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 TedNugent wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:


Curze is specifically described as being taller than Guilliman or Lion.

How much taller though?

Relative heights don't really mean anything unless we get the actual measurement.

Well let me get out my inch ruler and measure Guilliman, Lion and Curze and get back to you with a precise measurement of their height so you can be fully informed on the precise measurements of your fictional heroes.

Relative information is important, let me tell you why. When an archaeologist is looking at samples from a dig site, he may use radiometric dating of a molecule taken from a sample and using a half life which is pre-measured he may absolutely date the sample. However not every artifact or sample within a given layer may have that same molecule which is convenient for date measurements. Therefore you might take a sample from a higher soil layer and a lower soil layer in a dig site, absolutely date them, then compare the results to samples taken from layers in between those two layers that have been radiometrically dated to say that something between those two layers is between those two dates. So if the top layer has an artifact that is, say, 1,000 years old, and the third layer has a sample that is 2000 years old, you can then say that the 2nd layer is between 1,000 and 2,000 years old.

We know that a space marine is 8 feet tall. One of the books describes Vulkan as a big primarch, and I believe (I'm frankly not going to comb back through looking for this quote) it says he is over 3 meters in height. Curze is described as being very tall but gaunt, taller than Lion who is in turn taller than Guilliman. So probably Vulkan ~= Curze > Lion > Guilliman > Space Marine. So the average Primarch is probably slightly taller than 3 meters with some substantial variance, while wearing their armor.

Angels of Caliban says that Curze looks much less tall when he is not wearing his armor, and his armor doesn't exactly look like he's wearing stilettos, so I'm guessing that all Primarchs are also shorter outside of their armor.

Yeah, I know you can't measure a fictional character.

However, the writers COULD state: "This character is 10' 4" tall."

Then you don't have to measure them.

Also... Uhh... I think I'm gonna go back to arguing about WoW lore. On WoW forums.

The people on this forum are weird... they have to guess at how power armor affects a person's height.

Well I'm not an author sanctioned by GW. Sorry.

One of the HH books says "over 3 meters tall." That's all I've got.

 TedNugent wrote:
Well I'm not an author sanctioned by GW. Sorry.

One of the HH books says "over 3 meters tall." That's all I've got.

I know. I wasn't suggesting you write it personally.

Also, you know what's over 3 meters? 3.5 meters. 3.2 meters. 4 meters. 5 meters. 10 meters. 1 kilometer. 1 light-year. I could keep going, but I don't actually know how big the universe is in terms of light years, so I wouldn't know when to stop adding 0s.

I'm not too keen on some of the height descriptions and prefer to imagine space marines at, on average, 7 feet and the primarchs 8-9. Maybe Alpharius at 7.5. It may not be canon but who cares?

 Snake Tortoise wrote:
I'm not too keen on some of the height descriptions and prefer to imagine space marines at, on average, 7 feet and the primarchs 8-9. Maybe Alpharius at 7.5. It may not be canon but who cares?

You do.

Because you're posting in a thread about how tall Primarchs are.

And then you talked about a bunch of random numbers about Space Marine and Primarch heights, that you then acknowledged were not canon.

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
I love the primarch concept.

Then the Emperor being above them is even cooler.

BRB hides among humans, looks just like a homeless dude in a brown cloak as the world changes.

BRB time to reveal myself, I'm actually 10 feet tall, 8% bodyfat, 400 lbs lean with sick hair and the best facial aesthetics you've ever seen. Combined with elite fighting prowess, immeasurable intelligence, political acumen never before seen in history and I'm psychic too. Ehhhhhhhhh call me Mary-Sue.

So he's a shapeshifter?

Considering his achievements throughout time, and being able to do it all low-key, 'revealing himself' when humanity needed it - he has an ability, at least to some degree - to disguise himself completely.

Not a shapeshifter proper, but at least able to hide his true self, yes. I always interpreted it as a psychic power. Essentially he can control how humans around him actually 'see' him with a psychic projection of sorts.

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
I love the primarch concept.

Then the Emperor being above them is even cooler.

BRB hides among humans, looks just like a homeless dude in a brown cloak as the world changes.

BRB time to reveal myself, I'm actually 10 feet tall, 8% bodyfat, 400 lbs lean with sick hair and the best facial aesthetics you've ever seen. Combined with elite fighting prowess, immeasurable intelligence, political acumen never before seen in history and I'm psychic too. Ehhhhhhhhh call me Mary-Sue.

