is free shipping, which is basically the codex and a battleforce.

For armies, follow the guys suggestions above - I am a painter and have no idea

Jesus isn't there ebay nz? I was trying to find something cheap for you to buy

 Agent_Tremolo wrote:
OP - Hey, I want to play 40k... any advice?
Rest of thread - Dunno, why don't you get into knitting instead?

Very helpful, really.

@OP - If costs are a concern, I'd suggest fielding a small elite army. Grey Knights and Dark Angels can pull a successful all-terminator force with minimal cost. I'd recommend Dark Angels better - A decent Deathwing army can be assembled easily by picking up Dark Vengeance terminator squads for cheap on Ebay.

Yes, people giving suggestions on where to buy models and some information on how the armies OP is interested in currently function is not helpful at all :roll eyes:

We have eBay Australia, and we have TradeMe (not sure if people out of the country can look at that)

Thanks for all the suggestions so far though guys. currently looking at grey knights and the space wolves.
I may just end up buying models, reprinting them and selling them again haha but the members in my group are either keen on painting but not very good or have no interest in it at all, so I might paint for them

Kyroboru wrote:
We have eBay Australia, and we have TradeMe (not sure if people out of the country can look at that)

Thanks for all the suggestions so far though guys. currently looking at grey knights and the space wolves.
I may just end up buying models, reprinting them and selling them again haha but the members in my group are either keen on painting but not very good or have no interest in it at all, so I might paint for them

Like I said, if you can get your hands on the codex, you can try both of these armies out using generic Space Marine models. If you don't like playing, your out however much the codex costs. If you do enjoy it, you're part of the way to starting your own army anyway.

@Happyjew Wasn't talikg about your posts, really, those are amongst the best of the lot. Perhaps I've been to quick to extend my criticism to the entire thread. But you'll agree with me that those "stick to collecting/painting" and "play Malifaux" posts aren't all that helpful, moreover when the OP has specified that a) is already painting stuff for others b) is interested in playing 40k.

Liking the looks of the grey knights but.. Would it be worthwhile looking into the races back stories?
The gray knights seem quite aesthetically similar to the space marines.

And that combat company site looks very good!

Grey knights are basically space marine paladins. They are trained to fight chaos deamons. They are the best of the best as it were. Models look awesome. Cheap, and they get psimumnition.

Would grey knights or space wolves be better with the races my friends have? (Chaos space marines, space marines, necrons and dark/blood angels if you don't want to scroll)
I like both of them equally, really

Dark Eldar may be hard for beginners, but they have several advantages, especially if you like painting and modelling:

1. They are one of the best looking armies in 40k
2. They are perfect for conversions
3. They are one of the cheapest, if not THE cheapest army to start with. Buy the battleforce... one or three times :p
4. Nearly every unit in the Codex is worth its Points
5. Rumors telling about a new Codex at the end of the year... well not to sure if thats good News
6. You learn to play the game the hard way... it will improve your knowledge of the game mechanics much more than a stationary and absolutly boring gunline army
7. You are the bad guy... i mean really bad, like super bad... not such a hobby villain as those chaos guys.

Greetings

 Agent_Tremolo wrote:
@Happyjew Wasn't talikg about your posts, really, those are amongst the best of the lot. Perhaps I've been to quick to extend my criticism to the entire thread. But you'll agree with me that those "stick to collecting/painting" and "play Malifaux" posts aren't all that helpful, moreover when the OP has specified that a) is already painting stuff for others b) is interested in playing 40k.

That's a whole lot of assumptions there champ, how about we all focus on trying to help op rather than critiquing the posting styles of everyone else (the irony of this post is not lost on me).

In a casual environment, tyranids can be competitive enough, as well as fairly cheap, if you bulk out the force with big, monstrous creatures as opposed to hordes of little bugs.