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So basically what your saying is "Doesnt effect me so tuff gak" Nice attitude bud.

@kingsley harpies, flying hive tyrants, winged demon princes and winged greater demons are flying monstrous creatures not flyers.

Unless we can play 40k without any codex's whatsoever then yes they are core rules.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Have you ever played the game? You require a codex to play the game, it isn't a supplement.

Obviously yes, and you don't in fact need a Codex to play the game-- see for instance Dark Vengeance. Codexes are important supplements, but still separate from the core game.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Are you a GW employee perhaps? Or Tom Kirby's mum?

I'm not a GW employee. I don't care about GW.

 Kingsley wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Have you ever played the game? You require a codex to play the game, it isn't a supplement.

Obviously yes, and you don't in fact need a Codex to play the game-- see for instance Dark Vengeance. Codexes are important supplements, but still separate from the core game.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Are you a GW employee perhaps? Or Tom Kirby's mum?

I'm not a GW employee. I don't care about GW.

If you don't care about GW the why post in GW threads in a pro GW manner?

 Kingsley wrote:

Codexes are important supplements, but still separate from the core game.

Me brain hurts

To play a game, no, you don't need a codex, but at a tournament, I'm bloody making sure the guy against me has his codex or source material his army list came from.

A friend of mine is famous for misreading rules and then leaving his codex at home or having just scanned the lists and input them in an excel spreadsheet. Our policy towards him is now this: No codex? No firey-ball-of-doom-that-incinerates-everything-on-a-2+ for you, then.

I dont mean to poo on anyones hate parade......but the new FAQS out today clearly have all the rules updates for free.....you dont need the book. I will be getting it because it contains White Dwarf stuff I dont have and I'm a nerd. Maybe too quick to overreact. Also, I dont have a Blood Angels Codex, would you prefer I buy a 41.00 Codex, or a 33.00 Book that has two of my units instead of one, as I play regular marines?

 Kingsley wrote:
Obviously yes, and you don't in fact need a Codex to play the game-- see for instance Dark Vengeance. Codexes are important supplements, but still separate from the core game.

Or.... Dark Vengence was it's own game as an introduction to the standard 40K game. But the BRB says tells you to play you need to construct an army from the codex and with FAQs, there's an entire section on that!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Grahamulot wrote:
I dont mean to poo on anyones hate parade......but the new FAQS out today clearly have all the rules updates for free.....you dont need the book. I will be getting it because it contains White Dwarf stuff I dont have and I'm a nerd. Maybe too quick to overreact. Also, I dont have a Blood Angels Codex, would you prefer I buy a 41.00 Codex, or a 33.00 Book that has two of my units instead of one, as I play regular marines?

Try reading those FAQs again. They tell you to ignore the previous WD and use the DftS book. So the day the book comes out they invalidate the previous rules and force you to buy another book just to play 1 model.

Grahamulot wrote:
I dont mean to poo on anyones hate parade......but the new FAQS out today clearly have all the rules updates for free.....you dont need the book. I will be getting it because it contains White Dwarf stuff I dont have and I'm a nerd. Maybe too quick to overreact. Also, I dont have a Blood Angels Codex, would you prefer I buy a 41.00 Codex, or a 33.00 Book that has two of my units instead of one, as I play regular marines?

Tell that to Ork players, who now have to buy a $33 book to play with ANY of their flyers.

A friend of mine runs dual dakka jets. He loves playing them and it breathed new life into his ork army. Now he has to play $33 to keep playing them at the local GW, where previously he had the rules for much cheaper. I don't see how this new books helps him at all. Frankly, I think this new book is appalling. And yet I feel I have to get it to keep playing any of my armies.

It is nothing wrong with the "Death from the sky compendium" IF GW STOP HIS POLICY - buy this because it is good and has super rules, and if you don't buy it someone else will and beat you with it AND THEN in 3-6 months say :" you know that shiny thing?? well...now it's bad, now it costs double the points...and you have to buy this new thing"

I don't complain about the NEW armies being better. I complain and I am being concerned about the future - is this miniature going to be ok...or not??

So..if this compendium starts saying Nights Scythes are now 120 Pts, Hell Drakes are 200 pts an lose their invul save, OR in fact when screamers and Flamers will be released once again they will be nerfed... THEN I SAY.... GO BUY SOME WARMACHINE OR INFINITY and let them have it.

