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Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

As a reminder:
 motyak wrote:
Feel free to start a new thread, this one is going to remain locked. There is too much rude behaviour to think that it can remotely pick up on the right side of dakka dakka's rules.

When creating a new thread, keep in mind my above post. In this new thread we're not discussing the Nazi punch. At all. You had a chance to discuss it and you have blown it. Make sure the new thread has a sensible title so we don't have to edit it first thing again, and try and keep the thread sensible for at least a while or else we'll have to reconsider having US Politics discussions in the OT.


Let's stay on target folks.

...

So... in a weird 6:30am vote, the Senate pushed a cloture vote for DeVos' nomination... final vote is Monday.


Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

The House repeal of the Social Security gun restrictions just makes we wonder if the GOP is trying to get Democrats elected in 2018.

The White House now is pushing back, ever so slightly, against settlement building by Israel. That's an interesting development coming from this administration, but who knows what their reasoning actually is.
   
Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker




Texas

 whembly wrote:


So... in a weird 6:30am vote, the Senate pushed a cloture vote for DeVos' nomination... final vote is Monday.



Was anyone really expecting any of Trump's inital slate of cabinet nominees to not be confirmed?

On another tangent......Iran and missles. Good or bad? What, if anything, should the US do about it?

https://twitter.com/JZarif/status/827483992630902784?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw


"Preach the gospel always, If necessary use words." ~ St. Francis of Assisi 
   
Made in us
Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard




Catskills in NYS

Kellyanne Conway blames refugees for 'Bowling Green massacre' that never happened

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/03/kellyanne-conway-refugees-bowling-green-massacre-never-happened

This is honestly hilarious.

Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
 kronk wrote:
Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
 sebster wrote:
Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
 BaronIveagh wrote:
Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

 d-usa wrote:
The House repeal of the Social Security gun restrictions just makes we wonder if the GOP is trying to get Democrats elected in 2018.

The White House now is pushing back, ever so slightly, against settlement building by Israel. That's an interesting development coming from this administration, but who knows what their reasoning actually is.


The admin also chided Russia on Ukraine and threatened sanctions against Iran for its ballistic missile test.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/02/world/middleeast/iran-missile-test-trump.html

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/03 15:04:11


-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot




On moon miranda.

 whembly wrote:
As a reminder:
 motyak wrote:
Feel free to start a new thread, this one is going to remain locked. There is too much rude behaviour to think that it can remotely pick up on the right side of dakka dakka's rules.

When creating a new thread, keep in mind my above post. In this new thread we're not discussing the Nazi punch. At all. You had a chance to discuss it and you have blown it. Make sure the new thread has a sensible title so we don't have to edit it first thing again, and try and keep the thread sensible for at least a while or else we'll have to reconsider having US Politics discussions in the OT.


Let's stay on target folks.

...

So... in a weird 6:30am vote, the Senate pushed a cloture vote for DeVos' nomination... final vote is Monday.


The fact the DeVos is going to actually receive a single vote, much less almost certainly sure to be confirmed, says a lot about the sad state of affairs of US politics. She flailed like a fish out of water on live TV, showing a complete inability to answer questions critical to the role of the Department of Education, and family ties to Erik Prince, should concern everyone from all walks of life.

It's one thing if she just had a different plan for the DoE than the previous administration, but this nominee looks to be actively hostile to the organization she's being nominated to lead and completely uninformed on critical roles of the department.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Kellyanne Conway blames refugees for 'Bowling Green massacre' that never happened

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/03/kellyanne-conway-refugees-bowling-green-massacre-never-happened

This is honestly hilarious.
Was just about to post something on this.

The level of either dishonesty, rank ignorance, or both, from the spokespeople of this administration is, well, it would be amusing if it wasn't so 1984-esque.

IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.

New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.  
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

In "oh look, more potential conflict of interest" news, Donald Trump as POTUS went on a rant about The Apprentice ratings during the Prayer Breakfast, talking about the show and telling people to "pray for ratings". Arnold responded on Twitter and Apprentice is back int he news.

Of course Trump is still the Executive Producer of the show, and Trump the Executive Producer will gain if The Apprentice is in the news because Trump the POTUS talks about the show he is also producing during an official appearance..


