Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Dont own the codex but i remember there having to be a sacrifice of an Exarch (the Young King) to awaken the Avatar, hence 'blood sacrifice'.
and as to the original post, the Daemon Princes of C:CSM are elevated SM's, not Daemons, they have many Chaos gifts but as previously stated, they are not daemons (and hence can exist on the material plane for extended periods of time)
just my £0.02
ninja'd (damn! lol)

Actually, a Deamon Prince is a mortal that the Chaos Gods have elevated to deamonhood.


the Mortal has recieved the ultimate blessing, Immortality.


he is now a deamon and enjoys all the benifits. if his mortal form is destroyed, he will reform in the warp for a pieriod of time before coming back.


Deamon princes do tend to stay with their previous warband for the time being. if they get defeated they join the hosts of their god(their warband being doubtlessly destroyed)

GT - he is not a full daemon; he does not have any issues staying in the Mortal realm, whcih a true daemon would

He is immortal, but not a true daemon.

he is a true deamon.


due to the nature of his elevation, the deamon has a greater connection with the mortal realm as he still has his body to inhabit. if this body is destroyed, he will have trouble maintaining a form for the rest of eternity, but he is still a deamon.

Grey Templar wrote:Actually, a Deamon Prince is a mortal that the Chaos Gods have elevated to deamonhood.


the Mortal has recieved the ultimate blessing, Immortality.


he is now a deamon and enjoys all the benifits. if his mortal form is destroyed, he will reform in the warp for a pieriod of time before coming back.


Deamon princes do tend to stay with their previous warband for the time being. if they get defeated they join the hosts of their god(their warband being doubtlessly destroyed)

nosferatu1001 wrote:GT - he is not a full daemon; he does not have any issues staying in the Mortal realm, whcih a true daemon would

He is immortal, but not a true daemon.

I see it the same way as nos, ie not a true daemon, just elevated to be immortal.
and i did mean any mortal can be made into a DP, i just used SM as a classic example

Daemon princes don't reform in the warp if they die...

UberhAxTHC wrote:Daemon princes don't reform in the warp if they die...

thats what i thought..... but wasn't sure lol

GT - they do not reform. They have *bodily* immortality, but they are NOT a true daemon. Not in anyway are they a true daemon.

I am pretty sure that only units that have the 'Daemon' special rule actually written in their special rules are affected, thus Daemon princes, possessed, and Defilers and even summouned daemons and Greater daemons (only from the CSM codex mind) are not affected as they do not have that special rule. Avatars however have the Daemon rule and its rules specifically say it is treated as a daemon so it is affected. IMHO, end of.

Btw - basing *anything* on how well written the Chaos Marine codex is written is a bad idea. The codex is a horrible rush job

CSM looks like it was written in an hour, tops. I'm not kidding or exaggerating there.

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Daemon_Prince

"Daemon Princes are former mortal Champion of Chaos who have been elevated to daemonhood by the Chaos Gods. They have bartered their humanity for unearthly power and immortality"

seems pretty clear that they are, in fact, deamons.



RAW, Gks don't get preferred enemy against them, but RAI i would say they would.

RAI, I'd say Khorne worshippers can't be affected by psychic powers. How would you contradict that?

No, Khorne gives resistance to psychic powers, not immunity.

only Tzeench could give immunity to psychic powers.

erm im sorry GT, but in BL fluff (i know i know, not true canon all the time) then Khorne gives immunity to psychic powers and sorcery.

Grey Templar wrote:No, Khorne gives resistance to psychic powers, not immunity.

only Tzeench could give immunity to psychic powers.

Actually Tzeench wouldnt care, both sides are just pawns in his grand scheme anyway. In fact he probably find the effects of the psychic power to be pretty entertaining.
I wouldnt care less to be honest if I am playing CSM against GK, first the DP is probably a Psyker anyway, second I know I am probably already screwed.

Grey Templar wrote:it will actually be the deamon or CSM player who would have to prove that a Deamon Prince is not a deamon.

Frankly, if you are arguing that a Deamon Prince is NOT a deamon then i think you need to step back and seriously reconsider playing 40k.


you can't argue that the Avatar isn't a deamon since it's rules say explicity that it is.


Posessed i would let slide, they arn't that great anyway

many DP use to be men. Look through the fluff about what happened to the traitor primarchs. Half died half were elevated to daemonhood. But they are still men, they have a materael being and are not unstable like daemons


Automatically Appended Next Post:

UberhAxTHC wrote:CSM looks like it was written in an hour, tops. I'm not kidding or exaggerating there.

an hour serously? they had something older to work on, 25minutes tops. it takes longer to print than it did to write

Well just from a comparative standpoint,

Commander Farsight gives his army proffered enemy: orks
This implies anything in the codex: orks.

GK get proffered enemy: Daemons
I would take this to mean that they get their tl swords against any entry in codex: daemons

(I don't have an example, but)
If a unit had PE: Eldar, would this count towards dark eldar, without explicitly saying so? Dark Eldar are Eldar, but they don't belong to the eldar.
If GW meant to give GK PE: CSM, I'm sure they'd have given them explicit permission to do so.

Just my 2 cents