Hope you understand...like you all..I am concerned about the future and that " what if would do this or that.... :(:(:( )

@grahamulot having read the space marine FAQ I can categorically tell you it does not give you the rules for fielding a storm talon or storm raven in a space marine army. It just tells you to buy the flier compendium.

UNCLEBADTOUCH wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Are you a GW employee perhaps? Or Tom Kirby's mum?

I'm not a GW employee. I don't care about GW.

If you don't care about GW the why post in GW threads in a pro GW manner?

I don't post in a "pro GW manner," I post in an unbiased manner. The simple fact is that GW gets a lot of unwarranted hate. Are they perfect? No, they leave a lot to be desired. But they do a lot of things right, and a lot of the GW hatred is unwarranted. For instance, getting mad over one-click bundles that don't contain a discount is just plain silly.

People will use any reason to hate on GW. Reminds me of the haters here in the US who demonize "profit" as though it's a sin.

I'm glad to pay the $35 to have the rules. I went to 3 different stores looking for the demons update and the ork flyer rules when they were released. 3 stores and all sold out and not able to get more....

Now rather than hauling around a printed PDF, I will have the official book.

If $35 is too much for you, surely you already knew this hobby was too expensive for you, because that's chump change compared to the startup cost of getting into the hobby.

 Kingsley wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Have you ever played the game? You require a codex to play the game, it isn't a supplement.

Obviously yes, and you don't in fact need a Codex to play the game-- see for instance Dark Vengeance. Codexes are important supplements, but still separate from the core game.

Ah, I see what you're up to.

/ignored

 BarBoBot wrote:
People will use any reason to hate on GW. Reminds me of the haters here in the US who demonize "profit" as though it's a sin.

I'm glad to pay the $35 to have the rules. I went to 3 different stores looking for the demons update and the ork flyer rules when they were released. 3 stores and all sold out and not able to get more....

Now rather than hauling around a printed PDF, I will have the official book.

If $35 is too much for you, surely you already knew this hobby was too expensive for you, because that's chump change compared to the startup cost of getting into the hobby.

Except I got in two editions ago when a landraider was in the $50 mark and the starter set was $75. Now I am worried about maintaining my armies so I can play, which is much more expensive then when I started.

Seems to me, that if I owned a store, I would buy one, make copies and promote the models contained therein... of course thats illegal......The odd thing is, the more I try to defend it, the more I know that it contains little valuable information besides a few minor tweaks, which is just odd.

 BarBoBot wrote:
People will use any reason to hate on GW. Reminds me of the haters here in the US who demonize "profit" as though it's a sin.

I'm glad to pay the $35 to have the rules. I went to 3 different stores looking for the demons update and the ork flyer rules when they were released. 3 stores and all sold out and not able to get more....

Now rather than hauling around a printed PDF, I will have the official book.

If $35 is too much for you, surely you already knew this hobby was too expensive for you, because that's chump change compared to the startup cost of getting into the hobby.

The problem is that Player "A" had rules with the WD for Flyer "X" and now his flyer is completely useless because GW says that the rules aren't valid, even though it's probably the exact same rules. What's wrong with printed PDF? You do the same for FAQs. I can put them in a leather bound book with the finest paper for a nice mark up if you're interested in having a nice fancy book.

 BarBoBot wrote:
People will use any reason to hate on GW. Reminds me of the haters here in the US who demonize "profit" as though it's a sin.

I'm glad to pay the $35 to have the rules. I went to 3 different stores looking for the demons update and the ork flyer rules when they were released. 3 stores and all sold out and not able to get more....

Now rather than hauling around a printed PDF, I will have the official book.

If $35 is too much for you, surely you already knew this hobby was too expensive for you, because that's chump change compared to the startup cost of getting into the hobby.

No. You are missing the point.

It is not exactly in this case about "Not being able to afford a 35.00 book."

Please ignore the sideshows, and look back at the base discussion in the blog posting.

This issue here is not about the price. It is about access.

If you've already bought a codex and the company releases a new mini, I personally think that's great. If you then also buy that new mini, the very least they could do is give you the bloody rules for it, not stick them in another book and charge you as much for the rules as the mini costs.

It's highway bloody robbery.