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Vaktathi wrote:

It's one thing if she just had a different plan for the DoE than the previous administration, but this nominee looks to be actively hostile to the organization she's being nominated to lead and completely uninformed on critical roles of the department.


Nominees who are hostile to the departments they are heading seems to be the theme for quite a few of the picks this time around.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/03 15:13:37


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






CNN spreading some more fake news re: Obama's gun control measures that received the axe.

http://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2017/02/02/so-misleading-gun-control-crowd-triggered-by-headlines-about-house-rolling-back-background-checks/

Long story short: They are claiming that the GOP and NRA shot down a gun control measure aimed at keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. In reality, the provision that was axed deals with veterans and social security beneficiaries who have their finances managed by another party.

Tier 1 is the new Tactical.

My IDF-Themed Guard Army P&M Blog:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/30/355940.page 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

 NuggzTheNinja wrote:
CNN spreading some more fake news re: Obama's gun control measures that received the axe.

http://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2017/02/02/so-misleading-gun-control-crowd-triggered-by-headlines-about-house-rolling-back-background-checks/

Long story short: They are claiming that the GOP and NRA shot down a gun control measure aimed at keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. In reality, the provision that was axed deals with veterans and social security beneficiaries who have their finances managed by another party.

Exactly.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






New Orleans, LA

 Lord of Deeds wrote:


Was anyone really expecting any of Trump's inital slate of cabinet nominees to not be confirmed?



Not really.

It's actually rare for a cabinet member to not get confirmed. Most people figure, either way, "If that's the donkey-cave he wants running that department, then this gak is on him. Next!"

But first, make him/her give a televised/recorded testimony of the bull gak they believe. For posterity.


Since 1834, it's happened 9 times. [Insert Ferris Buhler's Principal saying "9 times"]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/history-shows-the-senate-rarely-rejects-cabinet-picks/article/2609702

DA:70S+G+M+B++I++Pw40k08+D++A++/fWD-R+T(M)DM+
 
   
Made in us
Thane of Dol Guldur




 NuggzTheNinja wrote:
CNN spreading some more fake news re: Obama's gun control measures that received the axe.

http://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2017/02/02/so-misleading-gun-control-crowd-triggered-by-headlines-about-house-rolling-back-background-checks/

Long story short: They are claiming that the GOP and NRA shot down a gun control measure aimed at keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. In reality, the provision that was axed deals with veterans and social security beneficiaries who have their finances managed by another party.


Perhaps we can all agree...CNN has become pure clickbait.

All they need is some reporters on the sideboob beat, and they'll become the spitting image of the Huffington Post.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/03 15:27:45


 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 d-usa wrote:
The House repeal of the Social Security gun restrictions just makes we wonder if the GOP is trying to get Democrats elected in 2018.

Nope... gun control is a losing issue for Democrats.

Furthermore, that Obama EO?

It simply allows bureaucrats to deny Constitutional rights based on a 'list' without due process... 'tis why not only NRA is against, but the ACLU, mental health charities and psychiatrists opposed it as well.


The White House now is pushing back, ever so slightly, against settlement building by Israel. That's an interesting development coming from this administration, but who knows what their reasoning actually is.

Heh... notice how they say "stop announcing" the settlements... and not, "stop building" the settlements.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Kellyanne Conway blames refugees for 'Bowling Green massacre' that never happened

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/03/kellyanne-conway-refugees-bowling-green-massacre-never-happened

This is honestly hilarious.

Okay... that's funny...

She obviously got Chattanooga (where lone wolf muslim shot up Military recruitment center) to Bowling Green (where 2 person were charged in a foiled planned attack).


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Frazzled wrote:
 d-usa wrote:
The House repeal of the Social Security gun restrictions just makes we wonder if the GOP is trying to get Democrats elected in 2018.

The White House now is pushing back, ever so slightly, against settlement building by Israel. That's an interesting development coming from this administration, but who knows what their reasoning actually is.


The admin also chided Russia on Ukraine and threatened sanctions against Iran for its ballistic missile test.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/02/world/middleeast/iran-missile-test-trump.html

Good for Nikki Haley!

me likey her...

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2017/02/03 15:43:48


Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
Made in us
Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot




On moon miranda.

