Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Should I just buy the Citadel Hobby Starter Set or should I go for the 4 other Citadel Paint set bundles (Base, Layer, Dry and Shade)? What should I buy? (First time modeling/painting. Planning on running a Tau army.)

If Citadel is the only thing available to you go for it.

If you have access to things like Vallejo, P3, Reaper, Scale 75 etc I would tell you to experiment. You get more paint for your money in a larger variety of colors.

There is nothing "wrong" with GW's paint line, there are just less expensive alternatives out there.

 darefsky (Flight Medic Paints) wrote:
If Citadel is the only thing available to you go for it.

If you have access to things like Vallejo, P3, Reaper, Scale 75 etc I would tell you to experiment. You get more paint for your money in a larger variety of colors.

There is nothing "wrong" with GW's paint line, there are just less expensive alternatives out there.

Yeah Citadel is the only paint available to me for this kind of thing in my area. Is the Citadel Hobby Starter Kit worth it over buying stuff seperately? (Glue, Brush, Cutters, Paints)

 Singleton wrote:

 darefsky (Flight Medic Paints) wrote:
If Citadel is the only thing available to you go for it.

If you have access to things like Vallejo, P3, Reaper, Scale 75 etc I would tell you to experiment. You get more paint for your money in a larger variety of colors.

There is nothing "wrong" with GW's paint line, there are just less expensive alternatives out there.

Yeah Citadel is the only paint available to me for this kind of thing in my area. Is the Citadel Hobby Starter Kit worth it over buying stuff seperately? (Glue, Brush, Cutters, Paints)

NO. DON'T DO IT.

Sorry for shouting but No... just No.

Citadel glue is junk, and the cutters are repackaged at 4 times the price.

Pick up the paints you need and get super glue or plastic glue from Hobby Lobby, Michael's etc. I have a wire cutter I got from Menards (Home Depot) for $8 that has lasted me years of cutting spru and Brass Rod. Same thing goes for a hobby knife. Get an X-Acto knife from the Hobby Lobby for half the cost and the exact same thing. The Citadel brushes are just O.K. They are not fantastic and not worth the price. Pick up a few natural hair brushes from a craft store and learn on those. At a $3 a piece you wont shed a tear when you destroy them.

See I just saved you like $50

 darefsky (Flight Medic Paints) wrote:

 Singleton wrote:

 darefsky (Flight Medic Paints) wrote:
If Citadel is the only thing available to you go for it.

If you have access to things like Vallejo, P3, Reaper, Scale 75 etc I would tell you to experiment. You get more paint for your money in a larger variety of colors.

There is nothing "wrong" with GW's paint line, there are just less expensive alternatives out there.

Yeah Citadel is the only paint available to me for this kind of thing in my area. Is the Citadel Hobby Starter Kit worth it over buying stuff seperately? (Glue, Brush, Cutters, Paints)

NO. DON'T DO IT.

Sorry for shouting but No... just No.

Citadel glue is junk, and the cutters are repackaged at 4 times the price.

Pick up the paints you need and get super glue or plastic glue from Hobby Lobby, Michael's etc. I have a wire cutter I got from Menards (Home Depot) for $8 that has lasted me years of cutting spru and Brass Rod. Same thing goes for a hobby knife. Get an X-Acto knife from the Hobby Lobby for half the cost and the exact same thing. The Citadel brushes are just O.K. They are not fantastic and not worth the price. Pick up a few natural hair brushes from a craft store and learn on those. At a $3 a piece you wont shed a tear when you destroy them.

See I just saved you like $50

Okay so basically get a hobby knife and cutters from a hardware store, get brushes from an arts n' crafts shop, and plastic glue also from the arts n' crafts shop. I know Citadel Paints are overpriced, but I do want to buy a set of them, at least for my first lineup of paints. Correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I gather, I should buy like 2-3 of each type of paint (base,layer, shade) and 1 or 2 dry paints with 1 glaze.

I'm not exactly sure what color scheme I want for my Tau yet though.

I don't know much about the new GW paint by numbers paint set up. I can't for the life of me think why you would need 3 or 4 different versions of the same paint color.

Every other maker of paint has one type (unless you look at things like Alcohol based Metallic, or Crackle paints but they are specialty). Get the colors you want in the normal viscosity I think GW calls that layer paints. Go one shade lighter for your highlights (or just add a touch of beige to your base color on a pallet) and get a wash for the shading.

 darefsky (Flight Medic Paints) wrote:
I don't know much about the new GW paint by numbers paint set up. I can't for the life of me think why you would need 3 or 4 different versions of the same paint color.

