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30k Salamanders: A rules break down. UPDATED 2018  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Made in us
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





United States

Hey everyone! A few years ago, I wrote this rules breakdown for the Salamanders and I’ve realized recently that a lot of what I said wasn’t actually correct. Fear not! (Salamanders certainly don’t) I have returned much as our favorite red eyed hammer man to correct my mistakes!
I hope this is useful for anyone playing Horus Heresy, enjoy! (Note this is written with the new HH rulebook in mind).

Lets start off with our Legiones Astartes rule!
-Legiones Astartes:So as with all Astartes we regroup at our normal leadership value regardless of casualties.

-Strength of Will:This is a great ability friends. All Salamander units with this special rule auto-pass any fear checks they are required to make (suck it Konrad!) and MUST re-roll a single D6 when morale and pinning tests are failed. The second part of this rule is wonderful, it basically saves you 10 points on any squad you were going to buy a vexilla for! (This really combos well with Vulkan in the army for the LD boost!) VALUE.

-Promethean Gift:This is one of the rules as Salamander players you should be abusing regularly. +1 strength on flamers, hand flamers, and heavy flamers…ouch. But wait, there’s more! -1 strength from all flamer attacks used against you! This is a glorious rule, I don’t think it needs much explaining. (NOTE: Pyroclasts do not add +1 strength to their flame projectors, as it is already represented in their profile!)

-Nocturne Born:Our gift and curse, and actually a rule you really need to pay attention to and dig around the BRB to fully understand, Ill break it down for you! All Salamander units reduce their run and charge moves by -1 to a minimum of 1”. (Ok that’s simple) All Salamander units do not add their initiative score to their sweeping advance rolls. This is the confusing part. I spent a long time reading into this, and I’ve concluded that it really isn’t as bad as it sounds.
-Obviously when you’re attempting to slaughter a beaten unit you only get a D6 for your role, no adding +4 for your initiative value. (in this case you are pursuing an enemy unit and therefore making a sweeping advance roll.)
-Here’s the part that is confusing. If you read the Sweeping advance rules in the BRB the only time making the test is referenced to is in regards to the attacker. Yes the player running away also roles a dice and adds his/her initiative to the result but this is NOT a sweeping advance role. The player who is running away is simply rolling a reference number to compare to the result of the player making a sweeping advance test.
-To sum it up, you don’t add your initiative when trying to sweep a unit, but when a player is attempting to sweep you, add your initiative as normal.

Now lets take a look at our fabulous Legion specific Wargear!

-Mantle of the Elder Drake:This is an auto include on every Praetor, every game, every point level, always, EVERYTIME. +20 points, give your Praetor ETERNAL WARRIOR.

-Dragon-Scale Storm Shield: Aren’t we spoiled on our Wargear hehe. Although only the Fists have access to real storm shields, these can be just as good. The bearer adds +1 to their invulnerable save to a max of 3+ or provides a 5+ if you don’t already have an invulnerable save. Again, this is an amazing tool, Ill talk more about this shield in the builds section.

-Artificer Weapons:Just abuse the feth out of this. +5 points, one weapon gains master-crafted. (Also lets you save 10 points on Praetors instead of purchasing the 15 point option that does the same


RITES OF WAR:

-The Covenant of Fire:This is our bread and butter Rite of War, and easily one of the best Legion specific rites in the game. Don’t want to be another Pride of the Legion pleb? Here you are my child…
-Obsidian Forged: All Salamander vehicles gain a 5+ invulnerable save against Melta, Volkite, Plasma, and Flamer weapons of all types. AND ALSO MELTA BOMBS (this is amazing with the reincarnation of multi bombing in assault!) Basically this, combined with armored Ceramite, forces the explicit use of Lascannons to take your vehicles down reliably. VALUE.
-Veneration of Wrath: All Melta guns, Inferno pistols, and Multi-Meltas gain master-crafted. This is so good. We will speak of this further in the builds section.
-Implacable: All UNITS IN THE DETACHMENT gain the move through cover rule. This is truly insane. Not only does this affect all your infantry (making charging through difficult terrain only a -1 due to Promethean Gift.) it extends to everything in your army, Dreadnoughts, Vehicles, hell even Vulkan. Basically, you never need to buy dozer blades for your vehicles. Just DRIVE UP THE DAMNED WALL.
-Limitations: No deep strike, must have more troops than Heavy Support and Fast Attack, No FORTS, only one consul choice (Easy to work around with two of our special characters being Chaplains