So Trump is going after Dodd-Frank

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-38858009

"Mr Trump will also sign a presidential memorandum instructing the Labor Department to delay bringing in an Obama-era rule requiring financial professionals to put their clients' interests first when giving advice on retirement investments."

Hrm...

IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.

New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.  
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 d-usa wrote:
In "oh look, more potential conflict of interest" news, Donald Trump as POTUS went on a rant about The Apprentice ratings during the Prayer Breakfast, talking about the show and telling people to "pray for ratings". Arnold responded on Twitter and Apprentice is back int he news.

Of course Trump is still the Executive Producer of the show, and Trump the Executive Producer will gain if The Apprentice is in the news because Trump the POTUS talks about the show he is also producing during an official appearance..

Not sure this qualifies as 'conflict of interests'... ????

But for sure, this is getting tiring...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Vaktathi wrote:

It's one thing if she just had a different plan for the DoE than the previous administration, but this nominee looks to be actively hostile to the organization she's being nominated to lead and completely uninformed on critical roles of the department.


Nominees who are hostile to the departments they are heading seems to be the theme for quite a few of the picks this time around.

For good reasons... I *want* the department peeps to work hard at justifying what they do and justify the tax dollars.

Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
Made in us
Thane of Dol Guldur




I agree with whembley, gun control is a loser for Democrats. People who really want gun control shouldn't back down from itheir convictions, I suppose, but the Democrats need to make sure their tent is big enough for proponents and opponents if they want to broaden their support.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/03 15:43:03


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

 Frazzled wrote:
 NuggzTheNinja wrote:
CNN spreading some more fake news re: Obama's gun control measures that received the axe.

http://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2017/02/02/so-misleading-gun-control-crowd-triggered-by-headlines-about-house-rolling-back-background-checks/

Long story short: They are claiming that the GOP and NRA shot down a gun control measure aimed at keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. In reality, the provision that was axed deals with veterans and social security beneficiaries who have their finances managed by another party.

Exactly.


Wrong.

But feth it, not going to bother with it.
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 Vaktathi wrote:
So Trump is going after Dodd-Frank

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-38858009

"Mr Trump will also sign a presidential memorandum instructing the Labor Department to delay bringing in an Obama-era rule requiring financial professionals to put their clients' interests first when giving advice on retirement investments."

Hrm...

Dodd-Frank is a mess that further perpetuates the incestuous relationship between Wallstreet and Washingon...

However, breaking up Dodd-Frank is just as messy... this is truly one of those things that it's going to be fugly no matter which way it goes...

Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
Made in us
Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot




On moon miranda.

On the Guns note, Guns are losing for Democrats like Abortion is losing for Republicans, we see the same tactics, false rhetoric, and absurd laws from both sides on both issues in much the same ways, usually to rile up the base, but that ultimately harms them in general elections.

 whembly wrote:
 d-usa wrote:
In "oh look, more potential conflict of interest" news, Donald Trump as POTUS went on a rant about The Apprentice ratings during the Prayer Breakfast, talking about the show and telling people to "pray for ratings". Arnold responded on Twitter and Apprentice is back int he news.

Of course Trump is still the Executive Producer of the show, and Trump the Executive Producer will gain if The Apprentice is in the news because Trump the POTUS talks about the show he is also producing during an official appearance..

Not sure this qualifies as 'conflict of interests'... ????

But for sure, this is getting tiring...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Vaktathi wrote:

It's one thing if she just had a different plan for the DoE than the previous administration, but this nominee looks to be actively hostile to the organization she's being nominated to lead and completely uninformed on critical roles of the department.


Nominees who are hostile to the departments they are heading seems to be the theme for quite a few of the picks this time around.

For good reasons... I *want* the department peeps to work hard at justifying what they do and justify the tax dollars.
There's a difference between " justifying what they do and justify the tax dollars" and being actively hostile or completely clueless to the fundamental role and/or existence of the department, as with DeVos. One would hope anyone appointed to head these departments would work hard at justifying what they do and seeing their resources used effectively, that's like role #1 of an effective leader, being actively hostile to such things usually leads to the exact opposite.

 whembly wrote:
 Vaktathi wrote:
So Trump is going after Dodd-Frank

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-38858009

"Mr Trump will also sign a presidential memorandum instructing the Labor Department to delay bringing in an Obama-era rule requiring financial professionals to put their clients' interests first when giving advice on retirement investments."

