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Ok; played my first game versus the Skyhammer formation today.
Had a small break and for the last 3 months I have been resharpening my gaming with an average of 2-3 games per week.
(Been with the hobby for at least 10 years, into GK sicne release yadda yadda)

I had a 1850 list because my two local GW stores are running events soon.
Anyway;

He won the roll and stated null deployment. Now; I had no idea on the rules for this formation; only heard the rumors. As I had the feeling 'why would someone pay for this single dataslate'.
I was naive; Google Images pipped me hard here.

Anyway- long story short. There was no cover except for the very middle of the board. I deployed, didnt seize. He dropped half his army of Gravs. Declared Ultramarines doc. nailed me for relentless 3+ to hit with re-rolls. Followed by the re-rollable grav amp wounds.

End of turn 1 I have 1 of 2 NDKs left. 1 terminator (I know, I know. I wanted to do 1850 but the guy said he already had a 2000 list already so I just bulked up, assuming it'd be a fun outing regardless. )
I also had 3 Interceptors clinging the ruins of which they finally jetted to in my turn 1.

As he entered his Turn 2 I realised I had wasted my time placing my plastic on the table. Felt for the first time genuine sadness from the game and just said 'you've won this, well done.'
After the hand shake he said 'well played'. I quickly informed him I didn't actually get to play - I sat there and watched my men get blown to bits.

I would like to know what a GK player can do against this new formation other than say 'I don't fancy playing vs SM today'. As nicely as possible.

Thoughts? New to the forum. So sorry if I posted in the wrong area.

If I am slow to reply or don't reply I will get back to you tonight or tomorrow morning, it's late here!

Grav crushes units in TDA. (Terminator armor) Terminator armor in general is pretty useless in 7th, except on ICs and even then artificer is better because then you can ride a bike.

If you use meq units and put them in Rhinos, their alpha strike will be wasted on the Rhinos and then you can beta strike them.

But your DK are dead, and and TDA units on foot are dead. There really isn't anything you can do about that other than not play 7th ed. SM skyhammer is not the only list that will crush foot slogging TDA and DK. Shunts are only of limited value, because you can't assault a shunt, and most lists have the GK laughably outgunned.

Nemesis strike formation lets you null deploy to avoid his alpha strike for one. In terms of units though grav in general is just a hard counter for almost anything TKs field.

Yeah that's going to be a hard one. As always you could run something like Coteaz to shoot up some of his guys coming in. Put your guys in metal boxes. Or try and get as MSU as possible.

Grav is a hard counter to termies. If you throw them in land raiders then its going to be a rough turn one when he takes the raiders out. Could do the ... Wrong... Thing and load your termies in an inquisition chimera... Less lost when it blows up...

To do a take all comers list against that skyhammer list as GK, its tricky. Keep everything that has a 2+ in reserve. His strike will hit hard and you will lose stuff, that is just a reality. Need to make sure he pays for it.

My solution recently has been to use inquisition allies with lots of cheapish henchmen squads. If I lose 48 points of henchmen to his alpha strike (basic henchmen 12 man squad) I consider it a win for me. Then it's all up to the reserve rolls and target priority. If you want to tick him off a bit, put a unit of 8 crusaders, 3 death cult assassins and a priest on the field. It's kinda expensive, but laughs at grav and doesn't need many dca's to make it into combat to decimate anything short of a terminator unit. Marine eater unit that is fluffy in a GK list.

That detachment is a tactical challenge and it sucks you didn't know about it. Not unbeatable so don't start administering parking lot justice yet (that is reserved for decurions)

So, the answer is don't use GK units when playing GK? Gotcha.

SJ

So my real options are:

- Not play vs Skyhammer (Being polite obviously.)
- Not play 7 Ed.
- Not play Terminators or NDK.

- Play Decurion Necrons?.

No, just don't have anything in terminator armor on the field before he drops down his grav. combat squad strike squads are more resilient as well.

If you can get into hand to hand with cents, your squads will likely win. Especially with a hammer or 2 in the squad.

I was just giving you ideas that worked for me with what I have available. There are clearly more options, but I won't theory-hammer. This is just what worked for me in the past when I encountered the same problem. Take it or leave it at your discretion

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
So, the answer is don't use GK units when playing GK? Gotcha.

SJ

This kind of reminds me of the preferred solutions to the inadequacies of Sisters, Chaos Marines, Imperial Knights, Harlequins and Militarum.
Or even the Skitarii to a certain extent.

GK on the other hand should probably be treated as more of a Tempestus/Assassins faction at this point. That's nice, you have some GKs. But where's your real army?

I've played against the skyhammer with GK twice. The first time all the skyhammer did was bring most of my opponents troops close enough to me that I didn't have to worry about chasing them down. I had three rhinos with 5 man squads of purifiers all bunched up together. skyhammer lands everything piles out and he gravs my rhinos to death. I disembark keeping one squad surrounded by the other two. he charges I cut his power armor to pieces and then next turn kill most of the rest of his guys because they are all in range of my incinerators psychic novas.

the second time I threw everything into a landraider and things didn't go as well but eventually my guys won through attrition and close combat.

but yeah keep your dredknights and terminators the hell off the board. the skyhammer, is a good excuse to bring GK as a CAD rather then as the nemesis formation

So I guess my advice is sacrificial rhinos. force your opponent to use up at least half of his firepower wrecking your metal boxes and keep them together so you have units that can counter charge

Sacrificial Rhinos is the only real meq answer for Skyhammer, unless you want to gamble on reserve shenanigans.

Play the reserve game keep your units that are vulnerable to the alpha strike in reserve.

Or use more terrain? Sky hammer is pretty neutered on a cluttered table.

SJ

I want to remind everyone that his opponent can choose to bring in the skyhammer force on turn 2.

So some options:

1) As stated earlier, null deploy with NSF and counter strike with reserves.

2) Ally in some Ravenguard and deploy in terrain. This will give you either a 2+ or 3+ cover save on turn one thanks to shrouded.

3) Ally in Space Wolves. Deploy a big unit of wolves on the table and attach in some hard hitters but keep your majority armor the 6+ of the wolves. This will nerf his grav heavily when he lands and you can then munch his devastators in the ensuing assault phase.

Most tournaments here rule that the Skyhammer can't have ICs attached at the start of the game so it doesn't have a source of ignore cover or reducing cover saves. Even if you allow it, deploying in cover and saving your dice to deny Perfect Timing should go a long way. Hope that helps.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

DirtyDeeds wrote:
I want to remind everyone that his opponent can choose to bring in the skyhammer force on turn 2.

Your opponent has to declare the turn it will arrive during his deployment when he organizes his reserves. If he deploys first, he has to decide before seeing your deployment. If he deploys second, he can keep it in reserve but it gives you some additional turns to maneuver into favorable terrain.