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Personally I would only want to see them if they had several new playstyles developed for them. If they are just Biker and gunline with power armor I don't think it would be worth the overall hassle for a codex.

However if GW was bold I definitely see a couple playstyle niches with Squats that could really be meaningfully fun.

On a side note, having something like Landtrains being LOWs and ObSec building a army to escort it to points I think could be a lot of fun as playstyle.

Having done research and even written up a fan Codex for 8th that never saw the light of day, exo-armor was always a Hearthguard or Warlord thing. It would likely be limited to Elites, then. The core of any Squat army would be the T4, 5+ save Brotherhood troops.

These would differ from Guardsmen in terms of customization. They could take bolters, or go full melee.

Since we're talking about Space dwarfs that are missing in our Science Fantasy game a question crossed my mind: have there ever been Trolls in 40K? I know there were/ are beastmen, we have ogres and hobbits and elves, Zombies, werewolves, Vampires and Orks, but no trolls, right? In the Ork faction dreads took their typical role, so I guess that's why they're out? Same as giants who don't really have a place next to Imperial Knights?

 Skinnereal wrote:

 oni wrote:
No. No one wants them.

And I believe anyone who says they do want them / would buy them is being disingenuous.

If you say so...

I promised here that I would buy digital codexes before they were a thing, and I have bought all 3 versions of the same codexes since.
You keep your delusional view of other people's personal convictions....

IIRC Oni has some insider knowledge of GW sales volumes from awhile back. That might be where he gets this opinion from. Yeah, the playerbase has grown and changed, but if Squats really and truly did sell... squat (ba dum tiss) back in the day, I get why you'd think they won't sell today too.

Sgt. Cortez wrote:
Since we're talking about Space dwarfs that are missing in our Science Fantasy game a question crossed my mind: have there ever been Trolls in 40K? I know there were/ are beastmen, we have ogres and hobbits and elves, Zombies, werewolves, Vampires and Orks, but no trolls, right? In the Ork faction dreads took their typical role, so I guess that's why they're out? Same as giants who don't really have a place next to Imperial Knights?

I remember Trolls being a thing for Chaos in Epic, but can't recall if they were in 40k. The same might have been true for Minotaurs, too, but my memory is a little fuzzier about those.

PenitentJake wrote:

...

Perhaps a way forward for them is to be designed as a Merc faction, with subfaction identities being informed by which other factions that particular group of squats tends to work for/ with.

That's what I was thinking too. In a way I feel like the direction GW took with squats ended up too much in this sort of space viking steampunk thing, and now the AoS dwarves are already kind of an amalgation of that approach. Squats as mercenaries would be much more fitting now, and it would tie in nicely with their Rogue Trader origins.

I’d like to see squats as a big unit army like imperial or chaos knights.

I don’t know why but I think there should be more armies like that or none at all.

They wouldn’t have to be big walkers, something more imaginative that I can’t imagine

I got tired of GW ignoring squats and picked up the Mantic Forgefathers.

Personally, I see it as a hybrid force - PA elite units like space marines, with common troops and artillery units like IG - I wouldn’t mind adding some impressive tanks as well, as that sure seems like it would fit.

Never was much for the biker aspect, though.

The Veermyn drills go really well with the Forgefathers, I have a couple for my army.

The 3D printing world is so awash with various style of space dwarf, I would guess GW will stay away from it. Too niche a range, with the only really compelling KPI being that they are space dwarfs (dwarves?)

I always liked the vehicles, but the infantry proportions never did it for me me. I prefer slender to stumpy.

 Gene St. Ealer wrote:

 Skinnereal wrote:

 oni wrote:
No. No one wants them.

And I believe anyone who says they do want them / would buy them is being disingenuous.

If you say so...

I promised here that I would buy digital codexes before they were a thing, and I have bought all 3 versions of the same codexes since.
You keep your delusional view of other people's personal convictions....

IIRC Oni has some insider knowledge of GW sales volumes from awhile back. That might be where he gets this opinion from. Yeah, the playerbase has grown and changed, but if Squats really and truly did sell... squat (ba dum tiss) back in the day, I get why you'd think they won't sell today too.

Per the designers, it wasn't a sales issue. It was a 'we can't think of anything interesting to do with them'

Well I would prefer them to end up being not imperium aligned because there's just too many. Make it turn out that after the Imperium annexed their planets they got embittered and joined the Tau instead.

