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 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Is Carrion Throne stand alone or are there books I should read first?

Its stand alone. Its a terrible book though badly written and extremely boring.

That's a shame, I usually like imperial intrigue.

It's definitely got intrigue. I would agree that the book feels slow, mostly because there is a lot of "something is happening, everyone has secrets, and the reader hasn't a clue". Also, it goes full, joyless Grimdark. But there are some parts that I feel make the whole experience worth it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Wyzilla wrote:

Tyranids weren't drawn to the Milky Way by the Astronomicon, they were drawn to it when some marines in the Horus Heresy accidentally set off a Necron Tachyon beacon-thing that alerted the Hive Mind to the existence of life in the Milky Way Galaxy.

Where does this info come from? Is it from a codex or a novel?

As Tyranids were invading years before Necrons were even a thing if there is a Necron source then its clearly either a re-write of earlier Lore or a clarification of earlier lore (ergo early anicent artifact turned out to be Necron).

However I've always heard/read/recall that its the Astronomicon that started the call and that from then on they've headed toward the Emperor and his Golden Throne

There’s only one way the emps is coming back and that is as the star child! Sod the black library nonesnese. They’ve ruined pius and the emperor. I’ll stick with the original fluff thanks.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

Tyranids weren't drawn to the Milky Way by the Astronomicon, they were drawn to it when some marines in the Horus Heresy accidentally set off a Necron Tachyon beacon-thing that alerted the Hive Mind to the existence of life in the Milky Way Galaxy.

Where does this info come from? Is it from a codex or a novel?

It is in the HH novel "Pharos".


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Headlss wrote:
Can the eldar or the Harliquins fix the web gate? So terra isn't immediately devoured by deamons?

If not then oh well. There are lots of worlds.

3rd edition codex had a Farseer with a group of Warlock acolytes sealing off a branch of the webway to prevent a DE incursion on Iyanden so it is possible. Whether the gate beneath the throne can be fixed is not clear. It does not appear to be of Eldar origin. Also the human extension to the Webway was also quite different in its construction. So the Eldar can seal off bits of the webway but whether they can fix that is not clear.

I always liked the idea that they tyranids were running from something scarier.

They are only running away from the waiter that wants them to pay the bill for everything they have eaten!

I read somewhere that the zoats were supposed to be a slave race running from the tyranids. I don’t think they will ever bring him back. Better to kill him off I think. They bottled it with 8th edition but with a bit more set up, something to keep the astronomicon going or something, they could do it and not end the universe.

Andykp wrote:
I read somewhere that the zoats were supposed to be a slave race running from the tyranids. I don’t think they will ever bring him back. Better to kill him off I think. They bottled it with 8th edition but with a bit more set up, something to keep the astronomicon going or something, they could do it and not end the universe.

Hmmm...

9th edition 40k box set - Shattered Imperium... The astronomicon has failed and civil war rages... Human worlds must fight alone for their survival as the darkness encroaches from all sides.. in desperation, Guilliman launched a Second Great Crusade from Terra to reunite humanity and stave off a new Old Night...

With the Imperium shattered, plenty of scope for once imperial forces to hook up with Necrons, Tau, even Chaos to fight the tide of Tyranids and Orks devouring the galaxy...

*Puts down crystal ball*

 Skinflint Games wrote:

Andykp wrote:
I read somewhere that the zoats were supposed to be a slave race running from the tyranids. I don’t think they will ever bring him back. Better to kill him off I think. They bottled it with 8th edition but with a bit more set up, something to keep the astronomicon going or something, they could do it and not end the universe.

Hmmm...

9th edition 40k box set - Shattered Imperium... The astronomicon has failed and civil war rages... Human worlds must fight alone for their survival as the darkness encroaches from all sides.. in desperation, Guilliman launched a Second Great Crusade from Terra to reunite humanity and stave off a new Old Night...

With the Imperium shattered, plenty of scope for once imperial forces to hook up with Necrons, Tau, even Chaos to fight the tide of Tyranids and Orks devouring the galaxy...

*Puts down crystal ball*

we've already HAD Gulliman launching his new "great crusade" IMHO I doubt the timeline will massivly advance much in the immediate future. GW proably wants to be careful.

Assuming the Emperor is even in the throne. Which there is no guarantee of. He wasn't supposed to go in it, the Dark Imperium storyline of the astronomicon temporarily dying could be swapping users over. Guilliman could stay silent because he knows it would destroy everything if anyone finds out. Custodes stay silent as the last act of loyalty. That's why those who guard the throne room can never leave once they enter.


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In Pharos it is the gigantic amount of psychic energy unleashed by the Pharos machine overload that is detected by the hive fleet as the presence of masses of life. So otherwise it's unlikely the Tyranids even find humanity. They're turning up expecting an all you can eat buffet but stay for dinner.....

It's implied it's Necron but only because of the construction material so just as likely old one technology given the Pharos has an instant point to point psychic transportation feature. It's not elaborated on but is implied that it is similar to the web way in that Chaos cannot use it as a conduit.

actually custodes who guard the emperor are constantly in rotation, take Valoris for example he spent 22 years guarding the emperor before deciding to be more pro-active and relinquished his post to actually do stuff.

that being said, custodes are probably really good at keeping secrets anyway.

I thought the Astronomicon flickering was just when the rift broke out. I really doubt He’s not sitting on the throne anymore. Something like that would have a piece of specific lore around it.

