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 Flinty wrote:

Arcanis161 wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:

Arcanis161 wrote:
Discussed it with the group. They want to go with the option that is better for Melee armies

What option? Do they think the rules as written are optional?

Following the wording of the Charge rules rather than the wording of Falling Back. EG: I go first and fall back, you can charge as you started outside of 1" of me.

[Snipped]
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I would again point you to p22 where it makes clear that any model within 1" of an enemy model at the start of the movement phase cannot charge. This isn't the start of the specific model's movement, but the start of the whole phase. Ergo, if the person with initiative retreats out of combat then the other model is left swinging in the breeze and hence CC can be a risky proposition.

I'm not going to fight you on this one. However, I am a part of a group who has decided to go against the designers notes. It isn't my sole decision to make. I have already given the reasoning behind that decision.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Saturmorn Carvilli wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:

Arcanis161 wrote:
Discussed it with the group. They want to go with the option that is better for Melee armies

What option? Do they think the rules as written are optional?

Aren't they though?

I mean I house rule things all the time and rarely do the tabletop gaming police send their S.W.A.T. team after me. If a group of like minded players want to change something like don't like about a game to something closer to what they want they can. They should probably be consider the ramification of it beforehand. It is one of the main reasons like prefer tabletop to video games.

Why bother discussing strategy in a game with no rules? Just say your guns are rapid fire 100, Str a miillion, and instantly win you the game.

Hyperbole to the extreme. Modding games is time honoured method and indeed it used to be that GW heavily encouraged it. And for the record I have yet to play a game we haven't modded. Indeed with GW games you pretty much have to do it. Prime case being 40k where you are 100% required to modify the rules to make it even work so that you can play game to completition

Arcanis161 wrote:

Sector Munitorum. Getting at a high vantage point will help, but often times I try to position myself either to try and grab an objective or to shoot at something. If I fall back, I can't shoot, ant it takes me longer to get to the objective, and often times, they are charging from between 7-9 inches away. Perhaps I should start falling back regardless. Better to get a shot/objective later than to risk being dead now.

With Guard a "shoot now, take the objectives later" strategy isn't a terrible one. If you can take the GSC heavy hitters OOA (and they generally aren't cheap and have poor defenses), you should be able to clean up the rest afterwards and grab the objectives from the neophyte stragglers.

Having a screen of disposable, generic guardsmen makes corralling a melee force much easier, which is one of the reasons I'd go for them over the scions for this match-up. The punchier shooting elements of you list can take cover behind them (preferable above, too, just for that extra distance and LOS), leaving them free to blast anything that charges at your red shirts. Losing one round of a normal lasgun's shooting is pretty cheap for denying a charge by an aberrant or hybrid w/weapon (and trading the guardsman's life for the chance to blow the GSC guy away, now that he's out in the open, is also a pretty good deal). A 7" charge has a ~58% chance to succeed, but falling back to make that a 10" charge drops it to only a ~17% chance for the GSC. An 8" charge goes from a 42% to an 8%.

An all solid munitorum crate board is rough for you, though. I'd suggest getting high or trying to get some ruins mixed in, as those blocky obstructions are just about the worst sort of terrain for you.


And everyone else, it's quite obvious that the rules say starting the phase within an inch means no charging if the first player to move falls back, but they've chosen to house rule that. No point in arguing further.