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I voted yes. Dont need anymore silly aliens to paint

Then go do airfix.

Absolutely not imho.

Voted no. What I want to see is tougher and more varied kroots, and the demiurgs should also give plenty of defensive/close combat roles (since they're supposed to be space dwarfs, I don't see them being mobile troops, and Taus already have plenty of long range specialised units).

There's neither place nor need for humans in that.

I think it could be cool if only for fluff purposes.

The Dark Eldar got harliquins in their new coded and no one really seemed up in arms over that even though wytches essentially filler their roll.

It's Tau Empire. Not just the blue hooved creatures.

The Dark Eldar already had Harlequins. And if we're splitting hairs, the role that Harlequins fill is as 'elite assault infantry' and that role is filled by the Bloodbrides or Mandrakes, not the basic Wych unit.

The reason people are more vocal about "human auxiliaries" is because they're, without a doubt, going to be basically be "Guard squads in the Tau army".

My reason for not wanting them is simply because the Gue'vasa don't tend to travel in huge numbers with the Tau fleets. They'll have maybe a platoon's worth, which would be used as infiltrators and insurgents to communicate with and confuse the Guard/PDF that the Tau are facing.

Marines have scouts, even though they don't tend to take a big role in battle

Don't really care, but human auxiliaries kinda suck.

I would like it if they were added, but it won't bother me if they didn't

I was planning on converting some anyways

spookman wrote:Marines have scouts, even though they don't tend to take a big role in battle

The difference is that every Marine force will include at least a squad of Scouts.

Every Tau force won't include Human Auxiliaries.

Kanluwen wrote:

spookman wrote:Marines have scouts, even though they don't tend to take a big role in battle

The difference is that every Marine force will include at least a squad of Scouts.

Every Tau force won't include Human Auxiliaries.

Agreed.

Tau use on Pathfinders as their scouts. I could see having one squad of IG as reserves only, but that's it.

Well, I wouldn't really see the humans being used as the same role as Pathfinders.

Think of them as being advisors. Pathfinders, translators, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
By the way: "Pathfinders" in this sense means "scouts intimately familiar with the terrain, showing secret ways of travel".

Kanluwen wrote:Well, I wouldn't really see the humans being used as the same role as Pathfinders.

Think of them as being advisors. Pathfinders, translators, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
By the way: "Pathfinders" in this sense means "scouts intimately familiar with the terrain, showing secret ways of travel".

Ah, miscommunication. I agree, I don't see them being Pathfinders.

I can see them as scouts, translators, and spies since their title in the Tau Empire is "Human Helpers"...but like I said before, in terms of the game, I can see them as a single reserve squad.

What about them having a Chimera if they're used as a combat unit? Possible?...you know that there would have been some left behind after the IG pulled out

Great, so now Tau get mech vets?

That won't end badly at all

No vehicles, they get spiked before crews ditch them.

I vote Yes. The Tau Empire accepts and absorbs all races willing to submit to the Greater Good. If a few Human worlds have gone over to the TE then so be it. Here is the PDF link by Andy Hoare. http://www.theblackship.org/downloads/rules/Tau_human_auxileries.pdf
THey are not OP in anyway and have a very limited tactical use.....namely filling a spot between Kroot and FW. I have a squad of 12 that come to 84pts. they are usually stuck behind some cover and are waiting for a last couple of turn rush or i just park them around a objective and leave them as a roadblock.

Kroothawk wrote:If you want Imperial Guard, play Imperial Guard.

I concure. While it is fluffy, it's also boring. I'd let a Tau player borrow some guard in a friendly game anyway.

I would still like to see a suitable reason why they should be a choice in the Codex.

If they have heavy weapons, then they are stationary units (something Tau military doctrine doesn't endorse) and would be competing with Tau's already formidable firepower options.

If they are cheaper, then they are competing with Kroot who have better weapons (than lasguns) and are better in close combat. The basic Guardsmen needs to be fielded in quantity; as an auxiliary unit this is a difficulty as they should be the minority.