Or hey, mix both memes and have chaos squats, dedicated to the great god Hashahut.

 Pacific wrote:
Not sure if this is true, but I had heard that one of the senior GW staff/designers that previously despised Squats (I'm not sure whom), and had said Squats would only return over his dead body, has now left. This is why you have a few of them sneaking back in to things like Necromunda, which at one time absolutely would not have happened.

Is anyone in a position to verify my questionable statement?

I'm not really in a position, but I certainly think that statement has some merrett to it...

 Olthannon wrote:
Well I would prefer them to end up being not imperium aligned because there's just too many. Make it turn out that after the Imperium annexed their planets they got embittered and joined the Tau instead.

Or hey, mix both memes and have chaos squats, dedicated to the great god Hashahut.

Or maybe they escaped into the warp or webway and have been hiding out planning their revenge on the imperium for leaving the to the tyranids. In the warp they’ve picked up some cool old ones technology

mrFickle wrote:

 Olthannon wrote:
Well I would prefer them to end up being not imperium aligned because there's just too many. Make it turn out that after the Imperium annexed their planets they got embittered and joined the Tau instead.

Or hey, mix both memes and have chaos squats, dedicated to the great god Hashahut.

Or maybe they escaped into the warp or webway and have been hiding out planning their revenge on the imperium for leaving the to the tyranids. In the warp they’ve picked up some cool old ones technology

I would be cool with chaos squats coming back... I might pick that army up

Yes.
I bought a kharadron overlords army with the intent of playing them as squats. I kit-bashed a GSC quad bike with Imperial Guard stubbers and Kharadron overlords to make old school Squat Bikers a new thing.

EDIT: Also, I wrote my own Squat fandex that's in the Rules section of the forums, and explained how they are basically Angry Dwarves(TM) who hate everyone since the Eldar betrayed them, the orks tried to kill them, the Imperium abandoned them, and the Tyranids drove them from their homeworlds. I could see them allying with the T'au. Or the Necrons if the necrons didn't hate all living things.

I intended them to be an army that had a hodge-podge of Imperial tech, T'au Tech, and a wide-spread ability to repair their vehicles and equipment. They would be slow, though, and that's really their primary weakness. The army I created really isn't viable as a 9th edition army AT ALL due to almost universal 4" move stat. But it makes sense, and I'm fine with it. It helps justify why underground dwarves would suddenly build flying boats - so they have assault craft to help them take objectives!

 dadx6 wrote:
Yes.
I bought a kharadron overlords army with the intent of playing them as squats. I kit-bashed a GSC quad bike with Imperial Guard stubbers and Kharadron overlords to make old school Squat Bikers a new thing.

EDIT: Also, I wrote my own Squat fandex that's in the Rules section of the forums, and explained how they are basically Angry Dwarves(TM) who hate everyone since the Eldar betrayed them, the orks tried to kill them, the Imperium abandoned them, and the Tyranids drove them from their homeworlds. I could see them allying with the T'au. Or the Necrons if the necrons didn't hate all living things.

I intended them to be an army that had a hodge-podge of Imperial tech, T'au Tech, and a wide-spread ability to repair their vehicles and equipment. They would be slow, though, and that's really their primary weakness. The army I created really isn't viable as a 9th edition army AT ALL due to almost universal 4" move stat. But it makes sense, and I'm fine with it. It helps justify why underground dwarves would suddenly build flying boats - so they have assault craft to help them take objectives!

Do you have a link to that Fandex?

Squats Fandex here.

I think they could be done cool, and would be a fun edition if the rules where good.

So GW is the risk factor

Also a none joke name would go a long way to pushing them within the setting better, as well I think as them being there own thing away from the imperium at this point.

As with all things, the truth is somewhere in the middle. Some people really do what a Squat army. A non-Imperial humanoid army pre-Tau was missing from the game, and the tropes of dwarves were attractive to many. Since Rogue Trader, there have been some great conversion efforts for Squat armies and a lot of passion behind this weird part of the lore.

For others, talking about Squats has turned into a bit, kind of like the Felinids are now. It's a joke people can throw around and that GW can throw back at us to troll those of us old enough to remember the dark times.

For still others, Squats represent the charm of nostalgia and remind them of the games sillier roots. The game now dances with taking itself so seriously that we forget we're talking about a space personality cult with Brazil-levels of silly bureaucracy and more mohawks and leather than the entire punk scene.