 Skinflint Games wrote:

Andykp wrote:
I read somewhere that the zoats were supposed to be a slave race running from the tyranids. I don’t think they will ever bring him back. Better to kill him off I think. They bottled it with 8th edition but with a bit more set up, something to keep the astronomicon going or something, they could do it and not end the universe.

Hmmm...

9th edition 40k box set - Shattered Imperium... The astronomicon has failed and civil war rages... Human worlds must fight alone for their survival as the darkness encroaches from all sides.. in desperation, Guilliman launched a Second Great Crusade from Terra to reunite humanity and stave off a new Old Night...

With the Imperium shattered, plenty of scope for once imperial forces to hook up with Necrons, Tau, even Chaos to fight the tide of Tyranids and Orks devouring the galaxy...

*Puts down crystal ball*

Could be good and more importantly sell models!

I’m actually looking forward to seeing what GW do after all the codexes (codices, codicises?) are released. Don’t think it will involve killing off or resurrecting the emperor. More primarchs probably. Should be good.

Pharos always sounded like old one technology to me. (or even slann, floating would make the corridors make sense).

Necrons don't do "psychic" constructs , only anti-psychic.

 Karhedron wrote:

3. With the webway gate in ruins, the only hope for humanity is for him to actually ascend to god-hood (despite the idea apparently being abhorrent to him).

This is very interesting to me. It would never have been his original intention, but the "false" future that was shown to Horus during his vision quest whilst dying himself from the Anathame wound would actually be true.

Horus was afraid that the Emperor's intention and goal when hidden away inside Terra was to ascend to godhood. It probably wasn't, but he may be forced into ascending AFTER Horus's actions to prevent it!So the Chaos gods showed Horus the truth, but it was just twisted.

Even if the Emperor returns...he still has to sit on the Throne 24 hours a day keeping that webway portal closed.

 TwilightSparkles wrote:
Assuming the Emperor is even in the throne. Which there is no guarantee of. He wasn't supposed to go in it, the Dark Imperium storyline of the astronomicon temporarily dying could be swapping users over. Guilliman could stay silent because he knows it would destroy everything if anyone finds out. Custodes stay silent as the last act of loyalty. That's why those who guard the throne room can never leave once they enter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
In Pharos it is the gigantic amount of psychic energy unleashed by the Pharos machine overload that is detected by the hive fleet as the presence of masses of life. So otherwise it's unlikely the Tyranids even find humanity. They're turning up expecting an all you can eat buffet but stay for dinner.....

It's implied it's Necron but only because of the construction material so just as likely old one technology given the Pharos has an instant point to point psychic transportation feature. It's not elaborated on but is implied that it is similar to the web way in that Chaos cannot use it as a conduit.

The Emperor literally had lines in that book though.

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Yet we have the Ynnari in Gathering Storm claiming the very same as Dark eldar.

So we need an ally vs Chaos, Mankind... use Ynnead power to reborn the Emperor back to life? nah it's a dead corpse, Gullimian it's a better candidate.

except that later in the story Mary Svraine resurrects a squad of 10,000 year dead Thousand Sons turned into dust by Tzeentch himself purely as a momentary distraction for Ahriman.

I'm not sure if it's worth starting a new thread over, but seeing as it's highly likely that GW will bring back as many Primarchs as feasible and the Emperor (when ideas get stale) - how best could this be implemented? Ideally, the two prerequisites to make this revival a success would be, firstly, to substantially differentiate it from the themes of the HH, and, secondly, to preserve the ongoing status quo of perpetual war that attracts players.

I'm not sure that they could ever do it justice unless the other races Pantheons return to the physical realm. Only then could the Emperor's OP nature be countered sufficiently.

PS: If anyone feels this warrants a new thread - speak up and I'll set one off

Just look at Age of Sigmar. They activated all their armageddon-level plot hooks and killed the old world in order to reboot the setting. Now you have gods running about wily-nilly with Nagash even being playable on the tabletop (he costs 900 points IIRC so that is the sort of ball-park we should be looking at for the Emperor).

 Karhedron wrote:
Just look at Age of Sigmar. They activated all their armageddon-level plot hooks and killed the old world in order to reboot the setting. Now you have gods running about wily-nilly with Nagash even being playable on the tabletop (he costs 900 points IIRC so that is the sort of ball-park we should be looking at for the Emperor).

In fairness a divine avatar manifesting to drive his army forward isn't exactly out of place in fantasy.

I think having the emperor return though would damage the setting. it'd be as bad as having the black legion suddenly go loyalist.

Having the Emperor come back would be as bad for the setting as End Times was....

pm713 wrote:
Having the Emperor come back would be as bad for the setting as End Times was....

worse I'd say.

Oh I completely agree that I don't want to see the Big E running around any time soon. I am just pointing out that if 40K starts to run out of steam, I can see GW pulling a big shake-up and jump-starting the old codger.

 Karhedron wrote:
Oh I completely agree that I don't want to see the Big E running around any time soon. I am just pointing out that if 40K starts to run out of steam, I can see GW pulling a big shake-up and jump-starting the old codger.

eh they managed to keep the steam going without him just fine, New Primarchs made by Cawl and or Bile seem more likely then a return of the Emperor

At some point he will likely get at least 30k rules. I kinda wish he didn't though other than pay 20,000 points and tell your opponent you win. With how powerful he's supposed to be he will either be beyond broken or underwhelming on the table top.