So he's a shapeshifter?

Considering his achievements throughout time, and being able to do it all low-key, 'revealing himself' when humanity needed it - he has an ability, at least to some degree - to disguise himself completely.

Not a shapeshifter proper, but at least able to hide his true self, yes. I always interpreted it as a psychic power. Essentially he can control how humans around him actually 'see' him with a psychic projection of sorts.

Didn't the original Deatwing librarian (Two-heads talking? ) used that trick itself to walk along his world disguissed as a normal *tribal* guy when he was really walking by on his terminator armour?

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
I love the primarch concept.

Then the Emperor being above them is even cooler.

BRB hides among humans, looks just like a homeless dude in a brown cloak as the world changes.

BRB time to reveal myself, I'm actually 10 feet tall, 8% bodyfat, 400 lbs lean with sick hair and the best facial aesthetics you've ever seen. Combined with elite fighting prowess, immeasurable intelligence, political acumen never before seen in history and I'm psychic too. Ehhhhhhhhh call me Mary-Sue.

So he's a shapeshifter?

Considering his achievements throughout time, and being able to do it all low-key, 'revealing himself' when humanity needed it - he has an ability, at least to some degree - to disguise himself completely.

Not a shapeshifter proper, but at least able to hide his true self, yes. I always interpreted it as a psychic power. Essentially he can control how humans around him actually 'see' him with a psychic projection of sorts.

So how can we ever know what he "really" looks like? We're basically taking him at his word, and he's deceived us before.

I much prefer the primarchs to be normal marine sized. If your 'powers' are rooted in arcane science and the blood line of the most powerful man who ever lived, size does little for you. In the same way Superman doesn't need to be 10 feet tall to do what he does, nor do the primarchs. Sanguinius is all the more impressive battling a bloodthirster if he's not almost as big as it.

I also own the original Leman Russ primarch figure so we can confidently say *at one point* GW didn't consider them giants. More creep I guess.

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
I love the primarch concept.

Then the Emperor being above them is even cooler.

BRB hides among humans, looks just like a homeless dude in a brown cloak as the world changes.

BRB time to reveal myself, I'm actually 10 feet tall, 8% bodyfat, 400 lbs lean with sick hair and the best facial aesthetics you've ever seen. Combined with elite fighting prowess, immeasurable intelligence, political acumen never before seen in history and I'm psychic too. Ehhhhhhhhh call me Mary-Sue.

So he's a shapeshifter?

Considering his achievements throughout time, and being able to do it all low-key, 'revealing himself' when humanity needed it - he has an ability, at least to some degree - to disguise himself completely.

Not a shapeshifter proper, but at least able to hide his true self, yes. I always interpreted it as a psychic power. Essentially he can control how humans around him actually 'see' him with a psychic projection of sorts.

So how can we ever know what he "really" looks like? We're basically taking him at his word, and he's deceived us before.

Yeah absolutely, it could definitely be deception. He may truly be some cloud of intelligent ethereal dust for all humanity knows. I just feel that he made the primarchs in his image - but a tier or two below him to keep order if he had to and be able to rein them in - and so the Emperor we know is probably his 'preferred' or 'real' state. This is one of those things GW will likely never really explore, and will be head canon for a long time for most people.

In any case, I like the concepts of the primarchs and the Emperor being supremely above humanity, with the Astartes as the bridge joining that divide. It all works out nicely imo.

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
Yeah absolutely, it could definitely be deception. He may truly be some cloud of intelligent ethereal dust for all humanity knows. I just feel that he made the primarchs in his image - but a tier or two below him to keep order if he had to and be able to rein them in - and so the Emperor we know is probably his 'preferred' or 'real' state. This is one of those things GW will likely never really explore, and will be head canon for a long time for most people.

In any case, I like the concepts of the primarchs and the Emperor being supremely above humanity, with the Astartes as the bridge joining that divide. It all works out nicely imo.

Uhh, he made the Primarchs from his own genetic material. And he thinks of them as his sons. Because they are. He also considered himself to be a human, but a very, very powerful one. He didn't consider himself superior to ordinary humans, just to have a power that they lacked. And his aim was to elevate humanity, not oppress it. The 40th Millennium Imperium really is a perversion of all that the Emperor wanted. The Emperor was even tolerant of xenos, so long as they were peaceful species who didn't bother the Imperium.