Time for a break down of our special units!

-Pyroclasts: Vulkan created these guys to replace his Destroyer squads, because burning people alive is much more acceptable than giving people super cancer. Don’t question it. BURN HERETIC!
Very good all-around unit, and with our Covenant of Fire Rite of War they become non-compulsory Troops instead of Heavy support if desired. Ill list pros and cons below!

Pros:
-5 to 10 strength 5 flamers or 6” strength 6 ap 1 melta guns
-Great area denial, (your opponent either tries to focus fire them, or they ignore you and get tons of templates).
-OMG OVERWATCH HAHAHAHA
-Artificer armor on every member
-5+ invuln against flamer, Volkite, plasma, and melta weapons.
-Can take a land raider Phobos or Proteus as a transport.
-Every member can have a melta bomb (remember how multi bombing is back?

Cons:
-Slow unit unless given a somewhat expensive ride.
-Very short range to be effective.
-Not very effective in close combat against infantry


-Firedrake Terminators: Ah, not a single unit of all my armies have even given such repeated butt-hurt syndrome to my opponents….
Like Centurion HQ choices? Want a squad of them?
Firedrakes are your hammer. Your army is the anvil. Break your opponent’s will to live with a unit of these men.

Pros:
-All weapon skill 5
-2 wounds per model
-4+ invulnerable increase to 3+ with Dragon Scale storm shield.
-Can take thunder hammers and chain fists.
-The Firedrake master literally is an HQ choice with 2 wounds and 3 attacks base.
-Can take a Proteus (never do this), Phobos, or Spartan as a transport
-Count as scoring units

Cons:
-Slow unless transported
-Prone to attracting every Lascannon and missile launcher on the table.


Cassian Dracos:
Bray'arth Ashmantle is arguably the best dreadnought in 40k, and this guy is better (and the original occupant of Ashmantle's dreadnought).
It Will Not Die, Venerable, Armored Ceramite, Immune to the effects of lance, armor bane, melta, sunder, ect , 5 Attacks on the charge at WS 6 and Str10AP1 with Sunder (re-rolls failed armor penetration rolls) He can forfeit his attacks to inflict an automatic strength 6 AP 4 hit on any model in base contact (friend or foe)
He has two heavy flamers or a twin-linked melta gun, searchlight, nuncio-vox, and smoke launchers.
Oh and did I mention 4 Hull points and front armor 14?


Lord Chaplain Nomus Rhy’Tan:
His other title that my gaming group has bestowed upon him is "Mini Vulkan" and this a title well earned. You won’t find a more survivable and damn strong non-Primarch combat character in the Horus Heresy. First off, he's a chaplain, so any unit he joins gains Zealot. He has a 2+ armor save, 4+ Invulnerable save, ETERNAL WARRIOR, 4 (on the charge) WS 6, Strength 6 AP 2, Initiative 5 attacks of awesome with concussive and Armor bane. also a combi flamer

His place is always alongside Vulkan and a big squad of Firedrakes in a spartan. Also his weapon is called Darkstar Falling, how epic is that?


