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Agreed!

It IS officially, as stated by GW!

Some people...

Next version of spearhead...Brass Skorpions. C'mon Skorpionsssss!

Dare to dream?

Live in hope, die in vain?

Er, yes?

Kurgash wrote:Next version of spearhead...Brass Skorpions. C'mon Skorpionsssss!

If GW/FW pull another Trygon/Piranha/Skyray on me, I'll be pissed.

So - if a mob of 30 boys gets hit by the nighspinner - next turn they move - do all 30 take dangerous or just the ones who didnt fail to be wounded?....

imagine hitting 3 squads of boyz clumped together. Eww.


I think i may buy a ton of these just to make Turrets for my wave serpents. Sell the Bits on Ebay that i dont use to make up the cost.

It says any "unit", which is the entire squad.

Melissia wrote:Speaking from the perspective of a Guard player, I'd say it's better to purchase in squadrons of two rather than three... you get the benefits of a squadron while minimizing the risk (IE only the first immobilize destroys, not the first two).

If the two immobilise results are the result of one unit shooting at you, then as all damage is resolved simultaneously you WOULD have both models destroyed.

It's an excellent disruption unit, and it might give some indication into how GW will change the Eldar in the future. Instead of adding more movement enchancing rules, they'll give Eldar additional abilities for distrupting enemy movement instead.

nosferatu1001 wrote:

Melissia wrote:Speaking from the perspective of a Guard player, I'd say it's better to purchase in squadrons of two rather than three... you get the benefits of a squadron while minimizing the risk (IE only the first immobilize destroys, not the first two).

If the two immobilise results are the result of one unit shooting at you, then as all damage is resolved simultaneously you WOULD have both models destroyed.

Only if each immobilize occurred in the same phase. If it occurs in different phases, then no.

I agree, i hope this is the way they are going to change the Eldar. It would be great to stop Tanks in their tracks, slow assaulty units, stun units while other eldar clean up house.

I don't get people saying this thing sucks...


... it has good strength, it's large blast, it's not ordnance (IE the vehicle can move and fire), it pins (from barrage, IIRC), it's rending, it's twin-linked, it does damage in the enemy turn AFTER the shot is fired if the enemy wants or has to move, and its special ability works on vehicles as well as infantry. It always hits side armor, and cover is determined from the middle of the blast... it's a friggin' nightmare of a unit.

I agree with melissia, it is going to be nightmarish.

Any word of these can be taken in squads yet?

No, these are vehicle only. There is a spinner type weapon you can have as a Heavy Support artillery unit, but not like this.

That's not what they asked

Oh, did he mean squadrons? Took me a minute to figure out what you meant, M.

Yeah, that's what he meant. Were they single vehicles, or in squadrons?

Well that's a different question. I don't have WD, so I can't answer that. I'd guess no.

edit:erk! 2 more to 1000

Sorry! I did mean Squadrons! I must have just cut that last bit off!

Melissia wrote:I don't get people saying this thing sucks...


... it has good strength, it's large blast, it's not ordnance (IE the vehicle can move and fire), it pins (from barrage, IIRC), it's rending, it's twin-linked, it does damage in the enemy turn AFTER the shot is fired if the enemy wants or has to move, and its special ability works on vehicles as well as infantry. It always hits side armor, and cover is determined from the middle of the blast... it's a friggin' nightmare of a unit.

ordnance in 5th can move and fire just like other weapons... you just can't fire another weapon on the same vehicle if you fire ordnance barring a special rule like the leman russ gets.

Ordnance Barrage must be fired while stationary (I think anyway... I don't have my book with me...). But the Night Spinner is Heavy Barrage.

I don't have to deal with either rule on a regular basis, so eh... I defer to you.

Fun Tank for fluff and casual play but in competetive play it goes up against a Prism for the same points. When compared with a Prism there really is no comparison and because it's a heavy choice it really won't see much use over Falcons and Prisms.

Lemartes wrote:Fun Tank for fluff and casual play but in competetive play it goes up against a Prism for the same points. When compared with a Prism there really is no comparison and because it's a heavy choice it really won't see much use over Falcons and Prisms.

You state this without justification. Allow me to reiterate my argument from before:

... it has good strength, it's large blast, it moves 12" and fires, it pins (from barrage, IIRC), it's rending, it's twin-linked, it does damage in the enemy turn AFTER the shot is fired if the enemy wants or has to move, and its special ability works on vehicles as well as infantry. It always hits side armor, and cover is determined from the middle of the blast... it's a friggin' nightmare of a unit.

This is going to be a royal pain in the ass to deal with.

This guy is gonna be a great big middle finger to the stubborn commissar blob, and might be an annoyance to jump troops, but I don't see a dangerous terrain test being more effective than a S9 BS4 blast on a vehicle. Even on a landraider the focused beam from a prism is going to have twice the chance of affecting the tank than the test would.

That being said, this tank still has the same weakness the fire prism possesses. One or two cheapo las cannons shut the dang thing up for a turn, if not for the rest of the game.

@Melissia - Ordnance barrage weapons can be fired on the move (subject to normal restrictions) but the unit may not fire any other weapon on the turn it fires its ordnance (whether it moves or not). The Doomweaver is a normal barrage weapon anyway and this does not apply, but as you asked

@Everyone who asked... - This is a single vehicle, not available in squadrons.

FWIW there is an aquila stamp in the top corner of the page with 'Official' written on it. Make of that what you will...

Oh, and I don't know if anyone mentioned this yet but the range is 12"-72" so don't let the enemy get close

Chimera_Calvin wrote:@Melissia - Ordnance barrage weapons can be fired on the move (subject to normal restrictions) but the unit may not fire any other weapon on the turn it fires its ordnance (whether it moves or not). The Doomweaver is a normal barrage weapon anyway and this does not apply, but as you asked

@Everyone who asked... - This is a single vehicle, not available in squadrons.