However, the Primarchs were not obscenely powerful warp entities like him. They were merely clones of his physical body, though each was a bit unique, maybe altered slightly in genetics, and of course their upbringing on different planets meant they each were raised uniquely. It wasn't an attempt for the Emperor to keep control over them, since he wasn't expecting to ever be betrayed, it was just because none of them were actually like him.

However, I imagine that the Emperor's usual depiction in Horus Heresy lore was accurate. He might have illusionary powers to keep from being discovered when needed, but there's no need to keep his real body hidden in the 30th millennium, when most of humanity is working for him.

But... what's happened recently in WH40k that's made it so that people don't know all this? What have they done with the lore that people on a 40k Background forum don't know this stuff? What the hell got retconned?

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
Yeah absolutely, it could definitely be deception. He may truly be some cloud of intelligent ethereal dust for all humanity knows. I just feel that he made the primarchs in his image - but a tier or two below him to keep order if he had to and be able to rein them in - and so the Emperor we know is probably his 'preferred' or 'real' state. This is one of those things GW will likely never really explore, and will be head canon for a long time for most people.

In any case, I like the concepts of the primarchs and the Emperor being supremely above humanity, with the Astartes as the bridge joining that divide. It all works out nicely imo.

Uhh, he made the Primarchs from his own genetic material. And he thinks of them as his sons. Because they are. He also considered himself to be a human, but a very, very powerful one. He didn't consider himself superior to ordinary humans, just to have a power that they lacked. And his aim was to elevate humanity, not oppress it. The 40th Millennium Imperium really is a perversion of all that the Emperor wanted. The Emperor was even tolerant of xenos, so long as they were peaceful species who didn't bother the Imperium.

However, the Primarchs were not obscenely powerful warp entities like him. They were merely clones of his physical body, though each was a bit unique, maybe altered slightly in genetics, and of course their upbringing on different planets meant they each were raised uniquely. It wasn't an attempt for the Emperor to keep control over them, since he wasn't expecting to ever be betrayed, it was just because none of them were actually like him.

However, I imagine that the Emperor's usual depiction in Horus Heresy lore was accurate. He might have illusionary powers to keep from being discovered when needed, but there's no need to keep his real body hidden in the 30th millennium, when most of humanity is working for him.

But... what's happened recently in WH40k that's made it so that people don't know all this? What have they done with the lore that people on a 40k Background forum don't know this stuff? What the hell got retconned?

Lol, relax dude.

My point was he isn't like other humans, nor are the primarchs. The thread was about our opinions on them being freaks of nature in comparison to the rest of us. I know he made the primarchs from his own genetic material, but they ARE scaled down from him. This is clear in every aspect of their reverence for him and that he even defeated a 4-God supercharged Horus.

I guess 40K lore is really serious business and we can't talk about it unless we cover every bit of lore covered in the HH books, though. Not all of us have ironclad knowledge of the background, I only started the Horus Heresy books in the past few months, currently on my 7th one. You don't need to wet yourself.

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
Yeah absolutely, it could definitely be deception. He may truly be some cloud of intelligent ethereal dust for all humanity knows. I just feel that he made the primarchs in his image - but a tier or two below him to keep order if he had to and be able to rein them in - and so the Emperor we know is probably his 'preferred' or 'real' state. This is one of those things GW will likely never really explore, and will be head canon for a long time for most people.

In any case, I like the concepts of the primarchs and the Emperor being supremely above humanity, with the Astartes as the bridge joining that divide. It all works out nicely imo.

Uhh, he made the Primarchs from his own genetic material. And he thinks of them as his sons. Because they are. He also considered himself to be a human, but a very, very powerful one. He didn't consider himself superior to ordinary humans, just to have a power that they lacked. And his aim was to elevate humanity, not oppress it. The 40th Millennium Imperium really is a perversion of all that the Emperor wanted. The Emperor was even tolerant of xenos, so long as they were peaceful species who didn't bother the Imperium.

