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What was the increase of the dakka razorback? I understand it was undercosted before, but presumably that does not make it a bad unit now.

Well it's not too bad, maybe a 15ish increase. It's a durable platform with decent gun options. And you can fit 2 plasmaguns (normal and combi) and a plasma pistol to the GH pack but it gets kinda expensive. I'd propably keep them pretty barebones and let the RB do the work. I'd save the wargear points for the more elite choices.

But until we get our codex and full stratagems I don't think the +3cp from battalion are absolutely necessary.

I typically run a Batallion with Bjorn as my Warlord so I get 7 CPs at 1500 points and above. Even if you are just using the reroll strat, I find the CPs useful and my Grey Hunters have never failed to pull their weight. My Hunters have dealt with everything from Daemon Engines to Eldar Jetbikes.

 Niiai wrote:
What was the increase of the dakka razorback? I understand it was undercosted before, but presumably that does not make it a bad unit now.

Dakkaback is now 70 (base model) + 44 (Twin cannon) = 114 points.

What where razorbacks before? 100? 114 is not that bad for 2 assault cannons and 10 wounds.

So I just got a good deal on thunderwolf calvary, 6 for 25$, but they didn't have any arms. I have no experience with these guys, all I have gathered so far is

1. Run them with a wolf priest with jump pack for healing and cc bonus.
2. Put storm shields on a few.

So I was thinking

Leader - 2x wolf claws.
3 with 2 x wolf claws
2 with storm shields and chainswords

I would use them for pure number of attacks, I have wulfen with thunder hammer storm shields for hitting stuff harder, and str 5 isn't bad in my opinion, but is there a better option? Should I just go cheap and do chainsword on all of them? Or should I just magnetize them, which still would not help me figure out what their roll should be.

Advice appreciated in advance.

I'm running my TWC with claws in this edition, sometimes the leader has the hammer since he got more attacks. I usually keep 1-2 dudes stock or with just a shield, the first casualties to remove. 3 shields for 5-6 dudes.

Tipycally my 5 man unit has a leader with hammer and shield, one with 2 claws, one with bolt pistol and chainsword, one with shield and chainsword and one with shield and claw. Alternatively two claws also to the leader and to the stock guy.

Razorbacks are still underpriced and since several other popular units went down in price (GH, long fangs, wulfen, TWC, terminators) they're still very good.

Oh wow. Thanks for the replies guys, that gives me some ideas to tinker around with. I will start playing around with lists!

 Blackie wrote:
I'm running my TWC with claws in this edition, sometimes the leader has the hammer since he got more attacks. I usually keep 1-2 dudes stock or with just a shield, the first casualties to remove. 3 shields for 5-6 dudes.

Tipycally my 5 man unit has a leader with hammer and shield, one with 2 claws, one with bolt pistol and chainsword, one with shield and chainsword and one with shield and claw. Alternatively two claws also to the leader and to the stock guy.

Razorbacks are still underpriced and since several other popular units went down in price (GH, long fangs, wulfen, TWC, terminators) they're still very good.

Thanks, that helps a lot.

I just wish wulfen and thunderwolfs where not so dang expensive. Space wolves just don't get many models on the board of their unique stuff.

Azuza001 wrote:

 Blackie wrote:
I'm running my TWC with claws in this edition, sometimes the leader has the hammer since he got more attacks. I usually keep 1-2 dudes stock or with just a shield, the first casualties to remove. 3 shields for 5-6 dudes.

Tipycally my 5 man unit has a leader with hammer and shield, one with 2 claws, one with bolt pistol and chainsword, one with shield and chainsword and one with shield and claw. Alternatively two claws also to the leader and to the stock guy.

Razorbacks are still underpriced and since several other popular units went down in price (GH, long fangs, wulfen, TWC, terminators) they're still very good.

Thanks, that helps a lot.

I just wish wulfen and thunderwolfs where not so dang expensive. Space wolves just don't get many models on the board of their unique stuff.

