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 Albatross wrote:
Yeah, the importance of a decent anti-perspirant and cologne cannot be overstated. I wear Paul Smith for Men or YSL L'Homme (depending on the occasion) and they both go down well. If a woman actually TELLS you that you smell amazing (as opposed to just thinking it) it's a good start.

I never really got into wearing cologne - the smell kind of annoys me. I'd rather just smell like nothing

Yeah, I use speed stick original I've haven't had any complaints about smell.

When it comes to aftershave, I have a few that I switch between. The main one that I use at the moment is Encounter by Calvin Klein. I also have the Police - To Be aftershave which is cheap and cheerful. I'd recommend them both. I had a third one recently that was nice. Can't remember the damned name of it though.

We have one currently at the fitting rooms in our work which is pretty nice. I think it is Valentino by Valentino(?) . It's definitely called Valentino anyway. It's pretty nice but might not be for everybody as it has a bit of an ambiguous smell.

Just go into a large department store and have a nosey (in both senses!). I'd imagine it to be very hard for somebody to go in and not find something that they like.

Getting over the taking it personally part might take a while. Certainly I take things to heart too quickly sometimes and I'm learning not to or at least trying not to. The not giving a feth method is really good advice though.

Try not to put the person on too much of a pedestal.

I'd say that you should ask them out sooner rather than later, seize the opportunity to ask them. It took me three weeks to ask a girl from my work out because I was waiting for a decent moment and I missed a few just due to nerves. She did say yes though. Do or do not, there is no try.

Truth, attraction typically has a shelf life, it varies based on the intensity of the feels, but there is a shelf life, if you strike too soon, then you might not have built up enough attraction, if you wait too long, they might get over it, try to figure out the goldilocks timeframe (varies) and make your moves then.

Yeah, I waited a few weeks before trying to ask out a girl and now I think she's dropped out of the class so kind of missed my shot. Oh well, I'm thinking of going to the gym that way I can improve myself psychically and psychologically and maybe meet some girls plus I have a new friend in

film class so maybe I can meet some girls through networking with him.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

chaos0xomega wrote:
Truth, attraction typically has a shelf life, it varies based on the intensity of the feels, but there is a shelf life, if you strike too soon, then you might not have built up enough attraction, if you wait too long, they might get over it, try to figure out the goldilocks timeframe (varies) and make your moves then.

Yeah that's true, I think the cute girl in my econ class may have had a thing for me like through my peripherals I caught her a few times staring at me, does a bit of eye flirting when walking down the halls, when she's sitting in class would start spreading out her legs when I got near her, etc,

etc. Doesn't matter now though I don't see her anymore.

Aftershave wise: Joop or aramis.
Or, if you dont mind spending a bit more for special occasions, tom ford is great, just racks in at £320 a bottle for the decent ones.

Great points here anyway.

Get your life sorted out 1st.
The more stuff you have in your life the better as anything that does go wrong is no big deal.
As opposed to holding onto 1 thing, then if you lose it, you lose everything.

Im pretty lucky really that i do ground work for a living, so never had to really worry about going to the gym.
Ill only go there once or twice a week for boxing.

On another note, this might sounds weird, but thinking is pointless.
When you speak to friends, how often do you actually think about what you are about to say before you say it?

If your talking to a woman and stopping to think what to say, this just makes things worse.
Speaking your mind to some degree is always great as its actually portraying you, and what you are really like.

Dont lie.
Lying to make an excuse for something or cover something up is just dumb.
People see and hear alot, so is it worth making yourself look stupid infront of people?
Could also ruin something you have later on down the line.

Seems weird, but dont get into caring too much.
Best way to put yourself in the friendzone is if your always there for her/him and waiting hand and foot on them.
Granted you still need to care, just dont go OTT with it.

And as it keeps being posted, dont give a feth.
He who dares, wins.