Their basic stats are only slightly different to that of an ordinary firewarrior, begging the question why they should be included and not counts-as.

I know they're there in the fluff and I'm all for fluffy, additional options.

But can someone please provide a suitable reason (considering the above points) why they should be included in the Codex and how?!

Dave, "they're there in the fluff" isn't even a good reason.

They're not fielded in any real numbers or taken on campaigns to justify their use.

It would be like if a Baneblade were in the standard Imperial Guard Codex and you could field platoons of them.

I insist that the tau codex must remain at its current "Ice cream" pattern, you have the "Tau icecream" and if want you can add some "kroot chips" and kind of like the "possible demiurg cover" (vespids not my taste but its nice to know they are a possible choice). I mean a main solid Tau core and AUXILIARS not viceversa.

And for the humans i dont like it like i said before because all of the humans already fighting in the 41 millenium (and yes there's a lot, dont try to say space marines are not hyper esteroid treated humans).

XV9's, more drone options, Farsight special troops (xv8's ready for close combat maybe?), new kroot options (knarloc riders, great knarloc) and another castes (water caste envoy, a sweet home rule for 1 game, age of empires monks rules, lol'ed all night) is what i think the next codex should be.

Why would Farsight's special troops be "XV8s ready for close combat"?

That makes absolutely no sense. The only reason Farsight wields the Sword of Dawn is because it's a relic that he 'discovered'. It's a one-off item, like the Gauntlets of Ultramar.

Kanluwen wrote:Why would Farsight's special troops be "XV8s ready for close combat"?

That makes absolutely no sense. The only reason Farsight wields the Sword of Dawn is because it's a relic that he 'discovered'. It's a one-off item, like the Gauntlets of Ultramar.

Yes the sword of dawn is a one of a kind item, but nothing stops farsight from wielding some normal swords on his battle suits. Farsight ,unlike most tau, believes in melee combat and teaches it to his troops. That is why his fire warriors get extra CC.

Actually, he doesn't "believe in melee combat".

The Fire Warriors get extra CC because they're experienced in fighting Orks. It's been explained like that since the first Tau Codex.

Most likely the only way they would get is slaves, so that might really mess them but, but i don't know, i thought most humans hated Xenos?

Kanluwen wrote:Actually, he doesn't "believe in melee combat".

The Fire Warriors get extra CC because they're experienced in fighting Orks. It's been explained like that since the first Tau Codex.

"Possibly because of his ongoing battles against Ork forces, O'Shovah believes that close combat is a vital part of warfare, unlike most other Tau" The codex says about the same thing in the section titled ork fighter. Faresight scoffs at the idea of relining only on range and makes sure his troops practice hand to hand.

Nightwalker wrote:Most likely the only way they would get is slaves, so that might really mess them but, but i don't know, i thought most humans hated Xenos?

Most do, but the tau put for a effort in seducing human words away from the IoM. Take a look at the damocles crusade. That link is a little lacking, but when the IoM withdrew, the guard units they left behind where offered the option to join the tau. Some took it (some resisted) and that is where the human auxiliaries come from.

nomotog wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Actually, he doesn't "believe in melee combat".

The Fire Warriors get extra CC because they're experienced in fighting Orks. It's been explained like that since the first Tau Codex.

"Possibly because of his ongoing battles against Ork forces, O'Shovah believes that close combat is a vital part of warfare, unlike most other Tau" The codex says about the same thing in the section titled ork fighter. Farsight scoffs at the idea of relying only on range and makes sure his troops practice hand to hand.

"Close combat" doesn't mean "melee combat is emphasized".

And by the way?

Tau Empire wrote:O'Shovah's fame was won battling against Orks and he has denounced the normal Tau philosophy of using ranged combat to the exclusion of all else. Fire Caste warriors of the Farsight Enclave train heavily in hand to hand combat and any Tau model in an army led by O'Shovah counts as having the Preferred Enemy special rule when fighting Orks.