Wulfen are expensive because they're worth it - a squad of ten will massacre Imperial Knights, Wraithknights, Guiliman, Magnus or pretty much any other thing they get into combat with and using the Cunning of the Wolf strategem the likelyhood of them getting into combat is much higher than it was before Chapter Approved dropped.
Thunderwolves...as much as they improved losing S10 was a huge blow and the ease of access to mortal wounds has made Storm Shields on them kind of 'meh'. People have managed to build armies around them but they are lynchpin armies that can be pulled apart easily if opponents have the tools, annoyingly the tools are common in my meta.

How are good sw armies build now?

Generic gunline
Alpha strike combi plasma
High T saturation

Are those the only once?

One of the guys who occassionally plays in the same tournaments as me had success today with what he calls a "Pop goes the Wolves" strategy.
Basically uses Dreads and deepstriking firepower to draw the enemy's units apart then deepstrike in gaps and blow them to bits, doesn't work so great against 2+ armour saves but it puts down Imperial Knights pretty consistently.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
One of the guys who occassionally plays in the same tournaments as me had success today with what he calls a "Pop goes the Wolves" strategy.
Basically uses Dreads and deepstriking firepower to draw the enemy's units apart then deepstrike in gaps and blow them to bits, doesn't work so great against 2+ armour saves but it puts down Imperial Knights pretty consistently.

With the Lucis Droppod being cheaper than normal Droppod now, it is good to put Dreads in it now.

Neophyte2012 wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
One of the guys who occassionally plays in the same tournaments as me had success today with what he calls a "Pop goes the Wolves" strategy.
Basically uses Dreads and deepstriking firepower to draw the enemy's units apart then deepstrike in gaps and blow them to bits, doesn't work so great against 2+ armour saves but it puts down Imperial Knights pretty consistently.

With the Lucis Droppod being cheaper than normal Droppod now, it is good to put Dreads in it now.

Where can I find this information?
I miss dropping Dreads.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:

Neophyte2012 wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
One of the guys who occassionally plays in the same tournaments as me had success today with what he calls a "Pop goes the Wolves" strategy.
Basically uses Dreads and deepstriking firepower to draw the enemy's units apart then deepstrike in gaps and blow them to bits, doesn't work so great against 2+ armour saves but it puts down Imperial Knights pretty consistently.

With the Lucis Droppod being cheaper than normal Droppod now, it is good to put Dreads in it now.

Where can I find this information?
I miss dropping Dreads.

Chapter Approved. There is a few pages about the new points of FW units.

Fourty point drop might be enough to consider dropping a missile-assault cannon dread on some poor bastard...or bringing Murderfang back into the game.

One of our lords re-rolls 1 in a bauble. Long fangs already do this. But how about venerable dreads that hit on 2+? Could that be a cool thing?

What charecters, if any, would you put on a thunderwolf? I was thinking wolf lord / wolf guard then 6 regular as an expensive but powerful front line assault squad with wulfen and blood claws coming in using the stratagem so it would be a two pronged attack. Or run the blood claws in rhinos and then have them run up the side where I plan on the wulfen showing up. But I don't know if it's worth it to do thunderwolfs or jet packs or bikes for my charecters. Or foot slog / rhino riders.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
Fourty point drop might be enough to consider dropping a missile-assault cannon dread on some poor bastard...or bringing Murderfang back into the game.

Murderfang works pretty well already. He is a character so cannot be targetted unless he is the closest unit. Walk him up the board behind an Axe/Shield Dread and advance them both. You should be able to pull off a T2 charge.

Azuza001 wrote:
What charecters, if any, would you put on a thunderwolf? I was thinking wolf lord / wolf guard then 6 regular as an expensive but powerful front line assault squad with wulfen and blood claws coming in using the stratagem so it would be a two pronged attack. Or run the blood claws in rhinos and then have them run up the side where I plan on the wulfen showing up. But I don't know if it's worth it to do thunderwolfs or jet packs or bikes for my charecters. Or foot slog / rhino riders.

Wolf lord on thunderwolf with the relic sword is my fav HQ at the moment. In fact I'm currently playing 2 HQs among only 4 choices: him, arjac, njal and a stock wolf priest that I put in the flyer with wulfen.