It's a further act of grabbing parasitical lowlife to then limit who sells those rules so that only the parent company, at full price, can sell them, but then also take away gaming in the parent stores so that Independent store owners who DO provide the service of gaming tables are expected to enjoy the sight of you using products they can't sell on their tables.

These stores banning the use of the expansion are as entitled to ban it's use as GW is to ban the use of proxy models. Their store, their rules.

This is a serious question:

How many people who play at shops more than at home/clubs where you would not have access to a store copy actually own a copy of Apocalypse, Cities of Death, or Planetstrike?

Things like "Death from the Skies" strike me as more a "club purchase" at this point rather than an "individual purchase".

I do not own any of those.

Grahamulot wrote:
The odd thing is, the more I try to defend it, the more I know that it contains little valuable information besides a few minor tweaks, which is just odd.

A few minor tweaks, yes. I also thought it was meant to fill in the gap for those who didn't get the WD rules on time. But the recent FAQs just opened a new gap (not to mention Death from the Skies is English only, which leaves 1/3 of GW's customer base out).

Dumb move IMHO.

Was it confirmed that LGS' have no access to this supplement, rather than just limited/lower margin access?
Couldn't work out if Mikhaila was confirming that or just saying that noone would tell him.

 Kanluwen wrote:
This is a serious question:

How many people who play at shops own a copy of Apocalypse, Cities of Death, or Planetstrike?

Things like "Death from the Skies" strike me as more a "club purchase" at this point rather than an "individual purchase".

I own an ork army including an ork flyer, an ork codex and a copy of the rules.

Can I currently use my full ork army to play the game?

Yes or no.

 Kanluwen wrote:
This is a serious question:

How many people who play at shops more than at home/clubs where you would not have access to a store copy actually own a copy of Apocalypse, Cities of Death, or Planetstrike?

Things like "Death from the Skies" strike me as more a "club purchase" at this point rather than an "individual purchase".

I owned all three (sold two recently though) and play exclusively at FLGS. I used them for store themed games as well as private ones prior to the advent of 6th edition that I'm not particularly fond of.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kanluwen wrote:
This is a serious question:

How many people who play at shops more than at home/clubs where you would not have access to a store copy actually own a copy of Apocalypse, Cities of Death, or Planetstrike?

Things like "Death from the Skies" strike me as more a "club purchase" at this point rather than an "individual purchase".

I own IA: AOC 2nd edition, planet strike, Crusade of Fire and battle missions.

And, regrettably, I am probably going to buy this one as well.

 BarBoBot wrote:
If $35 is too much for you, surely you already knew this hobby was too expensive for you, because that's chump change compared to the startup cost of getting into the hobby.

You now have to factor this book into the startup costs with the way the rules work. Its not an 'optional' buy. Fliers are apart of sixth and even if your army doesnt have them, they will eventually. Until then, you will be playing against people whom do have them at times and youll be required to have the rules of those models; only through this book.

 Xzerios wrote:

 BarBoBot wrote:
If $35 is too much for you, surely you already knew this hobby was too expensive for you, because that's chump change compared to the startup cost of getting into the hobby.

You now have to factor this book into the startup costs with the way the rules work. Its not an 'optional' buy. Fliers are apart of sixth and even if your army doesnt have them, they will eventually. Until then, you will be playing against people whom do have them at times and youll be required to have the rules of those models; only through this book.

Since when do you have to have the rules for other people's models? Also, this compendium is not required for all flyers-- it's merely an update to the pre-6th edition flyers found in some armies.

Plus the shipping. You have to buy it from them and the pay them anothor almost $10 to ship it.
Since you have to buy it from them, they can charge you for almost 25% more just to get the
over priced FAQ.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
This is a serious question:

How many people who play at shops own a copy of Apocalypse, Cities of Death, or Planetstrike?

Things like "Death from the Skies" strike me as more a "club purchase" at this point rather than an "individual purchase".

I own an ork army including an ork flyer, an ork codex and a copy of the rules.

Can I currently use my full ork army to play the game?

Yes or no.

How should I know?
I haven't played in quite awhile--which is precisely why I asked this question, MGS. It wasn't meant to be a distraction or diversion. I was genuinely curious.

Personally, I would not be opposed to buying the book myself and being willing to "loan it out" when playing games against people who did not have the rules.