VULKAN: Our big friendly, brother…. friend. Perpetually booping the snoots of all who oppose the progress of hugs and friendship.
Vulkan is easily one of the best Primarchs in the game. And Primarchs honestly arent that competitive for their points cost. He clocks in at 425 points. But if you use the Lord of Drakes correctly, he will double or triple that number in return.
He’s nigh un-killable by himself. Toughness 7 and halves the strength, rounding down, for any Plasma, Fusion, Volkite, Melta, and Flamer weapons used against him. (This only works if he’s by himself.) Furthermore, he may re-roll his deny the witch and IWND tests and sports a 2+ armor and 3++ invulnerable save.
All salamanders add +1 to their Leadership and gain adamantium will.
As for weapons you don’t get much better than Dawnbringer. S10, Ap1 two handed, instant death, armor bane, concussive, Earth Shatter (he can make a template attack instead of attacking normally.
He has a strength 6 Heavy flamer and a neat little beam weapon for shooting

BUILDS AND TACTICS:
This section will list some various builds and tactics that I find enjoyable and effective!

Legion Tactical Squads: 20 man squad, attached apothecary with MC-power sword and artificer armor. Sergeant always has artificer armor, melta bombs, and a MC- Power maul. The squad always takes an additional CCW.
This build is easily my most favorite unit. The sheer amount of damage they can dish out and punishment they can take is staggering. Either fury of the legion and fire between 40 and 80 shots, advance and fire 20-40 shots, or advance fire 20 bolt pistol shots then charge with 60 close combat attacks. The master-crafted power maul allows the sergeant to reliably hit against his opponent who most likely has a power fist. So hit more, wound with pretty much everything and make the enemy sergeant roll a 1. (artificer armor). All while going first.
A variant of this without the apothecary and riding in a rhino is very good as well.

Rhino APC: A master-crafted multi-melta on all my transports you say? MWHAHAHAHA have fun shooting my rhino with that land raider or risk getting killed by 60 points.

Legion Tartaros Terminator Squad:Another favorite build of mine, I usually load these guys up in an assault ram to get them where they need to go quick. The build is as follows:
-HF/CF X2
-Combi Flamer/LC X5
-TH/DSS X3 (including sergeant)
-Grenade harness
The three thunder hammer storm shields provide a few 4+ invulnerable saves for your squad, while the remaining members all have flame weapons that will rack up a ton of wounds. Lighting claws will also mess up MEQ and even add some extra armor saves against terminators at higher initiative. The Chain fists are obviously for vehicles and cleaning up terminators, alongside the thunder hammers. The Sergeant is an effective character duelist with S8 and Conclusive. Be very aggressive with this squad and target enemy assault units, either hit them with a wall of flame and then charge or bait them into eating a ton of overwatch.

Leviathan Dreadnought: Cyclic Melta Lance and a Siege Wrecker, underslung Volkite Calivers for ranged damage. This is a great all-around leviathan build. Go mess up some Knights.

Pyroclasts:Melta bombs for the Squad, Master-crafted power fist on the Sgt. Load them in a land raider proteus with X3 Tl Lascannons, use these guys defensively, unload and clear an objective, hold in your backfield for outflanking enemies, or bait people into eating your mass overwatch. Be aggressive against any vehicles you can feasibly get to. The new Terrax assault drill sounds like a pretty scary option for these guys!

Firedrake Terminators: I always run these guys with their stock model build. TH/SS. Take advantage of that. Only change I would make to the squad if you really want to is replace a couple thunder hammers with chain fists. Just at least leave a thunder hammer on the firedrake master for dueling.

Vulkan: Lately I’ve found Vulkan gets much more value if you take advantage of his survivability. Run him alone and send him at any walkers, tanks, and monsters you can find. They will all be deleted easily. “I WOULD LIKE TO PET THIS CREATURE. IT WOULD BE BUT A SINGLE BOOP UPON HIS NOGGIN!” Alternatively, send him at tactical support squads because flamers, Volkite, and plasma can’t actually wound you, and melta can only on a 6. Due to him halving the strength rounding down of these weapons.
Primarch fights are optional, very cool, but not very effective. He does very well with concussive and re-rolling his IWND. Better to do this if you’re rocking a death star.