Just reading through the thread and thought I'd drop in some advice. You guys do always seem to have the most pressure, so what I thought was that I'd drop in some advice for us girls, since some might be browsing this thread too, don't be afraid to ask the guy out on a date! There's a chance that some guys won't like this approach and would rather do it themselves, but you do have to remember that its a lot of unfair pressure on a guy to expect them to always ask you. So be confident and ask the guy out, you make it a bit easier for him and maybe even surprise them

 Glaiceana wrote:
Just reading through the thread and thought I'd drop in some advice. You guys do always seem to have the most pressure, so what I thought was that I'd drop in some advice for us girls, since some might be browsing this thread too, don't be afraid to ask the guy out on a date! There's a chance that some guys won't like this approach and would rather do it themselves, but you do have to remember that its a lot of unfair pressure on a guy to expect them to always ask you. So be confident and ask the guy out, you make it a bit easier for him and maybe even surprise them

Yeah, if you're just siting there hoping that a cute guy or girl is going to ask you out and you're not getting the results you want it's time to change your methods.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Truth, attraction typically has a shelf life, it varies based on the intensity of the feels, but there is a shelf life, if you strike too soon, then you might not have built up enough attraction, if you wait too long, they might get over it, try to figure out the goldilocks timeframe (varies) and make your moves then.

IMO, always err on the side of "striking too soon." At least your intentions are clear. IME, women generally make up their minds pretty quickly about whether men are worth a date or are only friends material. Come at them too slowly and you're gonna find yourself stuck in the friends category. The "friendzone" only exists because guys put themselves there. If you're interested, show it. It's just being honest, right? And if they're not interested, move on just as fast.

 gossipmeng wrote:

 Albatross wrote:
Yeah, the importance of a decent anti-perspirant and cologne cannot be overstated. I wear Paul Smith for Men or YSL L'Homme (depending on the occasion) and they both go down well. If a woman actually TELLS you that you smell amazing (as opposed to just thinking it) it's a good start.

I never really got into wearing cologne - the smell kind of annoys me. I'd rather just smell like nothing

I'm not really into wearing cologne either, nor am I that into perfume on a woman. I don't have a good nose for scents...I can hardly tell the difference between one perfume and another once they're wearing it. But women sure *love* that gak. So it's usually a good call IME, as long as you get yourself a decent scent (no cheap stuff). And a bottle will last you forever.

 Glaiceana wrote:
Just reading through the thread and thought I'd drop in some advice. You guys do always seem to have the most pressure, so what I thought was that I'd drop in some advice for us girls, since some might be browsing this thread too, don't be afraid to ask the guy out on a date! There's a chance that some guys won't like this approach and would rather do it themselves, but you do have to remember that its a lot of unfair pressure on a guy to expect them to always ask you. So be confident and ask the guy out, you make it a bit easier for him and maybe even surprise them

Hey Glaiceana. You busy this weekend? Fancy getting together for a drink?








See, it's not that difficult, guys!

 gorgon wrote:
The "friendzone" only exists because guys put themselves there.

No, it doesn't exist at all. The "friendzone" is a concept invented by whiny entitled s who can't stand the fact that the woman they're interested in doesn't want to sleep with them.

 Albatross wrote:

 Glaiceana wrote:
Just reading through the thread and thought I'd drop in some advice. You guys do always seem to have the most pressure, so what I thought was that I'd drop in some advice for us girls, since some might be browsing this thread too, don't be afraid to ask the guy out on a date! There's a chance that some guys won't like this approach and would rather do it themselves, but you do have to remember that its a lot of unfair pressure on a guy to expect them to always ask you. So be confident and ask the guy out, you make it a bit easier for him and maybe even surprise them

Hey Glaiceana. You busy this weekend? Fancy getting together for a drink?








See, it's not that difficult, guys!

There we go, example set everyone!

 Peregrine wrote:

No, it doesn't exist at all. The "friendzone" is a concept invented by whiny entitled s who can't stand the fact that the woman they're interested in doesn't want to sleep with them.

I think people conflate the "friendzone" with "friendzone + whining." While whining often follows, it doesn't necessarily have to, it's not an inherent feature of the "friendzone."

The friendzone is simple, if you have two people, and one wants more and makes that known, and the other makes it known that they will never be more than friends, then they've been placed in the "friendzone."

The problem is that a lot of guys weren't in the friendship to be friends in the first place, they were there to "earn" sex. Then they lash out.