Hrm...

Dodd-Frank is a mess that further perpetuates the incestuous relationship between Wallstreet and Washingon...

However, breaking up Dodd-Frank is just as messy... this is truly one of those things that it's going to be fugly no matter which way it goes...
While true, there are lots of good parts, particularly for the great mass of small investors/consumers, and that's what looks to be threatened.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/03 15:48:28


IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.

New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.  
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

 whembly wrote:


She obviously got Chattanooga (where lone wolf muslim shot up Military recruitment center) to Bowling Green (where 2 person were charged in a foiled planned attack).


By a naturalized US citizen, born in Kuwait, to Palestinian-Jordanian parents, who had strong pro-Palestine leanings, and which doesn't have anything to do with the 7 countries that the "massacre" was supposed to be associated with?
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 d-usa wrote:
 Frazzled wrote:
 NuggzTheNinja wrote:
CNN spreading some more fake news re: Obama's gun control measures that received the axe.

http://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2017/02/02/so-misleading-gun-control-crowd-triggered-by-headlines-about-house-rolling-back-background-checks/

Long story short: They are claiming that the GOP and NRA shot down a gun control measure aimed at keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. In reality, the provision that was axed deals with veterans and social security beneficiaries who have their finances managed by another party.

Exactly.


Wrong.

But feth it, not going to bother with it.

It's a clumsy statist way to fix a problem that ignores due process.

Don't get me wrong, the law needs a fethton of work to empower family/mental health officials to go in front of a judge to remove certain rights from the mentally ill...


Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree with whembley, gun control is a loser for Democrats. People who really want gun control shouldn't back down from itheir convictions, I suppose, but the Democrats need to make sure their tent is big enough for proponents and opponents if they want to broaden their support.


The people on this board, in the House, in the Senate, and in the USA keep on saying "guns aren't the issue, mental health is the issue".

Now it turns out that mental health is also not the issue, because being unable to keep a job due to your mental illness and being unable to manage your own finances due to your mental illness doesn't mean that you are unable to own a firearm because "it doesn't mean that you are violent".

   
Made in gb
Assassin with Black Lotus Poison





Bristol

 whembly wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Kellyanne Conway blames refugees for 'Bowling Green massacre' that never happened

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/03/kellyanne-conway-refugees-bowling-green-massacre-never-happened

This is honestly hilarious.

Okay... that's funny...

She obviously got Chattanooga (where lone wolf muslim shot up Military recruitment center) to Bowling Green (where 2 person were charged in a foiled planned attack).


Wrong. The two people from Bowling Green were arrested for attempting to send money and weapons to Al-Qaeda. They were not planning an attack on US soil.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/03/kellyanne-conway-refugees-bowling-green-massacre-never-happened

The US department of justice, announcing their convictions in 2012, said: “Neither was charged with plotting attacks within the United States.”

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/03 15:55:20


The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.

Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree with whembley, gun control is a loser for Democrats. People who really want gun control shouldn't back down from itheir convictions, I suppose, but the Democrats need to make sure their tent is big enough for proponents and opponents if they want to broaden their support.


There is no room in the Democratic Party for pro gunners, just as there is no room for antigunners in the Republican Party. Its like one of the few material things that are different between them now that Big Gov Trump is head of the Republican Party.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

 whembly wrote:
 d-usa wrote:
 Frazzled wrote:
 NuggzTheNinja wrote:
CNN spreading some more fake news re: Obama's gun control measures that received the axe.

http://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2017/02/02/so-misleading-gun-control-crowd-triggered-by-headlines-about-house-rolling-back-background-checks/

Long story short: They are claiming that the GOP and NRA shot down a gun control measure aimed at keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. In reality, the provision that was axed deals with veterans and social security beneficiaries who have their finances managed by another party.

Exactly.


Wrong.

But feth it, not going to bother with it.

It's a clumsy statist way to fix a problem that ignores due process.

Don't get me wrong, the law needs a fethton of work to empower family/mental health officials to go in front of a judge to remove certain rights from the mentally ill...