FWIW there is an aquila stamp in the top corner of the page with 'Official' written on it. Make of that what you will...

Oh, and I don't know if anyone mentioned this yet but the range is 12"-72" so don't let the enemy get close

It clearly tells you on PG.58 that Ordnance Barrage weapons may only fire if the vehicle was stationary, the gun crew must concentrate on getting the co-ordinates right before firing. However, you are probably thinking of firing the gun directly, where it is treated as a regular ordnance weapon.

Anyhoo, the nightspinner is a Barrage/ Large blast, not Ordnance barrage, so it can be fired on the move.

Chimera_Calvin wrote:@Melissia - Ordnance barrage weapons can be fired on the move...

No, a vehicle must remain stationary to fire an Ordinance Barrage indirectly. BRB pg 58.

Regular Barrage weapons are fair game though.

Sorry, mixing up my Ordnance and Ordnace Barrage rules there, that's what you get for posting half distracted on a thursday morning...

Melissia wrote:

Lemartes wrote:Fun Tank for fluff and casual play but in competetive play it goes up against a Prism for the same points. When compared with a Prism there really is no comparison and because it's a heavy choice it really won't see much use over Falcons and Prisms.

You state this without justification. Allow me to reiterate my argument from before:

... it has good strength, it's large blast, it moves 12" and fires, it pins (from barrage, IIRC), it's rending, it's twin-linked, it does damage in the enemy turn AFTER the shot is fired if the enemy wants or has to move, and its special ability works on vehicles as well as infantry. It always hits side armor, and cover is determined from the middle of the blast... it's a friggin' nightmare of a unit.

This is going to be a royal pain in the ass to deal with.

Lemates is correct, it’s not that good and after a couple games, I think most Eldar players will relegate it to the shelf in favor of other options.

The biggest reason it suffers is because of the current mechanized meta game. The vehicle lacks reliable AV cracking capability and that’s its main issue.

But, here’s a simple analysis compared to the Fire Prism in its intended roll – infantry killer.

Let say the Night Spinner hits, on average, 7 models with its twin linked pie plate compared to 5 for the Fire Prism which isn’t twin linked when firing unlinked.

Vs. MEQ:
NS = 7 hits = 1.166 rending wounds + 4.666 normal wounds = 1.166 + 1.555 failed saves = 2.721 dead MEQ’s (42.263 points per kill) + they have to make a pin test and move through dangerous terrain next turn.
FP = 5 hits = 3.333 wounds = 1.111 failed saves = 1.111 dead MEQ’s (103.51 points per kill)

Clearly the Nightspinner is more efficient but, in all honesty 3 dead MEQ’s compared to 1… not REALLY that significant a tabletop impact.

Now, let’s double the number of NS on the table and the number of Fire Prisms on the table because that’s an extremely important consideration given the prisims linking capacity. The shots become twin linked for the prism so we’ll up the hits to 7 but one NS gets 7 hits and the other gets 6 because of removed casualties.

NS = 13 hits = 2.166 rending wounds + 8.666 normal wounds = 2.166 + 2.888 failed saves = 5.054 dead MEQ’s (45.508 points per kill) + the good stuff
FP = 7 hits = 5.833 wounds = 5.833 failed saves = 5.833 dead MEQ’s (39.43 points per kill)

From a purely killing perspective 1 NS outperforms the Fire Prism against MEQ but 2 fireprisms outperform 2 NS – add to that the ability of the fire prisms to small blast MC’s and vehicles and the prism starts to look a lot more worthwhile.

Now – let’s look at things from the eyes of some tightly packed Boyz
Let’s give the pie plates 10 hits – which is a bit much but lets say we’re facing green tide and there’s no choice but to pack things tight.

NS = 10 hits = 1.666 rending wounds + 6.666 wounds = 1.666 + 5.555 failed saves = 7.221 dead boyz + the good stuff
FP = 10 hits = 6.666 wounds = 6.666 failed saves = 6.666 dead boyz
NS > FP by a narrow margin and, at 6 points per Boy, the margin is very narrow indeed… but the 23 remaining boys WILL be moving through dangerous terrain so that may buy a bunch more wounds.
Things would stay pretty much the same if you added a second fire prism.

So, the Night Spinner is a more efficient infantry killer than the Fire Prism. {sarcasm}I know, as an Eldar player, between Bladestorming Dire Avengers, Dual flamer Guardians + Destructor Warlocks, Striking Scorpions, Warp Spiders, and Scatter Laser War Walkers I struggle furiously with the ability to kill infantry so, give the options available to me, this JUST might be the solution I’ve been desperate for all this time.{/sarcasm}

@incarna - You've mentioned the economy of scale with multiple Fire Prisms giving you the capability of twin linking and increasing firepower or splitting fire, but the Night Spinner also has an economy of scale - just a more subtle one.

By being able to put multiple enemy units into difficult/dangerous terrain you will not only cause more casualties but also slow down multiple units. This can be used to great advantage to cause bottlenecks in an enemy advance. As an eldar player your greatest advantage is the fact that you will be more mobile than your opponent.

The Night Spinner's job is not to kill things (although it does kill infantry and light vehicles very well) but to act as a force multiplier for your superior mobility by reducing your opponents.

Against infantry heavy armies like Orks and especially Tyranids (maybe even Blood Angels), the Night Spinner is a superior choice. As with all things the final decision will depend on your local meta, but I don't think the choice is as cut-and-dry as it first appears.