But being friendzoned doesn't necessarily have to end that way. I've asked out a lot of women and gotten a lot of "no, I just want to be friends," and instead of cutting that person off or getting angry at them I've actually stayed friends with them (novel concept, that). Some of them are among my best friends. You can be friendzoned, and not act like a total jerk about it, since the friendzone is just the situation where someone you like has made it clear they only want to be friends. The "can't stand the fact that the woman they're interested in doesn't want to sleep with them" part is separate, and only comes up if the person didn't value the friendship in the first place. If you do value that friendship, you can be friendzoned and take it gracefully and stay friends.

Pro Tip: Look at her EYES while you're asking her out!

 Glaiceana wrote:

 Albatross wrote:

 Glaiceana wrote:
Just reading through the thread and thought I'd drop in some advice. You guys do always seem to have the most pressure, so what I thought was that I'd drop in some advice for us girls, since some might be browsing this thread too, don't be afraid to ask the guy out on a date! There's a chance that some guys won't like this approach and would rather do it themselves, but you do have to remember that its a lot of unfair pressure on a guy to expect them to always ask you. So be confident and ask the guy out, you make it a bit easier for him and maybe even surprise them

Hey Glaiceana. You busy this weekend? Fancy getting together for a drink?








See, it's not that difficult, guys!

There we go, example set everyone!

So what's your answer?

Get in shape
Pick up some interesting hobbies* that make you go out and meet people
Treat the women you meet like any other human.
Ask out the women you find attractive. No coworkers, no subordinates.

There. Date get.




(READ: Nothing any of the forums on this site are made to discuss. Nothing a 14yr old boy would think was cool that isn't a team sport)

 DogofWar1 wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

No, it doesn't exist at all. The "friendzone" is a concept invented by whiny entitled s who can't stand the fact that the woman they're interested in doesn't want to sleep with them.

I think people conflate the "friendzone" with "friendzone + whining." While whining often follows, it doesn't necessarily have to, it's not an inherent feature of the "friendzone."

The friendzone is simple, if you have two people, and one wants more and makes that known, and the other makes it known that they will never be more than friends, then they've been placed in the "friendzone."

The problem is that a lot of guys weren't in the friendship to be friends in the first place, they were there to "earn" sex. Then they lash out.

But being friendzoned doesn't necessarily have to end that way. I've asked out a lot of women and gotten a lot of "no, I just want to be friends," and instead of cutting that person off or getting angry at them I've actually stayed friends with them (novel concept, that). Some of them are among my best friends. You can be friendzoned, and not act like a total jerk about it, since the friendzone is just the situation where someone you like has made it clear they only want to be friends. The "can't stand the fact that the woman they're interested in doesn't want to sleep with them" part is separate, and only comes up if the person didn't value the friendship in the first place. If you do value that friendship, you can be friendzoned and take it gracefully and stay friends.

There is another school of thought that rejects the notion that men and women can be "just friends."

For women, this may not be true, but for many men this is true. Almost every woman I know with male friends...they all have a covert or overt sexual interest in her. To that point, I have no female "friends" that fall outside one of the following categories: Significant others of male friends, women I'm sleeping with (friends with "benefits"), and women with friends I want to sleep with. The rest are just acquaintances, to be honest with you.

Shower and deodorant.

 Albatross wrote:

 Glaiceana wrote:

 Albatross wrote:

 Glaiceana wrote:
Just reading through the thread and thought I'd drop in some advice. You guys do always seem to have the most pressure, so what I thought was that I'd drop in some advice for us girls, since some might be browsing this thread too, don't be afraid to ask the guy out on a date! There's a chance that some guys won't like this approach and would rather do it themselves, but you do have to remember that its a lot of unfair pressure on a guy to expect them to always ask you. So be confident and ask the guy out, you make it a bit easier for him and maybe even surprise them

Hey Glaiceana. You busy this weekend? Fancy getting together for a drink?




See, it's not that difficult, guys!

There we go, example set everyone!

So what's your answer?

For the sake of this thread, sure

 dogma wrote:

 sebster wrote:
To learn to just move on when a girl says no. It isn't ever easier, but it gets easier with age, and easier the more you try it.