It takes a lot of "due process" to get on disability. And it has to be one of these mental health issues to qualify:

- Affective disorders
- Anxiety Disorders
- Autism and related disorders
- Mental retardation
- Organic Mental Disorders
- Personality disorders
- Schizophrenia, paranoia, and psychotic disorders
- Somatoform disorders
- Substance addiction

And it's not just "I have some anxiety, so I get a free government paycheck", it's "I have such severe anxiety that I cannot function enough in society to go out and maintain gainful employment" and "I have such severe anxiety that I cannot function enough to manage my own finances".

But eat up the NRA propaganda. They long ago stopped caring about the people on either end of the gun, they only care about keeping the gun manufacturers busy. And more customers = more business.
   
Made in us
Thane of Dol Guldur




 Frazzled wrote:
 jasper76 wrote:
I agree with whembley, gun control is a loser for Democrats. People who really want gun control shouldn't back down from itheir convictions, I suppose, but the Democrats need to make sure their tent is big enough for proponents and opponents if they want to broaden their support.


There is no room in the Democratic Party for pro gunners, just as there is no room for antigunners in the Republican Party. Its like one of the few material things that are different between them now that Big Gov Trump is head of the Republican Party.


That's a real shame. Democrats will have great difficulty with rural voters so long as gun control is some kind of a litmus test.

   
Made in us
Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot




On moon miranda.

The issue with guns is that, fundamentally, they are a civil right, an individual one, affirmed by the supreme court and incorporated to the states. Putting tests and restrictions on guns therefore runs into many of the same issues that putting restrictions on speech or self incrimination does, and attempting to undercut that leaves those other rights open to attack in much the same way.

IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.

New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.  
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 d-usa wrote:
 jasper76 wrote:
I agree with whembley, gun control is a loser for Democrats. People who really want gun control shouldn't back down from itheir convictions, I suppose, but the Democrats need to make sure their tent is big enough for proponents and opponents if they want to broaden their support.


The people on this board, in the House, in the Senate, and in the USA keep on saying "guns aren't the issue, mental health is the issue".

Now it turns out that mental health is also not the issue, because being unable to keep a job due to your mental illness and being unable to manage your own finances due to your mental illness doesn't mean that you are unable to own a firearm because "it doesn't mean that you are violent".


A few things dude.

A) this list isn't just those who are 'mentally unstable'... it also includes people whom are bulimic, handicapped, physical disabilties, etc...

B) mental health officials oppose this move as it's adding the stigma preventing people to voluntarily get help.

C) ACLU opposes this because... it's a list.

You don't summarily remove someone's Constitutional right... that person still deserves due process.

To take away someone's right, it should be adjudicated in front of a judge.

Not taken away first, then the person has to 'fight' for it in court to get it back. Due Process First. Not Last.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 A Town Called Malus wrote:
 whembly wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Kellyanne Conway blames refugees for 'Bowling Green massacre' that never happened

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/03/kellyanne-conway-refugees-bowling-green-massacre-never-happened

This is honestly hilarious.

Okay... that's funny...

She obviously got Chattanooga (where lone wolf muslim shot up Military recruitment center) to Bowling Green (where 2 person were charged in a foiled planned attack).


Wrong. The two people from Bowling Green were arrested for attempting to send money and weapons to Al-Qaeda. They were not planning an attack on US soil.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/03/kellyanne-conway-refugees-bowling-green-massacre-never-happened

The US department of justice, announcing their convictions in 2012, said: “Neither was charged with plotting attacks within the United States.”

Er... my mistake, I thought that there *were* planning something in the states.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/02/03 16:10:35


Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
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http://khon2.com/2017/02/01/house-minority-leader-fukumoto-wants-to-leave-the-republican-party/

Spoiler:
A Hawaii lawmaker says she’s been bullied and attacked by her own party.

Now Rep. Beth Fukumoto says she’s thinking of leaving the Republicans and joining the Democratic Party.

Fukumoto, who represents District 36 (Mililani, Mililani Mauka, Waipio Acres), was first elected in 2012. She sent a letter to her constituents informing them of her desire to leave the party and asked for their input.

“The Republican Party is getting increasingly hostile to different opinions. If you followed what happened at the state convention (in May 2016), I got booed for about 10 minutes straight for raising concerns about President Trump, then nominee Trump, and the way he treated women and minorities in many of his remarks. I, at the time, had said this is not, this should not reflect our party,” she told KHON2.