However, the Primarchs were not obscenely powerful warp entities like him. They were merely clones of his physical body, though each was a bit unique, maybe altered slightly in genetics, and of course their upbringing on different planets meant they each were raised uniquely. It wasn't an attempt for the Emperor to keep control over them, since he wasn't expecting to ever be betrayed, it was just because none of them were actually like him.

However, I imagine that the Emperor's usual depiction in Horus Heresy lore was accurate. He might have illusionary powers to keep from being discovered when needed, but there's no need to keep his real body hidden in the 30th millennium, when most of humanity is working for him.

But... what's happened recently in WH40k that's made it so that people don't know all this? What have they done with the lore that people on a 40k Background forum don't know this stuff? What the hell got retconned?

Lol, relax dude.

My point was he isn't like other humans, nor are the primarchs. The thread was about our opinions on them being freaks of nature in comparison to the rest of us. I know he made the primarchs from his own genetic material, but they ARE scaled down from him. This is clear in every aspect of their reverence for him and that he even defeated a 4-God supercharged Horus.

I guess 40K lore is really serious business and we can't talk about it unless we cover every bit of lore covered in the HH books, though. Not all of us have ironclad knowledge of the background, I only started the Horus Heresy books in the past few months, currently on my 7th one. You don't need to wet yourself.

I haven't read a single Horus Heresy book in my life. This is just basic 40k stuff. From like, Codices.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure the powers that be consider the Codexes and suchlike to be more correct than the fiction and novels, so you're at somewhat of a disadvantage.

As to your comment that 'the writers COULD state: "This character is 10' 4" tall." '. I suppose they could, but I'm not sure what relevance that sort of info-dump would have. Homer didn't pause in the middle of the Iliad to give us Hector's inside leg measurement. Marines are bigger than humans, Primarchs are bigger than them. That'll do me. It's the increasing amount of bigger-ness that bugs me. I can ignore it, except when I field Fulgrim on the tabletop.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
Unfortunately, I'm not sure the powers that be consider the Codexes and suchlike to be more correct than the fiction and novels, so you're at somewhat of a disadvantage.

As to your comment that 'the writers COULD state: "This character is 10' 4" tall." '. I suppose they could, but I'm not sure what relevance that sort of info-dump would have. Homer didn't pause in the middle of the Iliad to give us Hector's inside leg measurement. Marines are bigger than humans, Primarchs are bigger than them. That'll do me. It's the increasing amount of bigger-ness that bugs me. I can ignore it, except when I field Fulgrim on the tabletop.

Did they stop including fiction in the Codices at some point recently?

Personally I think it does the Primarchs (and the Emperor) a disservice to focus on them being gigantic warriors. Yes, they were unsurpassable warriors, but their real strengths should have been in their generalship, logistics, diplomacy and intuition. Something that could have such a more dramatic effect than a single OP warrior out of a whole galaxy of battles.

That said, I understand why GW did what they did. While 30K was largely myth (or the setting of epic games), it made sense for the primarchs to have a generalship focus. With the narrower character based focus of the HH book series, and the skirmish+ level focus of the HH game it is understandable to want to focus on the battlefield presence of the Primarchs.

 Pouncey wrote:

 Ynneadwraith wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 Ynneadwraith wrote:
Yeah the Emperor isn't human. If his origin story is true (and not Imperial dogma), then he's a warp-born entity formed from the amalgamated souls of many powerful psykers.

The Primarchs aren't human either. They're genetically and biologically engineered war machines.

Space Marines are human. The Imperium really doesn't like genetic engineering as it messes with 'the holy human form'. Space Marines skirt around the edge of this by taking ordinary humans and implanting genetically engineered organs into them. If you cloned a Space Marine, you'd get a standard human. Their genetic structure is untouched.

Think of them as normal humans with mechanical implants, except instead of being made of metal, the implants are biological in nature.

Didn't you just say that the Emperor genetically-engineered the Primarchs?

Yet the Imperium doesn't like genetic engineering?

Like, you said those two things back to back, and you didn't see any contradiction?

Yep. That's one of the contradictions behind the insane dogma that the imperium believes in. Genetic engineering is taboo, but it's fine and holy when the emperor does it. The imperium is founded on hypocracy.

Besides, when the emperor made the primarchs there was no imperium to speak of, or imperial faith either.

Maybe what happened is that the Imperium doesn't believe in the same things the Emperor does, because he died 10,000 years ago and no one remembers what he did or why.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Well, except Bjorn. He was around 10,000 years earlier. So were the Primarchs.