In the same vein I'll say that getting your life in order absent the relationship is also important. If a girl turns me down I'll still be a healthy, successful man in his late 20's. This, of course, ties back into Albatross' point about confidence and will make you more attractive overall; regardless of sex and gender.

Isn't that a little harder for someone in there early to mid 20's (or younger) as they're often still going through school working a gakky part time job maybe still living with their parents (to save money) or living in dorm/apartment or would the standards be different for those demographics like

being in decent shape, a healthy social life, having a car, etc?

 Glaiceana wrote:

 Albatross wrote:

 Glaiceana wrote:

 Albatross wrote:

 Glaiceana wrote:
Just reading through the thread and thought I'd drop in some advice. You guys do always seem to have the most pressure, so what I thought was that I'd drop in some advice for us girls, since some might be browsing this thread too, don't be afraid to ask the guy out on a date! There's a chance that some guys won't like this approach and would rather do it themselves, but you do have to remember that its a lot of unfair pressure on a guy to expect them to always ask you. So be confident and ask the guy out, you make it a bit easier for him and maybe even surprise them

Hey Glaiceana. You busy this weekend? Fancy getting together for a drink?




See, it's not that difficult, guys!

There we go, example set everyone!

So what's your answer?

For the sake of this thread, sure

Stop making it look this simple! >.<

We need more excuses NOT to ask people, not reasons to do it!

To be fair it's a lot easier to be bold over the internet (imo) plus it helps that Alby lives in the same country.

 Cheesecat wrote:

Isn't that a little harder for someone in there early to mid 20's (or younger) as they're often still going through school working a gakky part time job maybe still living with their parents (to save money) or living in dorm/apartment or would the standards be different for those demographics like being decent, a healthy social life, having a car, etc?

Oh, definitely. First off, being more financially presentable definitely helps; sooner or later, the person you're with is going to come to understand your financial situation, and the better off you are, the more likely you are to not be rejected because of that. All things being equal, the wealthier you are, the better off you'll be.

It also messes with confidence too. If you're living with your parents it will likely impair your "hunting" because obviously no one wants to go back to their parents place. I'm in sort of a limbo-esque situation where I may have to move home in my final year of schooling. I might not have to, but not knowing if I'm going to be in an apartment of my own in 3 months does cause problems, especially if I'm stuck there for a full year. I agree that having that stability gives confidence, since it sort of affirms the idea that, indeed, your life has worth, versus having to sort of fake your worth with an almost certain falling out later.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 NuggzTheNinja wrote:

There is another school of thought that rejects the notion that men and women can be "just friends."

For women, this may not be true, but for many men this is true. Almost every woman I know with male friends...they all have a covert or overt sexual interest in her. To that point, I have no female "friends" that fall outside one of the following categories: Significant others of male friends, women I'm sleeping with (friends with "benefits"), and women with friends I want to sleep with. The rest are just acquaintances, to be honest with you.

I think the idea that many guys can't be "just friends" has some weight, but I think it kind of depends on whether one believes one can still be friends while still being attracted to them.

Like, for example, with my friends who are girls who I have asked out and gotten nos from, if the opportunity presented itself, I'd certainly want to advance it beyond mere friendship, there's still attraction there, at least with some of them. That being said, I can live, associate, and do things with them as a friend, and am willing to not force the issue. And there are some girls I'm friends with who I'm not really attracted to that I hang out with a lot too. I consider them all friends, similar or same to many guy friends I have.

But, of course, how each person defines friend isn't necessarily the same.

I dunno, I think you can be friends with women as a man. Just because you think somebody is fethable doesn't mean they can't be your friend and sometimes you just think she's cool on her own merits besides having tits.

Yeah. "Guys can't be friends with girls" usually means the person in question spends too much time thinking with the downstairs brain.

 Albatross wrote:
Truth. I met a stripper in Nashville who was a massive Dr. Who fan and, as it turns out, anglophile.

I never met a stripper .