Every other maker of paint has one type (unless you look at things like Alcohol based Metallic, or Crackle paints but they are specialty). Get the colors you want in the normal viscosity I think GW calls that layer paints. Go one shade lighter for your highlights (or just add a touch of beige to your base color on a pallet) and get a wash for the shading.

Thanks for the help, and I was referring to buying 3-4 different colors for each tier of paints. Like, Purple, Blue, and Grey for base paints, then a shade lighter of each color for the 3 shade paints, and two shades lighter for the layer paints for each of the base. Then a gunmetal grey dry paint and a blue glaze.

Are you able to buy stuff online instead of in-store? If so, then your options can go beyond GW, or, at least, you'll be able to get discount GW from some places.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
Are you able to buy stuff online instead of in-store? If so, then your options can go beyond GW, or, at least, you'll be able to get discount GW from some places.

I can buy stuff online, yes. Suggestions on what to get from where?

Don't understand the Citadel glue hate. Their plastic and superglue are both fine, reasonably priced items. Hardware you should get elsewhere (brushes and cutters), pick up an Xacto blade off Amazon for a few dollars. Replacement blades are cheap at stores like Walmart.

I use Citadel paints and enjoy them, I supplement with Army Painter paints, which are good too. Often found at your local game shop.

Great thread

At absolute basics, get yourself:

Base -

White
Black
Yellow
Dark silver
Dark bronze

Layer -

White
Red
Green
Blue
Yellow
Light Silver
Light Gold

Shade/wash

Black
Brown

And you should be set, you can make nearly any colour out of that list with a bit of mixing, and the foundation colours will work out great for any undercoats.

Other than that a spray primer and some plastic and superglue and you are ready to go!

 Ifalna wrote:
Great thread

At absolute basics, get yourself:

Base -

White
Black
Yellow
Dark silver
Dark bronze

Layer -

White
Red
Green
Blue
Yellow
Light Silver
Light Gold

Shade/wash

Black
Brown

And you should be set, you can make nearly any colour out of that list with a bit of mixing, and the foundation colours will work out great for any undercoats.

Other than that a spray primer and some plastic and superglue and you are ready to go!

Thanks a ton!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ifalna wrote:
Great thread

At absolute basics, get yourself:

Base -

White
Black
Yellow
Dark silver
Dark bronze

Layer -

White
Red
Green
Blue
Yellow
Light Silver
Light Gold

Shade/wash

Black
Brown

And you should be set, you can make nearly any colour out of that list with a bit of mixing, and the foundation colours will work out great for any undercoats.

Other than that a spray primer and some plastic and superglue and you are ready to go!

Btw your beginner's painting guide is exceptional and is very helpful. Only problem is I believe washes have been renamed shades, along with the colors themselves. Like Badad Black is now Nuln Oil.

I wouldn't use the Citadel glue. It's good, but you can get the same stuff for cheaper at pretty much any local store (at least, you can in Aus) and you can get knives for way cheaper in any store DIY section as well. But I'm actually pretty impressed with the Citadel paints. Since their last upgrade, the paints are pretty great and paint on like a charm.

 Singleton wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
Are you able to buy stuff online instead of in-store? If so, then your options can go beyond GW, or, at least, you'll be able to get discount GW from some places.

I can buy stuff online, yes. Suggestions on what to get from where?

TheWarStore is a good source for lots of stuff. Miniatures Market, too, although I've not used them. Of course, there is also Amazon. If you're specifically interested in getting a color along with its shade and highlight, Reaper's master series is something you might want to look at, they use a "triad" system specifically designed around base, shade, and highlight colors.

grumpy_newenglander wrote:
Don't understand the Citadel glue hate. Their plastic and superglue are both fine, reasonably priced items. Hardware you should get elsewhere (brushes and cutters), pick up an Xacto blade off Amazon for a few dollars. Replacement blades are cheap at stores like Walmart.

The "hate" for Citadel glue (and, well, most of their products) comes from the price. One 0.17oz bottle of GW super glue: $6.95 compared to one 0.75oz bottle of Gorilla Glue super glue for $5.97 from Home Depot.

Try thewarstore.com.

Many paints to choose from.

I suggest picking up the Army Painter quicks have ink set.
Take a look at the Vallejo sets.

Good luck and let us no what you choose.

I would say pick what colours you want to paint your army first and THEN buy your paints.

If you just buy a "starter set" you'll inevitably end up with a bunch of stuff you never use.

If you intend to mix paints, then you'll want a black, a white, a red, a yellow, a blue and maybe a medium brown and a light beige. But unless you come from an artistic background and know what you're doing with mixing, you'll be making things hard for yourself.