“I repeated those sentiments at the women’s march last week, and since then, there have been many calls for my resignation, and my caucus members have raised concerns about whether or not that means I’m a Republican, whether or not that means I’m fit for leadership, whether or not that means I should even be an elected official. My caucus has asked me to stop speaking out about Trump and to make a commitment. They’ve said they’ll keep me as minority leader if I make a commitment not to speak out against Trump for the remainder of his term.

“I don’t think that’s our job as elected officials, even more so, I don’t think that’s our job as citizens,” Fukumoto said.

It’s a decision that cost Fukumoto her role as House minority leader Wednesday. She was replaced by Rep. Andria Tupola, R, Ewa Villages, Kalaeloa, Honokai Hale, Nanakai Gardens, Ko Olina, Kahe Point, Nanakuli, Lualualei, Maili. Rep. Gene Ward, R, Hawaii Kai, Kalama Valley, was named Minority Floor Leader.

The motion prompted an emotional debate on the House floor.

“Now she’s being punished by three-and-a-half of our members for participating in the democratic process,” said Rep. Cynthia Thielen, R, Kailua, Kaneohe Bay, before she was interrupted and a recess was called.

Thielen was also at the women’s march.

“Let me just tell you a couple of reasons we were marching and speaking at the women’s march, and I believe the majority leader does this once a year,” Thielen said.

“This has nothing to do with the women’s march. This is a motion on leadership. I don’t see women’s march anywhere in here (on the agenda), and I don’t want to waste my time listening to this,” said Rep. Bob McDermott, R, Ewa, Ewa Beach, Ewa Gentry, Iroquois Point.

“I’m going to allow that because she, Rep. Thielen, relates her speech to the merits of the resolution, so I will allow it,” said Vice Speaker John Mizuno, D, Kalihi Valley, Kamehameha Heights, Lower Kalihi.

“Despite what was said earlier, she’s not being punished for speaking out for women’s rights. It’s a pattern of self-loathing comments directed at Republicans,” McDermott said.

“I appreciate his comments. It’s all about the women’s march. It’s all about Rep. Fukumoto standing up for women and human rights,” Thielen said.

Fritz Rohlfing, chair of the Hawaii Republican Party, says if Fukumoto does become a Democrat, she should let Gov. Ige fill her seat.

“I’m hopeful that she will remain in the party, I’m urging her to remain and stay,” he said, however, “if somebody wants to switch parties soon after an election, it’s really, I think, a matter of integrity and she should just resign.

“The caucus has a right to determine who its leaders are, and rights to make a decision to switch leaders, including facts on public statements and how they feel about their leader,” he added.

While Fukumoto has not officially made a decision to switch parties, she told KHON2 she does not intend on resigning from office.

“At this point, until I hear from my constituents, I don’t want to make any speculation as I’ve committed to them. It’s about them and what they want, so I want to make sure I hear from them before I start speculating or even digging into what staying will look like,” she said.

“What I’m hoping my constituents and I can have a dialogue about, what’s been happening is that my party’s getting increasingly insistent that I stop working across party lines, and that I start becoming more partisan in my approach,” Fukumoto explained to KHON2. “They would prefer me to be a representative of the Republican Party in Hawaii, and I’m a representative of Mililani. If those things are mutually exclusive, then I’m going to choose Mililani.”

Fukumoto was the youngest person to ever serve as the House minority leader in Hawaii, and the youngest woman to hold a caucus leader position in the United States.

Prior to our conversation, Fukumoto issued the following statement:

In the last couple years, I’ve watched leaders in the Republican Party become less and less tolerant of diverse opinions and dissenting voices. I am under constant scrutiny for working across the aisle to pass common sense legislation that will benefit my district and the people of Hawaii. Today, I’m facing demands for my resignation from leadership and possible censure because I raised concerns about our President’s treatment of women and minorities. I’ve been asked by both my party and my caucus to commit to not criticizing the President for the remainder of his term and to take a more partisan approach to working in the Legislature. That is not a commitment I can make. As a representative of my community, it is my job to hold leaders accountable and to work with anyone, regardless of party, to make Hawaii a better place for our families.