 Albatross wrote:

Because I feel like at every step during my education, I had to be given a second chance, or have pityed my way in, rather than actually just succeed at anything. Because it seems I can not just focus on work, and will always look for something else, anything really, to do instead, and that will just certainly create big problems for me in some close future. Because I can not even get a decent amount of sleep because no matter how many time I decide that I will impose on myself a rigorous sleep schedule, when it is time to sleep, I always have an irresistible urge to do something else, anything really, rather than sleeping. Because I have absolutely no willpower whatsoever, and my life is so much worse than what it could be (not that I am complaining about my life, I am way too lucky for it not to be obscene, but that will not make me to like myself). Because there is such a gap between what I want to do, and what I actually do.
Getting a girlfriend would just be icing on the cake !

You just described the life of literally almost everyone, more or less. To a certain extent.

No . I have eyes to see, and it is not like that for everyone, far from it.

 Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:
On a related note, GROOM. Shower regularly, brush your teeth twice a day, floss, wear good deodorant/cologne*, get a flattering haircut.

I really stepped up on my hygiene recently, basically going from one bath a week to one shower every morning. I also got some deodorant, but as I am one of those extremely annoying animal-rights guys, I buy mine from Fresh Body Shop, because they do not do tests on animals. I found one called Activist and I have no idea if it is a good one since I have an extremely weak sense of smell anyway.

chaos0xomega wrote:
I know lots of girls that are into really really heavy/dark metal, rockabilly, bands I've never heard of, *insert arbitrary, random, and superfluous sub-genre here*, etc.

Psychobilly is not superfluous, it is awesome !
Except if you are speaking about sub-genre of psychobilly, in which case okay, having subsubsubgenres can be something a bit too much. But it seems to me it is really metal that is prone to subsubsubsubgenring.
By the way, what is very dark metal ? Black metal ? Sorry, TRVE KVLT EV1L BLACK METVL ? Or more like doom metal ?
Metal is quite mainstream anyway, nowadays .

chaos0xomega wrote:
I found my experience with ROTC helped me out a lot in many, many ways (although in a sense it damaged me, because my tolerance for the level of bs in the civilian world has dropped through the floor, probably why I'm trying to get into OTS/OCS so badly lol).

TOTC ? OTS ? OCS ?
Anyway, the military made a hobo of John Rambo, what would it make of me ?

chaos0xomega wrote:
Seriously though, military service in France is a good bit different than in the US, aside from the standard issue white flags (JOKING!!!), they tend to do the humanitarian/peacekeeping thing primarily (rather than being used as a warfighting/political instrument) more like the National Guard in the US

Well, those French soldiers in Afghanistan still got to exchange a few gunshot against those insurgents, did they not ? As for those sent in Mali certainly got to shoot a few Islamists too.
I guess I can ask my cousins in the legion about the French military operation, and how peaceful they are. Though of course, well, they are in the legion, so… not exactly the most peaceful part of the army (for those that do not know, the French foreign legion is basically a group of foreign totally not criminals recruited into an elite corp of the French army, often under a false identity. When they finish their service, or if they are grievously armed, they get a French citizenship. Until then, they live 100% with the other legionnaires, almost no contact with civilian word as far as I understood. They are the most likely to get the very dangerous missions, as far as I know. My cousins are not foreign not-criminals though, they are officers .)

chaos0xomega wrote:
This is dangerous advice to give if the person receiving it has a different perspective on what it means to dress well and groom. What you're trying to tell them is to dress in a trendy and sophisticated manner, for example by wearing a grey tailored suit with brown leather wingtip shoes and matching brown belt, perhaps a pink button up beneath the jacket with the top two buttons undone to reveal a white crew neck underneath... what they *MIGHT* be hearing is "Oh, so I should put on my best black leather trenchcoat with my favorite black Megadeath t-shirt and the black pants with neon green accents I got at Hot Topic with the chains crossed behind the back and my studded arm bracelets, etc. etc.

I am pretty sure the second outfit would be better to flirt at a metal concert . I know Hot Topic, it is the place that turn kids into vampire in South Park. The goth kids burned it down. I like the goth kids. They listen to good music.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Better, try suggesting that someone looking to improve their fashion sense and style pick up say... Mens Health, or perhaps check out askmen.com or similar sites online...

Uh, really ?

 Chongara wrote:
Treat the women you meet like any other human.

I do. End result : I do not get dates with any human .