Vulkan and Friends: Speaking of death stars…. X10 Firedrakes, Primus Medicae, Nomus Rhy’Tan, and Vulkan all loaded up in a spartan assault tank. Good luck opponents. I use this in big point games to kill everyone’s hopes and dreams. FNP and Hatred go a looooonnngg way.

This message was edited 26 times. Last update was at 2020/09/29 19:27:44


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





UK

You make me want to play Salamanders...

Ooh White Scars Blood Angels or Sallies...gah. I should pick a legion and stick with it

YMDC = nightmare 
   
Made in us
Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine




You can upgrade Vulkan with Master crafted? Normally you can't alter special characters.

What book is the relic in?

I've chosen 30k Salamanders because Vulkan is my favorite Primarch. So far I have Vulkan, Firedrakes, Pyroclasts, 3 jet bikes, a Spartan, and the BaC box.
   
Made in il
Warplord Titan Princeps of Tzeentch






I'm reading this and just going "Wat. People claim THIS is fair play VS 40k?!"

can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now. 
   
Made in us
Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine




No, Its not balanced versus 40k. But then 7th edition 40k isn't balanced at all anyway.
   
Made in au
Liche Priest Hierophant







@ Boomwolf:
Tbf though you do pay out the rear end points-wise for a lot of these benefits, and if you don't you get some restrictions.

The legion rules are arguably worse than in 40k (re-rolling To Wound and Fnp(4+) is better than +1 str flamers and treating enemy flamers as having -1 str, and in 40k you ignore fear already and Leadership means basically nothing when you aut-regroup and can't be swept)

Also, though the Rite of War gives many good benefits, it forces you to have more troops than HS/FA, forces you to only have one Consul (think Chaplain, Librarian, Master of the Forge type characters) other than a Champion (arguably one of the weaker Consuls) and makes it so you can't Deep Strike anything.

Honestly at lower-to-average point levels, 40k Salamanders are just plain better than their 30k incarnation all things considered.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/14 06:35:39


 
   
Made in gb
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan





Fareham

While I love my 30k salamanders, you haven't said about points :p

Basic firedrakes and landraider price, adding up to 350+ with upgrades, for 5.

Phroclasts are a steal for the price, but no access to a cheap transport without stealing someone else's.

Cassian is just a beast, a land raider priced beast, but solid none the less.




30k is very easy to start racking up points without realising as everything has upgrades.

   
Made in us
Bounding Assault Marine





Illinois

 Jackal wrote:
While I love my 30k salamanders, you haven't said about points :p

Basic firedrakes and landraider price, adding up to 350+ with upgrades, for 5.

Phroclasts are a steal for the price, but no access to a cheap transport without stealing someone else's.

Cassian is just a beast, a land raider priced beast, but solid none the less.




30k is very easy to start racking up points without realising as everything has upgrades.


It's true that you can easily rack up points quite quickly in 30k (especially with Pyroclasts and Firedrakes and a Primarch involved) but typically 30k is meant to be played on a larger scale (like say 2500 points or more).
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut



Orlando

Not fair vs 40k? Try 500 points. Bare bones you are looking at a minimum 350 points and all you get is 18 tac marines with bolters who cannot be upgraded with anything aside from an extra CCW for a couple points each, 2 sgts which can be upgraded normally, and a 2 wound character. Once you do any upgrades on the sgts and character you are left with hopefully enough points to either buy a support squad with all flamers or more marines in your two squads. Sound great except the marines will still run and you have few special weapons.

1000 gives you a little more room to play but you are still going to be outnumbered by everything and probably outgunned. You do not start seeing parity until you hit the 2k+ level and even then, legions have some major negatives that can be used against them.

Infantrymen do not die, they go to heaven and regroup. 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Springfield, VA

Yeah, the points for this is insane. Like, it's balanced vs 40k simply because 40k actually gets to play 40k instead of some skirmish mockery at 1000 points. My Cybernetica army at 1k ha s fewer models than most Warmachine armies at 35 points, haha.