So start by deciding what colours you want to paint. Look at tutorials online to see what techniques they use and what colours they use. If the store near you has a painting table set up where you can paint in store, they'll often have paints in store that you can use while you initially learn how to paint and figure out what colours you need and you might even have some helpful people around who can guide you on what to do.

If you buy a starter set and THEN decide what colours you need to paint the army the way you want to paint it, I can pretty much guarantee your starter set will be missing paints you need and will have others that you don't need.

For glues and brushes and stuff. There is such a thing as "bad superglue", so I'd stick to things people have recommended. I can personally recommend loctite precision superglue (the one with the long nose) and for plastic glues I can recommend Testors model master glue (the one with the metal applicator, not the one with the plastic applicator), Revell plastic glue is good, as is Tamiya extra thin (though I mostly use that for small fiddly parts rather than large chunky parts). Brushes, stay away from synthetic brushes, they'll die very quickly, have a google on how to take care of your brushes (cleaning them, making sure paint doesn't get up around the ferrule, not leaving them in water, storing them so they don't get damaged).

^^^^
This.



I'd also add that it seems like most people go away from Citadel Paints eventually anyway, so it may be worth not bothering with them in the first place. Personally I can't recommend Reaper Master Series enough and I slightly regret that I bought so much Vallejo before I found it.

I'm just gonna steal all this good data. I literally just got back from raiding a hobby shop and buying.....everything.

I am not saying stay away from it, but I have really bad luck with those two dollar craft store bottles of acrylic, but I love the Gorilla super glue gel. cheap, and stays exactly where I put it.

What did you decide on for a palette? I found out how to build a wet palette with tupperware, foam, and parchment paper and holy mother of speedwalking, that thing works great.

Haven't settled on a pallete just yet. Will prolly buy the one GW sells.

 Singleton wrote:
Haven't settled on a pallete just yet. Will prolly buy the one GW sells.

Really you get a pallete from Hobbycraft or any art store that will be at least the equal of GW price for 1/2 the price of the latter product at the most.

 Singleton wrote:
Haven't settled on a pallete just yet. Will prolly buy the one GW sells.

If you're not going to use a wet palette, I would recommend a porcelain palette over a plastic one. They may cost more, but a porcelain palette is a lot easier to clean. Plastics eventually have to be tossed if you don't clean all of the paint off immediately after use, whereas with a porcelain palette you can leave dried paint on it for a month and after a brief soak in just plain water the paint comes right off. The one I use (linked above) I got at Hobby Lobby for about $3.60 before taxes after using their 40% off coupon.

 Ghaz wrote:

 Singleton wrote:
Haven't settled on a pallete just yet. Will prolly buy the one GW sells.

If you're not going to use a wet palette, I would recommend a porcelain palette over a plastic one. They may cost more, but a porcelain palette is a lot easier to clean. Plastics eventually have to be tossed if you don't clean all of the paint off immediately after use, whereas with a porcelain palette you can leave dried paint on it for a month and after a brief soak in just plain water the paint comes right off.

Huh? I've had the same plastic palette for about 10 years and it's still fine and I never clean paint off it immediately. I've had paint sitting in some of the cups literally for years, you just put a bit of alcohol in it and let it sit for a few minutes and the paint will peel off. I usually don't bother cleaning the cups at all until I come to use an alcohol based paint (like Tamiya or Gunze) at which point I have to clean it because the alcohol in the paint will strip the underlying layers and create a mess.

I wouldn't recommend it for strong solvents (like you might use if you were using enamels) but for acrylics, not a problem.

I just use some aluminium foil when I'm working with enamels or oils.

gw gak is terrible. best quality brushes are rosemary and Co. and then get anything that isnt a plastic pallet. wet pallet will help dilute paint for a newb naturally and keep it wet (i cant think of ANY reason to not use a wet pallet ever)

as for paints? use anything from reaper/gw/vallejo/army painter and you will be fine. DO NOT USE GW PRIMER (its not even primer im fairly sure) I use tamiya grey and its the best primer ive ever used

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
... you just put a bit of alcohol in it ...

Well, that's the problem right there. Using rubbing alcohol to clean a plastic palette isn't the first thing one would think of to clean a palette

 sockwithaticket wrote:
^^^^
This.



I'd also add that it seems like most people go away from Citadel Paints eventually anyway, so it may be worth not bothering with them in the first place. Personally I can't recommend Reaper Master Series enough and I slightly regret that I bought so much Vallejo before I found it.