 Blackie wrote:

Azuza001 wrote:
What charecters, if any, would you put on a thunderwolf? I was thinking wolf lord / wolf guard then 6 regular as an expensive but powerful front line assault squad with wulfen and blood claws coming in using the stratagem so it would be a two pronged attack. Or run the blood claws in rhinos and then have them run up the side where I plan on the wulfen showing up. But I don't know if it's worth it to do thunderwolfs or jet packs or bikes for my charecters. Or foot slog / rhino riders.

Wolf lord on thunderwolf with the relic sword is my fav HQ at the moment. In fact I'm currently playing 2 HQs among only 4 choices: him, arjac, njal and a stock wolf priest that I put in the flyer with wulfen.

Wolf Lord on Thurnderwolf is a good choice, but I prefer a simple Thurnder Hammer over that Relic sword. it has real good AP but that "low" strength and damage hurts......

For the extra points, I think a Thunder Hammer is well worth it. Sure it may be overkill against 1-wound infantry but as soon as you come up against anything with multiple wounds, you will be glad you took the hammer.

Yeah, it really depends on how you want to play him. I always field the lord along with TWC equipped with claws and shields, so I prefer the anti infantry loadout for him. And I've also got wulfen and terminators, usually with arjac, that wield thunder hammers.

 Karhedron wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
Fourty point drop might be enough to consider dropping a missile-assault cannon dread on some poor bastard...or bringing Murderfang back into the game.

Murderfang works pretty well already. He is a character so cannot be targetted unless he is the closest unit. Walk him up the board behind an Axe/Shield Dread and advance them both. You should be able to pull off a T2 charge.

So far he's been offed in every game I've used him. People keep telling me to use him as a Distraction Carnifex but even though he's a priority he's almost double the cost of the Carnifex.
Dropping him has its downsides but eight extra wounds and a turn two charge could make him more useful rather than just threatening.

So I used murderfang tonight for the first time vs my nephews ultramarines, man what a battle. Disclaimer : we played index vs index, so he didn't use any stratagems from the codex against me.

I took 5 Wulfen, 5 thunderwolves, 20 Grey Hunters, 10 blood claws, a wolf priest w/ jump pack, and murderfang. Everything did exactly like I expected except for the wolf priest, I kept him near the thunder wolves but come charge time the wolves made a charge he didn't and then killed their target. Nephews next turn he unloaded his entire army onto the wolves and killed them all before I could get a chance to try and heal wounds. Oh well, that made an amazing fire magnet lol.

The thing I found with murderfang is giving him the warlord trait is a must. Tenacious survivor really helps mitigate that no invulnerable save thing, end of game murderfang had one wound left. Without the survivor trait he would have been dead and I probably would have lost. As it was he killed 10 tacticals, 3 terminators, and at the end charged and killed a full health dreadnought in a single round of combat.

My only change I would make next time is I would need to find more room in the list for 2 rhinos. But everything did so well I can't find fault with any one thing.

Murderfang cant be a warlord can he??? hes insane!!

COLD CASH wrote:
Murderfang cant be a warlord can he??? hes insane!!

Any model in your army can be the warlord. If said model is also a Character you get to pick a warlord trait.

BAs and DAs got access to some SM vehicles/flyers with their codex. Do you think we will get them also and are they useful for us at all?

I hope we won't get them as the completionist in me would have to buy 3 of each even if I never intend to use them

Ragnar69 wrote:
BAs and DAs got access to some SM vehicles/flyers with their codex. Do you think we will get them also and are they useful for us at all?

I hope we won't get them as the completionist in me would have to buy 3 of each even if I never intend to use them

Well I don't see why we wouldn't get them, since GW probably wants your money.

Wishlisting here but I'd love to see the Helfrost concept taken a bit further. Maybe a Predator variant with a Helfrost Destructor on top and Helfrost cannons as sponsons. I would probably buy two in a heartbeat. Maybe also a Helfrost carbine as a special weapon and Helfrost Cannon Long Fangs etc.

But would you really field helfrost? I find it sub-par compared to the other options.