 Chongara wrote:
Ask out the women you find attractive. No coworkers, no subordinates.

So it is not okay to ask my student out ? They are above the age of consent, and I only get to grade them in one subject, I can not make them to pass or double on my own !
(Kidding, of course. And anyway, even if I wanted to, this year, among those 36 students, got a grand total of zero girls. Ahhh, teaching computer engineering !)

 Albatross wrote:
Hey Glaiceana. You busy this weekend? Fancy getting together for a drink?








See, it's not that difficult, guys!

If you do get to travel to West Midlands today or tomorrow to actually meet her, that would much more convincing that if you do not .

 Da Boss wrote:
Yeah. "Guys can't be friends with girls" usually means the person in question spends too much time thinking with the downstairs brain.

That's a little bit harsh no? It's not an issue of wanting to bang every woman I associate with. It's more the issue that I've yet to meet a single woman worth the time investment of "just friends."

For the most part, my male friends are into male-oriented hobbies: shooting, hunting, working out, beer brewing, 40k, etc. If I met a woman who was into all that, then we could be friends. Snowball's chance in hell of that happening.

That's not to say that I don't share interests with women - TV, cooking, running, hiking, etc. But I can do all of that with my male friends too, plus we can talk about the things I actually enjoy doing as hobbies while we do them. On the other hand, if all I have in common with someone is TV, cooking, running, hiking, etc., they aren't really worth the time investment as a friend unless there are other things at play.



Case in point: last night actually lol. Met up with a female friend...we are JUST FRIENDS. Both have a little too much to drink, she comes over "because I need to try this wine!" and one episode of Archer later shenanigans are happening. Completely unintentional, never to be repeated, etc. but I've never gotten smashed with a buddy and made out with him

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
This is dangerous advice to give if the person receiving it has a different perspective on what it means to dress well and groom. What you're trying to tell them is to dress in a trendy and sophisticated manner, for example by wearing a grey tailored suit with brown leather wingtip shoes and matching brown belt, perhaps a pink button up beneath the jacket with the top two buttons undone to reveal a white crew neck underneath... what they *MIGHT* be hearing is "Oh, so I should put on my best black leather trenchcoat with my favorite black Megadeath t-shirt and the black pants with neon green accents I got at Hot Topic with the chains crossed behind the back and my studded arm bracelets, etc. etc.

I am pretty sure the second outfit would be better to flirt at a metal concert . I know Hot Topic, it is the place that turn kids into vampire in South Park. The goth kids burned it down. I like the goth kids. They listen to good music.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Better, try suggesting that someone looking to improve their fashion sense and style pick up say... Mens Health, or perhaps check out askmen.com or similar sites online...

Uh, really ?

I dunno, I've been to some metal concerts (not overwhelmingly heavy/dark gak though, Animals As Leaders last night as a matter of fact), and people wear pretty normal clothes for the most part... and definitely not hot topic style stuff lol. Granted the outfit I described is to pick up a 'normal' girl in mainstream society, I tend towards the rocker and artsy chicks (with the occasional rockabilly type) myself, but I know how to dress well enough that I can draw that kind of girl while still fitting in to a more mainstream crowd.

If you are trying to get the goth/metalhead type, you're on your own. Thats a subculture/counterculture I really can't wrap my head around (which is to say I've tried dating those kinds of girls before and have had absolutely no luck whatsoever).

Case in point: last night actually lol. Met up with a female friend...we are JUST FRIENDS. Both have a little too much to drink, she comes over "because I need to try this wine!" and one episode of Archer later shenanigans are happening. Completely unintentional, never to be repeated, etc. but I've never gotten smashed with a buddy and made out with him

Sounds like my kinda woman...


SO ANYWAY,

Alby/Glaiceana, how'd the date go? Inquiring minds want to know!

I'm pretty sure Glaiceana is a dude and as far as I'm aware Alby is straight.

 Cheesecat wrote:
I'm pretty sure Glaiceana is a dude and as far as I'm aware Alby is straight.

Spoiler:

Based on the deviantART link in her signature, and the fact that the picture you linked is several years old, as well as the part where she said she was female, I'm fairly certain that she's not a dude.