I don't really have any problem with citadel paints other than the price and the pots. No other paints have I had dry out as frequently as GW's paints. But I still buy a lot of GW paints largely because for years the closest shops to me carried it and so it was the best option, I don't really like buying paints online so having stores that carry them is important to me. What is even nicer is the local GW lets me test paints before I buy them so if I'm unsure which one I want, I can have a play and decide before buying.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
]I don't really have any problem with citadel paints other than the price and the pots. No other paints have I had dry out as frequently as GW's paints. But I still buy a lot of GW paints largely because for years the closest shops to me carried it and so it was the best option, I don't really like buying paints online so having stores that carry them is important to me. What is even nicer is the local GW lets me test paints before I buy them so if I'm unsure which one I want, I can have a play and decide before buying.

I agree with this

I think there are a lot of GW paints that are inferior to other brands, but a lot that are actually fantastic and well worth using.

I've been painting for a long time now and still have half my paint stock as citadel, the only downsides I have are the price, and the pots.

One good workaround I've found was to buy dirt cheap dropper bottles online, get some ceramic beads, and transfer my paints into the bottles with a bead each. All of my citadel paints are at least 8 years old now, and in perfect order as they don't dry out when they are in proper drop bottles. I really hate the bloody pots

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 sockwithaticket wrote:
^^^^
This.



I'd also add that it seems like most people go away from Citadel Paints eventually anyway, so it may be worth not bothering with them in the first place. Personally I can't recommend Reaper Master Series enough and I slightly regret that I bought so much Vallejo before I found it.

I don't really have any problem with citadel paints other than the price and the pots. No other paints have I had dry out as frequently as GW's paints. .

Which tends to be why people end up looking for alternatives. Sorry, if it wasn't clear, but I definitely wasn't having a go at the quality of Citadel paints (at least while they're fairly fresh...); after all, most acryllic wargaming paints are much of a muchness with each line having good and bad paints. The distinguishing features then become price, container and unique colours.

I have used GW, Vallejo and Army Painter.

Pop top vs dropper bottle? Sometimes I wish I had both. Sometimes I want to mix a batch of paint and so dropper bottles are nice. Sometimes I just need a dab of paint and so its less wasteful to simply pop open the lid.

Quality? Sometimes Army Painter is definitely behind the other two here, but when you get a good batch of AP the quality is quite even.

Cost? Ugh, honestly who cares? If there is one thing you should not be shy about its paint. I would give my sore left one for a set of Golden acrylics, but then again they are top of the line. I like the AP line, they have some good colours, but then again so do VGC and GW.

One thing I will say about GW pots is that you should endeavour to keep the lids clean otherwise the compromised seal will turn your paint into gunk in about a day or two.

Am I the only one who thinks GW paints aren't an ideal choice, even for a beginner?

I mean they are about the most expensive paints out there, the pots they come in are awful to use and prone to drying out if not sealed correctly, and they're far thicker than most brands which will lead to visible brushstrokes & clumping unless they're carefully thinned which is something a beginner may struggle with.

After saying that it's true they're widely available and their color naming system will allow novices to follow many painting guides more easily.
However I've noticed that despite many top painters beginning their careers using GW paints, the majority seem to gravitate towards other paint brands sooner or later and few stick with GW exclusively.

I can't help but wonder if advising newbie painters to outlay on the GW range might lead them to purchases they may regret down the track.
If I were building a paint collection from scratch right now I'd be looking at the Warcolors brand instead. Much better bottle design, better range of colors, half the price of GW paints, and no marketing mumbo jumbo.

 Minimachine wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks GW paints aren't an ideal choice, even for a beginner?

I mean they are about the most expensive paints out there, the pots they come in are awful to use and prone to drying out if not sealed correctly, and they're far thicker than most brands which will lead to visible brushstrokes & clumping unless they're carefully thinned which is something a beginner may struggle with.

After saying that it's true they're widely available and their color naming system will allow novices to follow many painting guides more easily.
However I've noticed that despite many top painters beginning their careers using GW paints, the majority seem to gravitate towards other paint brands sooner or later and few stick with GW exclusively.

I can't help but wonder if advising newbie painters to outlay on the GW range might lead them to purchases they may regret down the track.
If I were building a paint collection from scratch right now I'd be looking at the Warcolors brand instead. Much better bottle design, better range of colors, half the price of GW paints, and no marketing mumbo jumbo.

I honestly am stuck trying to decide which paint to get. Everyone says this and that about every brand and why this brand is good/bad and why this other brand is good/bad. It's all very confusing and since paint is fairly expensive, I don't want to just dive in blind, but at the same time, there's no definitive answer for which paint brand is best.