This morning, I sent a letter to my district explaining that I would like to leave the Republican Party and seek membership in the Democratic Party. When I was re-elected in November, I was elected as a Republican, and I want to honor my community’s choice by consulting them before any decision is made. As I articulated in my letter, I encourage my constituents to contact me with input and provide feedback. I was elected by the people of Mililani, and I am here to represent them.
Women’s March on Washington – Hawaii released the following statement:

The Women’s March is a movement founded for women and everyone that supports them, no matter their religious beliefs, race, ethnicity, gender identity, sexual orientation, ability or party affiliation. As Americans we have the right to come together, march and demand equal treatment under the law. That is why we here at the Women’s March Hawai‘i are so dismayed that the Republican members of the Hawai‘i State House would choose to punish Representative Beth Fukumoto Chang for participating in the Women’s March on O‘ahu on January 21, 2017.

Their decision to remove Rep. Fukumoto as House Minority Leader just for showing up and speaking hopefully about the future of our country is un-American in our view and a slap in the face for the women of Hawai‘i.

Since its inception the Women’s March has been and continues to be a non-partisan Movement because we believe that women’s rights are not be a party issue; they are a human rights issue. We were grateful for Beth having the courage to be a part of the march, to speak her mind so eloquently, on the future of this country and this planet. From all of us here at Women’s March Hawai‘i we are proud to say “Mahalo nui loa” to Rep. Fukumoto for standing with her fellow citizens and for being part of this global movement.


This seems to be the new norm. Better ride that party line!
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

 Vaktathi wrote:
The issue with guns is that, fundamentally, they are a civil right, an individual one, affirmed by the supreme court and incorporated to the states. Putting tests and restrictions on guns therefore runs into many of the same issues that putting restrictions on speech or self incrimination does, and attempting to undercut that leaves those other rights open to attack in much the same way.


Then we, as a society, need to take a stand together after the next school shooting and say "we are sorry these kids are dead, but we accept that as a consequence of our right to own firearms, the needs of the many outweigh the lives of the few, and an armed society will have dead children from time to time."

The reality is that this is a very true statement, we are okay with that, we accept that terrorists can legally get guns and shoot up a holiday party, we accept that terrorists can legally get guns and shoot up a gay nightclub, and we accept that someone with a legally owned firearm can shoot up a grade school. As a society, we bitch and moan when it happens and talk about "we need to do something about guns" and 'we need to do something to keep mentally ill people from owning guns" and "we need to do something about mental illness". But the truth is, we are okay with the risk of all of these things happening because that is just the reality of living in a society where the 2nd Amendment exists.

Just like we are sad when a friend or family member dies in a car accident and we accept the risk and are okay with the fact that it can happen anytime they are inside of a vehicle, we need to accept the risk and are okay with the fact that anybody can kill a friend or family member in an attack involving weapons.

I'm just sick and tired of politicians now having the guts to speak what they are actually thinking, to acknowledge what the country as a whole is thinking.

Edit: Making this my last post on this subject, because it's pissing me off.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/03 16:14:23


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Secret Squirrel






Leerstetten, Germany

 Dreadwinter wrote:
http://khon2.com/2017/02/01/house-minority-leader-fukumoto-wants-to-leave-the-republican-party/

Spoiler:
A Hawaii lawmaker says she’s been bullied and attacked by her own party.

Now Rep. Beth Fukumoto says she’s thinking of leaving the Republicans and joining the Democratic Party.

Fukumoto, who represents District 36 (Mililani, Mililani Mauka, Waipio Acres), was first elected in 2012. She sent a letter to her constituents informing them of her desire to leave the party and asked for their input.

“The Republican Party is getting increasingly hostile to different opinions. If you followed what happened at the state convention (in May 2016), I got booed for about 10 minutes straight for raising concerns about President Trump, then nominee Trump, and the way he treated women and minorities in many of his remarks. I, at the time, had said this is not, this should not reflect our party,” she told KHON2.

“I repeated those sentiments at the women’s march last week, and since then, there have been many calls for my resignation, and my caucus members have raised concerns about whether or not that means I’m a Republican, whether or not that means I’m fit for leadership, whether or not that means I should even be an elected official. My caucus has asked me to stop speaking out about Trump and to make a commitment. They’ve said they’ll keep me as minority leader if I make a commitment not to speak out against Trump for the remainder of his term.

