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Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon




San Jose, CA

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
I mean I think the real fun of metawatch is how they try to justify that stance

Hmm. Kinda like watching a car race just to see the crashes?


Bingo
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Gert wrote:
I love the people who are acting like art made for community website where a Fire Warrior, Guardsman and Genestealer Cultist are sitting watching a game of Warhammer is in any way representative of the art found in actual 40k/AoS content.


I love that you love it, and welcome to Costco I love you too.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Galas wrote:
When people complaint about this community and social network artwork I don't know if they don't remember how older RULEBOOKS for fantasy had a ton of funny little drawings in the border of the pages of elfs, dwarfs, goblins, orcs, etc... doing silly stuff.

And it never detracted from the "fluff" of the setting. Is not the "whole direction" of the setting and nothing points out in that direction. Just grumpy people being grumpy.



Well my favorite dwarf army unit may have been Longbeards and they may have had a rule called old grumblers, just saying.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:
 Grimtuff wrote:
God, I despise that Tumblr style artwork that they keep pushing. The sooner it dies off the better.



This may incite some nerd rage but I still think that is part of what they want to do. Make it a total kids game and then be even more mainstream, makes logical business sense. I think it sucks, but it is what it is.


I think you're reading too much into it, it's more just a fun cartoon style.


You can think what you want on it, but if I'm right it'll feel pretty bad and if you are it is me over reaching. For what its worth I hope you are correct, I just don't think so and that makes me sad.

People have been saying the same nonsense you've posted for years. Possibly even decades.

It hasn't happened yet.


Ok and I've been alive every day of my life so far, one day I won't be. Just because it hasn't happened yet doesn't mean it isn't churning in that direction. Change does happen you know, even in the not so grim dark far future.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
PenitentJake wrote:
The art on the website is the art on the website. It doesn't affect the art in the books.

The art in Angels of Death, the Art in Hammer and Bolter... This are things that have also been suggested might not be "Grim Dark Enough" - IMHO they were. But even so, they too are self contained.

As for kids appeal: yes, GW markets for young people IN ADDITION to marketing to adults. There are comics and BL books for kids, but that doesn't interfere with regular BL offerings.

This is common: examine one facet of 40k under a microscope, extend that analysis to other elements outside the focus of the examination to prove that GW is terrible.

Talk ONLY about 2k matched, and use that to say the whole game sucks.

Talk about images that appear only on the website, and use that to prove we're becoming too kid friendly.

Here's a news flash: GW is marketing to EVERYONE. Yes, this does mean that a) some of that marketing will not appeal to you and b) some of that marketing was actually not designed to appeal to you.




They are marketing to everyone ? Could have fooled me, I doubt they are marketing to the poor or the kids of the lower middle class or poor parents. Good spin though, straight from the GW propaganda right to all our hearts.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Eldarsif wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Adrassil wrote:
 Grimtuff wrote:
God, I despise that Tumblr style artwork that they keep pushing. The sooner it dies off the better.


My thoughts exactly. It really seems to infantilise Warhammer too much in my eyes.


It's just art that is attractive for social media. You aren't going to get far promoting Warhammer with Grimdark 100% of the time on Facebook.


Plus this type of art is much easier and quicker to push out than some high-end illustration.

I personally don't mind the art. Actually enjoy it to be honest and really don't understand why people are nitpicking about some community article art.

As for kids appeal: yes, GW markets for young people IN ADDITION to marketing to adults.


Exactly.

I find it disturbing how many people here act as if they were never young kids who might have got their first fix in Warhammer at a young age.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Galas wrote:
When people complaint about this community and social network artwork I don't know if they don't remember how older RULEBOOKS for fantasy had a ton of funny little drawings in the border of the pages of elfs, dwarfs, goblins, orcs, etc... doing silly stuff.

And it never detracted from the "fluff" of the setting. Is not the "whole direction" of the setting and nothing points out in that direction. Just grumpy people being grumpy.


They just conveniently forgot that they were young once. It sometimes happens to us old folks.