So I think the following is what would happen.

Space Wolf: "Bjorn! We're gonna wake up Roboute!"

Bjorn: "Great! Can I be there when it happens? I want to talk with him right when he wakes up and fill him in on all the things that happened in the last 10,000 years!"

Then Bjorn asks for some privacy before Roboute does something crazy like say the Emperor is not a God. He would tell him what the hell happened, and just go along with it, and keep his mouth shut, because these are not the same Space Marines that were around when Roboute went to sleep, so he should just keep his opinions to himself, tow the company line, and STAY. ALIVE.

Hmmm... So do old Dreads really go crazy? Or is it the chapter becomes crazy which makes their older Dreads seem out of touch to them?

As to not including specific numbers for heights, etc? I think that allows readers to have a degree of say in how tall their primarchs are.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Given that one of their primary roles is boarding spaceships and invading command centers, being giants isn't going to help them.

To be fair, ship corridors and the like seem very oversized and able to fit them. Space Marines are not the only big lugs whose job it is to fight in such environments; consider another group of infamous boarding action specialists.

nareik wrote:
As to not including specific numbers for heights, etc? I think that allows readers to have a degree of say in how tall their primarchs are.

I'm confused why that's a thing that the writers need to work around and why fans need to know it.

 Pouncey wrote:

nareik wrote:
As to not including specific numbers for heights, etc? I think that allows readers to have a degree of say in how tall their primarchs are.

I'm confused why that's a thing that the writers need to work around and why fans need to know it.

It's a specific, which perhaps stifles creativity.

I think that is the reason the background is so fuzzy, aka fluff.

nareik wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

nareik wrote:
As to not including specific numbers for heights, etc? I think that allows readers to have a degree of say in how tall their primarchs are.

I'm confused why that's a thing that the writers need to work around and why fans need to know it.

It's a specific, which perhaps stifles creativity.

I think that is the reason the background is so fuzzy, aka fluff.

Why exactly does it matter how tall the Primarchs were?

I don't know, but clearly it matters to some people, so at least they all get to believe whatever they prefer to believe.

nareik wrote:
I don't know, but clearly it matters to some people, so at least they all get to believe whatever they prefer to believe.

Okay then.

They could do that anyways though.

I dislike the idea of primarchs and primeorks in general.

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
I love the primarch concept.

Then the Emperor being above them is even cooler.

BRB hides among humans, looks just like a homeless dude in a brown cloak as the world changes.

BRB time to reveal myself, I'm actually 10 feet tall, 8% bodyfat, 400 lbs lean with sick hair and the best facial aesthetics you've ever seen. Combined with elite fighting prowess, immeasurable intelligence, political acumen never before seen in history and I'm psychic too. Ehhhhhhhhh call me Mary-Sue.

So he's a shapeshifter?

Considering his achievements throughout time, and being able to do it all low-key, 'revealing himself' when humanity needed it - he has an ability, at least to some degree - to disguise himself completely.

Not a shapeshifter proper, but at least able to hide his true self, yes. I always interpreted it as a psychic power. Essentially he can control how humans around him actually 'see' him with a psychic projection of sorts.

So how can we ever know what he "really" looks like? We're basically taking him at his word, and he's deceived us before.

The implication is that he looks like a normal dude - 'Revalation' is a character in The Last Church who is the Emperor with no glittering aura - now the glowing giant could be real and the normal dude the projection, except that when Corax first meets him he initially sees someone who looks like revalation until the image of 'The Emperor' sonewhat glitchily overlays him and ultimately sticks. Since it's hinted that Corax is mid-level pariah (compare his 'dont notice me' ability to beta bequin) it's a sensible assumption that his first impression is the (more) genuine one.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Given that one of their primary roles is boarding spaceships and invading command centers, being giants isn't going to help them.

To be fair, ship corridors and the like seem very oversized and able to fit them. Space Marines are not the only big lugs whose job it is to fight in such environments; consider another group of infamous boarding action specialists.

Not to take anything away from your point, it was well made.
Don't Ogryns suck at their job?

 Dakka Wolf wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Given that one of their primary roles is boarding spaceships and invading command centers, being giants isn't going to help them.

