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My friend and I played our second game yesterday. We're still getting to grips with the rules so there was a lot of paging through the rulebook and trying to figure things out. We felt the Mature Angel was extremely tough for the Epirians to deal with. A lucky shot from a scarecrow took off one of its FOR points, but in general the fire coming in couldn't hurt it because of its high MAS (my opponent was often able to score three Penetrations, but that's not enough to inflict any damage). The Angel's Bloodthirsty attribute meant it didn't really care about Suppresion Tokens either, as it was close enough to just start rampaging through the Epirian units.

I guess the first question is regarding Defensive Fire: the rules indicate each unit's Defensive Fire is completed before the next one takes place. That means that different units can't combine their firepower to deal with the Angel, right?

The second question is: how do you kill it? My 150 point list has TWO of these monsters in it...

Off-topic, I need to say how great I feel this game is. It's rekindled my joy in miniature gaming, and where things stand right now, it's looking a lot like it's everything I want in a wargame. Well done, SAS!

Yeah man, I was playing a game on Saturday and this jerk I was playing had one of these things. I COULD NOT KILL IT! And now I hear he's planning on fielding TWO in his ne... oh.. Hi angryboy2k, didn't know you posted here too...

Seriously, I just want to know if I'm doing something wrong. I hit it with scarecrows, dual strike missile pods on hunters... all I did was make it mad. It had tons of suppression tokens on it, but all that did was make it charge stuff... which was very bad for me. Any help?

1) Remember all Angels have the 'Kill Mission' ability which means they can't hold objective markers themselves. A force that has two of them will not have that many other units to hold objectives, so it may be possible to simply focus on wiping out the other units that are tasked with holding objectives (usually Shadow Walkers) and just let the Angel do its thing. Of course, that won't work in every mission, so with that in mind, ways to better kill it would be:

2) Go for the biggest-sized squads possible. As 'MAS' is like a breaking point you have to get past to do actual damage, the more firepower in the same round of shooting, the better. Joining a character to this (already) big unit is even better, especially as the Bot Handler's Dominator Pistol is DAM2. Giving a Journeyman Bot Handler a 2nd Dominator pistol (to give him an extra shot) and then joining him to a full-sized Contractor or especially a Spider Drone unit (where the Apprentice Bot Handler has another Dominator Pistol) should do serious work on the Angel.

3) Arming a Hunter specifically to tackle an Angel is never a bad idea...mainly keep the Maglock Chaingun and give it 2 Strike Missile Pods. You can take some kind of anti-infantry for its 4th weapon to give the Hunter a little versatility, but since it can only fire 3 shots even when its undamaged, you're going to stick with the Chaingun and 2 Strike Missiles at the Angel. Just make sure you do this ASAP, as once the Hunter suffers an injury its down to firing 2 weapons and will then need to get lucky with his Maglock Chaingun (roll a '6' to hit w/'Burst') to have a chance.

4) Make sure you utilize the 'Hold & Fire' action to make 'Focused Fire' against the angel. This will improve what you need to roll to hit by +1, which, when every shot counts, is absolutely crucial. The fact that a large model like an Angel cannot ignore hits via cover means when you line up a good round of Focused Fire with a big squad, you should do some serious damage. And remember, if you enable the Bot Protocols on a Hunter, then it is able to make a single move and still do 'Focused Fire'...and don't forget about the open ground bonus movement (the extra D3") while doing this.

5) Surprisingly, a full-sized firefly drone unit firing at low power is also one of your best options...firing 20 shots, even if they are PEN1, all you need are 12 hits to, by the odds inflict an injury. So look for opportunities to get a clean shot where its EVS isn't doubled and you'll only need 4's to hit. Yes, this means by odds you'll only get 10 hits, but it can definitely happen. And remember that Fireflies can make double-moves and still fire at full effect, and even make a flanking maneuver at the start of the game to come on from the edge of the board when you want/need them...so you should be able to find those clean shots with them.

6) Just like the Hunter, as an Angel loses FOR, it loses the ability to fire multiple weapons. That means if you are able to get an Angel down to FOR1, its MV is halved, and it is only firing 1 ranged weapon. Unless you really need to kill the Angel for a mission objective, you should probably leave it and focus on other units (make the Karist player 'kill' his Angel if he wants).

7) Keep in mind the limitations of the form the Angel is in. If the Angel is in combat form with the AV boost, its only applying to its front or rear arc. So if you're able to get a unit into the Angel's rear arc, you can do some surprising damage. Using the Hunter's Bot Protocol to move and still shoot Focused Fire can occasionally pull this off, especially with the Hunter's fairly long range on its Chaingun & Strike Missiles. If the Angel is in Winged Form, then firing at it with your Firefly Drones first will 'paint' the Angel, meaning the Strike Missiles fired by a Hunter cannot be ignored by the Angel's Dodge (as they are Smart weapons when firing at a painted target). Also, although the Angel can charge due to 'Bloodthirsty', it is limited to a double move (14", as open ground bonus movement doesn't apply to a charge)...so if you can see that the Angel has a lot of STs on it, and you have only 1 or 2 units within 14", consider trying to activate those units first and move them out of range.

Thanks for all these suggestions, Yakface. I'm sure that Tarislar will do his best to implement some of them when we next play.

In the context of our last game, I like adding the Bot Handler to a squad and retreating best. If the Epirians could have moved themselves out of threat range the Angel would have had to sit tight for a turn or two and they could perhaps have finished it off from afar.

angryboy2k wrote:
Thanks for all these suggestions, Yakface. I'm sure that Tarislar will do his best to implement some of them when we next play.

Nah, I was just planning on fielding the same army as I did last time and then coming here to whine about the model being horribly overpowered, the game being unbalanced and threaten to sell all my stuff on E-bay unless they nerf it.