Maybe you grew up in a family well off enough to afford GW prices but I didn't get into this game till I was around 19 and could buy into it myself as I never would have gotten models for it from my folks, they couldn't afford it. That isn't forgetting I was a kid, that was never being able to afford it as a kid and really I still don't get what parents are putting up the cash for a 2k point list these days for their kids.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Void__Dragon wrote:
 Adrassil wrote:
 Grimtuff wrote:
God, I despise that Tumblr style artwork that they keep pushing. The sooner it dies off the better.


My thoughts exactly. It really seems to infantilise Warhammer too much in my eyes.


Yeah I don't like the insinuation that there's anything childish about me collecting and painting a bunch of toys that appeal to boyish notions of coolness and masculinity.



What if you play Sisters ? Or Tyranids ? Do those appeal to boyish ideals of coolness and masculinity ? Just wondering..

Jokes aside, yeah it's playing with toys but the cost point is hardly kid friendly, neither is all the book work which most kids I've met wouldn't care to learn, especially this new edition. It feels pretty much like an adult game to me.

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2021/09/27 09:09:06


 
   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

 AngryAngel80 wrote:



Maybe you grew up in a family well off enough to afford GW prices but I didn't get into this game till I was around 19 and could buy into it myself as I never would have gotten models for it from my folks, they couldn't afford it. That isn't forgetting I was a kid, that was never being able to afford it as a kid and really I still don't get what parents are putting up the cash for a 2k point list these days for their kids.


This assuming people demand EVERYTHING NOW!!!!, for a kid it could easily take years to get a 2000 points army. Took me about 3 to get and paint mine. Now if you think about a comparable period of time would you say that the hobby is only for the very rich and privileged? Even watching sports on tv costs more (in Italy it's the equivalent of 300$ per year AT LEAST) if we consider cash spent in a 2-3 years.

Kids should simply enjoy the hobby and learning how to build, play and paint typically takes them much time than for an adult. Playing 2000 points, let alone being active part in a competitive environment, is something that kids should avoid at all cost, and may also lead to grow toxic attitudes as well.


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Blackie wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:



Maybe you grew up in a family well off enough to afford GW prices but I didn't get into this game till I was around 19 and could buy into it myself as I never would have gotten models for it from my folks, they couldn't afford it. That isn't forgetting I was a kid, that was never being able to afford it as a kid and really I still don't get what parents are putting up the cash for a 2k point list these days for their kids.


This assuming people demand EVERYTHING NOW!!!!, for a kid it could easily take years to get a 2000 points army. Took me about 3 to get and paint mine. Now if you think about a comparable period of time would you say that the hobby is only for the very rich and privileged? Even watching sports on tv costs more (in Italy it's the equivalent of 300$ per year AT LEAST) if we consider cash spent in a 2-3 years.

Kids should simply enjoy the hobby and learning how to build, play and paint typically takes them much time than for an adult. Playing 2000 points, let alone being active part in a competitive environment, is something that kids should avoid at all cost, and may also lead to grow toxic attitudes as well.



Even not assuming that, game systems, sports equipment, other hobbies that all drains money. I'd say its still a very niche hobby for kids to enjoy as you need focus, and time and dedication to the craft and painting, let alone playing. Just my opinion mind you, not saying some kids don't love it, or even have parents buying it. I'm just saying I don't know all these kids that can afford it, most I've seen starting it are finishing college, in college scrapping by for the models or older and can afford it themselves.

That said, I don't see everyone in the world but this hobby is only getting more expensive by the release and these savings boxes are getting awful high in cost. I'd like to know how many kids are talking their folks into buying these models for them.
   
Made in ch
Warped Arch Heretic of Chaos





He, atleast Gw aknowledged these factions exist.

Unlike others which just get used as glass panel for promoting SoB


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

In the 41st millennium there is only overpriced hamberders.

 
   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

100% agree, AngryAngel80: this was, is and always will be a niche hobby. And the modern costs of the kits, most of them at least, have become dreadful.

I think a kid starting the hobby could get a starter set or a 2nd hand lot in good conditions, basic stuff for modelling and painting and stick with that material for an year, if not more. I know it takes me a year or so, after 20+ in the hobby, to paint a whole starter kit . That shouldn't be unreasonable in cost.

Maybe I'm biased though, as I consider playing only if the other part of the hobby gave you a great time and in fact I played my first games after 1-2 years spent on painting miniatures.