Also, 30k is balanced against itself because all the legion rules are pretty fantastic, the Mechanicum rules are awesome, Auxilia get superheavy tanks as Heavy Support choices (lol), and Imperial Cults is basically the most customizeable army that either system has ever seen (HELLOOO doctrines!)
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Earth

Bear in mind dracos is not immune to Ord weapons, pretty much the only weapons that can actually kill him.

Good review, I disagree on the pyroclasts, against most units they simply don't do enough damage to warrant thier points, before being shot to death or assaulted by 2 or more units, but that's just my experience.

If you don't mind I'll be nicking this and adding it to my over all review of the units in hh, I'll of course give you the credit.
   
Made in us
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





United States

Dont mind at all. And keep in mind nothing in 30k has ATSKNF, so comparing it to 40k in that regard and in general doesn't raise any point. These are ment to play against 30k, but it's still quite fun in 40k. Also, 30k games become fun at around 2500 points. Things die quick and are more expensive in most cases. Plus its the damn Horus Heresy, have some big battles.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Thanks for sharing, I have been collecting Salamanders for 40k, and recently started adding to my 30k collection (bought a couple of Calth boxes, Vulkan, and two units of firedrakes).
   
Made in us
Depraved Slaanesh Chaos Lord




Inside Yvraine

 BoomWolf wrote:
I'm reading this and just going "Wat. People claim THIS is fair play VS 40k?!"
Yeah. Tau, Daemons, Necrons and Pentyrant lists can all casually handle the toughest salamanders lists. 40K is stronger on average than 30K below ~2000 points.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/17 22:58:24


 
   
Made in us
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





United States

Updated and fixed any mistakes! Enjoy
   
Made in us
Abel





Washington State

Good stuff, and thank you for sharing!

Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience  
   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon





Florida

Thank you for this write up! I am just starting my collection for my Salamander 30k army.

SickSix's Silver Skull WIP thread
My Youtube Channel
JSF wrote:... this is really quite an audacious move by GW, throwing out any pretext that this is a game and that its customers exist to do anything other than buy their overpriced products for the sake of it. The naked arrogance, greed and contempt for their audience is shocking.
= Epic First Post.
 
   
Made in us
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





United States

Further cleaning has been done post Summer FAQ. Mainly concerning Vulkan being alone or attached to a character and using his armor abilities. (It has now been stated that he MUST be alone).
   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon





Florida

Great updated overview! Still trying to build my army. Will definitely refer back to this when I get closer to playing.

SickSix's Silver Skull WIP thread
My Youtube Channel
JSF wrote:... this is really quite an audacious move by GW, throwing out any pretext that this is a game and that its customers exist to do anything other than buy their overpriced products for the sake of it. The naked arrogance, greed and contempt for their audience is shocking.
= Epic First Post.
 
   
Made in au
Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Australia

Agreed, Sallies make amazing armoured breakthrough / mechanised assault armies. Amazing death stars, requires another seriously armoured list to tackle (sicarian with the death lazer, lascannon squads in forts, quad mortars, medusas, etc.) Since most people aren't donkey-caves, and use metla guns and melta bombs, sallies can capitalise on that.

Imagine a mechanised army with lots of death stares that you cant kill with anything melta, that's really hard. And your termies/flamers/ meltas are super deadly. They can survive one round and dish out as much pain.

I play blackshields and I want to use them as sallies to represent the survivors or Istvaan. I want to use an Age of Sigmar lord on Drake. The fluff is that this is Vulcan's cute doggo create dragon - Vulcan loves to hug it and it also survived Istavaan. So I want to model a mad man riding vulcan's massive drake that can survive all of Vulcan's hugs.

Anyway man, great feedback. I agree with everything you said. Its only a shame Salamander players are so unrepresented.

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