To be fair, ship corridors and the like seem very oversized and able to fit them. Space Marines are not the only big lugs whose job it is to fight in such environments; consider another group of infamous boarding action specialists.

Not to take anything away from your point, it was well made.
Don't Ogryns suck at their job?

Not in 30k for the most part.

 Pouncey wrote:

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
Unfortunately, I'm not sure the powers that be consider the Codexes and suchlike to be more correct than the fiction and novels, so you're at somewhat of a disadvantage.

As to your comment that 'the writers COULD state: "This character is 10' 4" tall." '. I suppose they could, but I'm not sure what relevance that sort of info-dump would have. Homer didn't pause in the middle of the Iliad to give us Hector's inside leg measurement. Marines are bigger than humans, Primarchs are bigger than them. That'll do me. It's the increasing amount of bigger-ness that bugs me. I can ignore it, except when I field Fulgrim on the tabletop.

Did they stop including fiction in the Codices at some point recently?

If you insist on nitpicking ... it was quicker than typing "the short stories, audio dramas, short pieces in supplements and novels". There's never been much in the way of stories in the Codexes - as opposed to the pseudo-factual descriptive text. The fact remains; the vast majority of the Heresy background isn't in Codexes or even Forge World's book, so you're arguing from a position of ignorance if you've not read anything else.

Part of the problem I have is that the Marines and Primarchs are so inhuman in their psychology that they're not interesting IMO to read about. The colour pieces in 1st edition Space Marine did a good job - even to 11-year-old me - of explaining the sense of betrayal, confusion and frustration felt by the troops on both sides. The newer fiction, not so much

I hate every model that is huge so yes, i dislike the idea of the Primarchs being giant freaks. IMHO they should have ghazgkull size, that is a model that i consider big without being huge, so i found it balanced.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Given that one of their primary roles is boarding spaceships and invading command centers, being giants isn't going to help them.

To be fair, ship corridors and the like seem very oversized and able to fit them. Space Marines are not the only big lugs whose job it is to fight in such environments; consider another group of infamous boarding action specialists.

Yeah that's certainly true, and a lot of imperial architecture seems to be made for the grand of scale. But is there a real benefit to being so big? Do the benefits (if any) outweigh the downsides? Are all imperial structures, across a billion worlds, built with the Standardized Imperial Construction Codes which allow even the biggest abhumans to travel without hinderance? Is is beneficial to have a leader who can't even ride in the most standard of army transports (Rhinos) of the forces under his command?

Like, I'm not a small guy, I'm 6'2". But last year the NFL Superbowl was in my town (without my prior knowledge, because I don't pay attention to those sorts of things), and as I'm walking downtown I came across an abnormally huge guy, presumably one of the players, but I have no idea. He was taller than me by a bit, maybe 6'5", but he was big boned and obviously athletic, and that was all it took to be an imposing character. A few blocks later on my way downtown there was a crowd surrounding some NFL star, I don't remember who, and he was flashing a charismatic grin and people were taking pictures and all that, and though he was obviously an incredible athelete, he was my height, in fact I might have had an inch on him. I guess my point is that "impressiveness" for Primarchs (and Space Marines in general) has somehow gotten reduced to "height".

I'm also recalling the Delta guys is the movie Sicario. On the introduction to the team, they are obviously big and very fit guys. The way the camera shoots them, especially next to Emily Blunt, makes them look even bigger. But in the scene with the shootout on the highway, they're next to cars, and you can see that they're not abnormally tall or anything. It's not like they need to be giants to be imposing, they just need to be fit enough to look the part and (probably more importantly) move with smooth precision and lethal intent. And their next combat scene is they go into tight tunnels to engage drug runners. Imagine if the adolescent fantasy of the 10-12 foot tall Primarch was trying to do that. It'd look ridiculous.

Napoleon was a little guy, you don't have to be big to be "great". People can be "giant" without being ludicrously incompatible with human sized tools, buildings, vehicles, furniture. And I doubt every imperial and alien building, tunnel, door was built to "Ogryn Code". I get that 40K is a far cry from realistic, but the "hero gigantism" thing is really overdone, IMO. I'd prefer a within-normal-sized hero with a less material aura of "heroic charisma and supreme skill".

 Insectum7 wrote:

Napoleon was a little guy,

No, he wasn't.

He was depicted as a little guy by British media. He was actually a little above average height for the time.