I think for people at a very young age playing should be a consequence of enjoying the hobby, I mean like the next step after finishing to paint the first lot, and I wouldn't encourage anyone to join the hobby just (or mostly) for the gaming part.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/27 10:41:08



 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 AngryAngel80 wrote:

Maybe you grew up in a family well off enough to afford GW prices but I didn't get into this game till I was around 19 and could buy into it myself as I never would have gotten models for it from my folks, they couldn't afford it. That isn't forgetting I was a kid, that was never being able to afford it as a kid and really I still don't get what parents are putting up the cash for a 2k point list these days for their kids.



Here's the thing about playing 40K as a kid...or any age, really. You don't have to buy a whole army day 1. It probably took me 3 years to get my first 2K and between then we played smaller games, proxied, or borrowed models.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Daedalus81 wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:

Maybe you grew up in a family well off enough to afford GW prices but I didn't get into this game till I was around 19 and could buy into it myself as I never would have gotten models for it from my folks, they couldn't afford it. That isn't forgetting I was a kid, that was never being able to afford it as a kid and really I still don't get what parents are putting up the cash for a 2k point list these days for their kids.



Here's the thing about playing 40K as a kid...or any age, really. You don't have to buy a whole army day 1. It probably took me 3 years to get my first 2K and between then we played smaller games, proxied, or borrowed models.



My question would be then what kid do you know with that patience to wait 3 years to accomplish their game army ? Most I deal with or see these days can barely wait 10 minutes to finish a youtube video, which is why Tik Tok is a thing. Patience in pursuit of gratification isn't something the current world tends to foster in people. While some are out there that number is shockingly small from granted my own small view box but I don't think you need to see the whole world to realize patience isn't considered much a good train anymore.
   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

That is very true. Here in Italy football is the most successful show to watch in terms of audience and one of the most important football club's owner wants to change the sport based on the fact that full games are mostly watched by people of 30yo or older while younger ones stick with 3minutes highlights on youtube. He periodically throws out ideas (typically baseless ones) about how to catch the younger audience.

New generations seem to have no patience and the market pushes for activities that are quick and not durable. Even in music, movies, etc... there's the attitude of consuming the product and then moving on.

That's why I can't see tabletop gaming an activity that can be aimed at kids. Those who are not really interested in painting the models won't last long in the hobby.


 
   
Made in us
Blessed Living Saint




On the Internet

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:

Maybe you grew up in a family well off enough to afford GW prices but I didn't get into this game till I was around 19 and could buy into it myself as I never would have gotten models for it from my folks, they couldn't afford it. That isn't forgetting I was a kid, that was never being able to afford it as a kid and really I still don't get what parents are putting up the cash for a 2k point list these days for their kids.



Here's the thing about playing 40K as a kid...or any age, really. You don't have to buy a whole army day 1. It probably took me 3 years to get my first 2K and between then we played smaller games, proxied, or borrowed models.



My question would be then what kid do you know with that patience to wait 3 years to accomplish their game army ? Most I deal with or see these days can barely wait 10 minutes to finish a youtube video, which is why Tik Tok is a thing. Patience in pursuit of gratification isn't something the current world tends to foster in people. While some are out there that number is shockingly small from granted my own small view box but I don't think you need to see the whole world to realize patience isn't considered much a good train anymore.

Pretty sure this is why GW has pivotted to Kill Teams, Underworlds and Warcry as their intro games instead of lower points levels. It gets them playing and with contrast they can be painted super quick, or if they catch the painting bug they'll get into more detailed painting, either way they're all great "intro" game sizes.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Blackie wrote:
That is very true. Here in Italy football is the most successful show to watch in terms of audience and one of the most important football club's owner wants to change the sport based on the fact that full games are mostly watched by people of 30yo or older while younger ones stick with 3minutes highlights on youtube. He periodically throws out ideas (typically baseless ones) about how to catch the younger audience.

New generations seem to have no patience and the market pushes for activities that are quick and not durable. Even in music, movies, etc... there's the attitude of consuming the product and then moving on.

That's why I can't see tabletop gaming an activity that can be aimed at kids. Those who are not really interested in painting the models won't last long in the hobby.


I agree with what you're saying here and yeah that's basically what I'm saying. I just think that is a small group it's aimed at then.
   
 
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