That doesn't say he "believes in melee combat" or "specializes" in it.

The way it's been explained makes it clear that Farsight trains his troops so that they can defend themselves against foes that would close.

Nightwalker wrote:Most likely the only way they would get is slaves, so that might really mess them but, but i don't know, i thought most humans hated Xenos?

Most do, but the tau put for a effort in seducing human words away from the IoM. Take a look at the damocles crusade. That link is a little lacking, but when the IoM withdrew, the guard units they left behind where offered the option to join the tau. Some took it (some resisted) and that is where the human auxiliaries come from.

They left basically NO Guard units behind. That is a fallacy constantly repeated by Tau players.
The majority of what was absorbed into the Tau Empire was PDF.

I bet it would piss you off so bad if they reasoned thats how the Tau got human counterparts


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I bet it would piss you off so bad if they reasoned thats how the Tau got human counterparts

I think so, they kind of deserve it.

Human auxiliaries ARE a big part of their fluff.

Cynick wrote:I think so, they kind of deserve it.

Human auxiliaries ARE a big part of their fluff.

Once again:
They're really not. They're a big part of the fluff for planets that the Tau take over.

It's like if one were to field the Cadian Interior Guard...anywhere outside of Cadia.

I must remark that i never said "melee" i said close combat, tau units are not designed to stand in the middle of the fight for several turns. My idea was closer to XV8's with vectorial retro trusters included in the cost, shield generator and a)a special short range multiple hardcore assault attacks (some kind of shotgun? flamer template?) or b)Power weapon (before rage against me i know this doesnt fit tau fluff, im just giving the ideas that comes right now to my mind).

The whole idea would be XV8's that jump in, hit hard and IF survive run like hell but only avalible to farsaight enclave and perhaps to be fair XV9's only be avalible to "loyal" taus.

By the way, im not a natural english speaker so if some one finds anything wrong in my writing, please be gentle.

Kanluwen wrote:

nomotog wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Actually, he doesn't "believe in melee combat".

The Fire Warriors get extra CC because they're experienced in fighting Orks. It's been explained like that since the first Tau Codex.

"Possibly because of his ongoing battles against Ork forces, O'Shovah believes that close combat is a vital part of warfare, unlike most other Tau" The codex says about the same thing in the section titled ork fighter. Farsight scoffs at the idea of relying only on range and makes sure his troops practice hand to hand.

"Close combat" doesn't mean "melee combat is emphasized".

And by the way?

Tau Empire wrote:O'Shovah's fame was won battling against Orks and he has denounced the normal Tau philosophy of using ranged combat to the exclusion of all else. Fire Caste warriors of the Farsight Enclave train heavily in hand to hand combat and any Tau model in an army led by O'Shovah counts as having the Preferred Enemy special rule when fighting Orks.

That doesn't say he "believes in melee combat" or "specializes" in it.

The way it's been explained makes it clear that Farsight trains his troops so that they can defend themselves against foes that would close.

Nightwalker wrote:Most likely the only way they would get is slaves, so that might really mess them but, but i don't know, i thought most humans hated Xenos?

Most do, but the tau put for a effort in seducing human words away from the IoM. Take a look at the damocles crusade. That link is a little lacking, but when the IoM withdrew, the guard units they left behind where offered the option to join the tau. Some took it (some resisted) and that is where the human auxiliaries come from.

They left basically NO Guard units behind. That is a fallacy constantly repeated by Tau players.
The majority of what was absorbed into the Tau Empire was PDF.

Ok, you are jumping through all kinds of hoops with wording and such. The original question was about melee equipped battle suits. Farsight knows how important melee combat is in the 40k world. The idea that he would have special close combat suits makes a lot of sense. I guess we can argue whether or not he "believes in melee", but that would be a point less battle of what the word believe means.

The other part. I was just going by what it said in my codex, but yes most auxiliaries would come from human planets ailed with the tau.