Still beyond that, there is a genuine curiosity as to whether Squats can exist in Warhammer as a distinct entity beyond "space Dwarves." This was a challenge for the Studio for many years, and Squats almost become a thought experiment on what can and cant work in the game. What would their play style be? What would they bring to the table that the other 47 armies you can buy now don't? Does their non-Imperial Imperium add anything to the lore? Was their crude and frankly lazy retcon warranted, or could they have just been swept into the background where a lot of other cool races live?

Somewhere in that mess lies the answer.

I wouldn't mind seeing Squats return.

Though I'd also like Tau to get some kind of Demiurg unit with Ion Rifles. Basically Xeno Squats instead of Ab-humans.

I do hope a Squat release is a full release, and not a "Here's half an army. See you for the inevitable expansion book 6 months from now!" like Lumineth, AdMech (sort of) and even Sisters got.

Jarms48 wrote:
Though I'd also like Tau to get some kind of Demiurg unit with Ion Rifles. Basically Xeno Squats instead of Ab-humans.

I'd like the next Tau release to refresh the "Empire" side of "Tau Empire", and really delve into the other races that work within the Tau military structure (Kroot, Vespid and so on). Unfortunately we're just getting a new character, and if we weren't just getting that we'd probably just get more suits.

MarkNorfolk wrote:

Per the designers, it wasn't a sales issue. It was a 'we can't think of anything interesting to do with them'

Yet they had no problem with Space Elves, Space Orcs, & Space Empire...

This is the thing that still pisses me off.

I'm not against squats being reintroduced into the setting, though I will be bemused if (knowing my luck, when) they arrive before my beloved Emperor's Children.

I'm not a long time player. However, with my stimulus I bought $400 of Forge Fathers from Mantic to proxy Squats. So clearly, my answer is no, there are no squat players and only memes.

 Marshal Loss wrote:
I'm not against squats being reintroduced into the setting, though I will be bemused if (knowing my luck, when) they arrive before my beloved Emperor's Children.

Yes there are a lot of codexes required to complete the 40K universe on the table top. The traitors legions are right up there

Voss wrote:

 Gene St. Ealer wrote:

 Skinnereal wrote:

 oni wrote:
No. No one wants them.

And I believe anyone who says they do want them / would buy them is being disingenuous.

If you say so...

I promised here that I would buy digital codexes before they were a thing, and I have bought all 3 versions of the same codexes since.
You keep your delusional view of other people's personal convictions....

IIRC Oni has some insider knowledge of GW sales volumes from awhile back. That might be where he gets this opinion from. Yeah, the playerbase has grown and changed, but if Squats really and truly did sell... squat (ba dum tiss) back in the day, I get why you'd think they won't sell today too.

Per the designers, it wasn't a sales issue. It was a 'we can't think of anything interesting to do with them'

That's such a cop-out answer in my opinion. It was a case they didn't WANT to think of anything interesting, and it was just easier for them to drop them. The myriad versions that have shown up over the years (such as Forgefathers) shows that if they'd put in the effort, we could have gotten the army. Current GW has too much of the marine paradigm giving them tunnelvision though to contemplate it. Hell, updating eldar seems beyond their ability to care.

How is it a cop-out? If the design team was wanting to push 40k away from being a SciFi mirror of WHFB but couldn't find a way to make the Squats work 20-30 odd years ago thats hardly them not trying. Hypothetically the Squats could work now as others have proposed (IMO they're just nostalgia bait and won't actually add anything) but 40k is a much more expanded setting and models are much better now than when Squats were first made.
As for Craftworlds not getting a revamp, all that needs done is a revamp of the "Core" stuff like Guardians and Aspect Warriors since there's already a bunch of modern kits in the range. Plus the Rumour Engine is looking Aeldari now and there's the fairly reliable rumour dump that Craftworlds are getting a revamp this coming year. Maybe 2022 will be the year all the Craftworlds players finally stop griping about their models.

They are back lore, and model wise. Have been for awhile now. Of course it is just 1 model for Necromunda, but, that means they exist in 40k current lore.

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-US/Grendl-Grendlsen-Squat-Bounty-Hunter-2018

 draugadan wrote:
They are back lore, and model wise. Have been for awhile now. Of course it is just 1 model for Necromunda, but, that means they exist in 40k current lore.

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-US/Grendl-Grendlsen-Squat-Bounty-Hunter-2018

This one too:
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-US/Ragnir-Gunnstein-Squat-Ammojack-2019