“I don’t think that’s our job as elected officials, even more so, I don’t think that’s our job as citizens,” Fukumoto said.

It’s a decision that cost Fukumoto her role as House minority leader Wednesday. She was replaced by Rep. Andria Tupola, R, Ewa Villages, Kalaeloa, Honokai Hale, Nanakai Gardens, Ko Olina, Kahe Point, Nanakuli, Lualualei, Maili. Rep. Gene Ward, R, Hawaii Kai, Kalama Valley, was named Minority Floor Leader.

The motion prompted an emotional debate on the House floor.

“Now she’s being punished by three-and-a-half of our members for participating in the democratic process,” said Rep. Cynthia Thielen, R, Kailua, Kaneohe Bay, before she was interrupted and a recess was called.

Thielen was also at the women’s march.

“Let me just tell you a couple of reasons we were marching and speaking at the women’s march, and I believe the majority leader does this once a year,” Thielen said.

“This has nothing to do with the women’s march. This is a motion on leadership. I don’t see women’s march anywhere in here (on the agenda), and I don’t want to waste my time listening to this,” said Rep. Bob McDermott, R, Ewa, Ewa Beach, Ewa Gentry, Iroquois Point.

“I’m going to allow that because she, Rep. Thielen, relates her speech to the merits of the resolution, so I will allow it,” said Vice Speaker John Mizuno, D, Kalihi Valley, Kamehameha Heights, Lower Kalihi.

“Despite what was said earlier, she’s not being punished for speaking out for women’s rights. It’s a pattern of self-loathing comments directed at Republicans,” McDermott said.

“I appreciate his comments. It’s all about the women’s march. It’s all about Rep. Fukumoto standing up for women and human rights,” Thielen said.

Fritz Rohlfing, chair of the Hawaii Republican Party, says if Fukumoto does become a Democrat, she should let Gov. Ige fill her seat.

“I’m hopeful that she will remain in the party, I’m urging her to remain and stay,” he said, however, “if somebody wants to switch parties soon after an election, it’s really, I think, a matter of integrity and she should just resign.

“The caucus has a right to determine who its leaders are, and rights to make a decision to switch leaders, including facts on public statements and how they feel about their leader,” he added.

While Fukumoto has not officially made a decision to switch parties, she told KHON2 she does not intend on resigning from office.

“At this point, until I hear from my constituents, I don’t want to make any speculation as I’ve committed to them. It’s about them and what they want, so I want to make sure I hear from them before I start speculating or even digging into what staying will look like,” she said.

“What I’m hoping my constituents and I can have a dialogue about, what’s been happening is that my party’s getting increasingly insistent that I stop working across party lines, and that I start becoming more partisan in my approach,” Fukumoto explained to KHON2. “They would prefer me to be a representative of the Republican Party in Hawaii, and I’m a representative of Mililani. If those things are mutually exclusive, then I’m going to choose Mililani.”

Fukumoto was the youngest person to ever serve as the House minority leader in Hawaii, and the youngest woman to hold a caucus leader position in the United States.

Prior to our conversation, Fukumoto issued the following statement:

In the last couple years, I’ve watched leaders in the Republican Party become less and less tolerant of diverse opinions and dissenting voices. I am under constant scrutiny for working across the aisle to pass common sense legislation that will benefit my district and the people of Hawaii. Today, I’m facing demands for my resignation from leadership and possible censure because I raised concerns about our President’s treatment of women and minorities. I’ve been asked by both my party and my caucus to commit to not criticizing the President for the remainder of his term and to take a more partisan approach to working in the Legislature. That is not a commitment I can make. As a representative of my community, it is my job to hold leaders accountable and to work with anyone, regardless of party, to make Hawaii a better place for our families.

This morning, I sent a letter to my district explaining that I would like to leave the Republican Party and seek membership in the Democratic Party. When I was re-elected in November, I was elected as a Republican, and I want to honor my community’s choice by consulting them before any decision is made. As I articulated in my letter, I encourage my constituents to contact me with input and provide feedback. I was elected by the people of Mililani, and I am here to represent them.
Women’s March on Washington – Hawaii released the following statement:

The Women’s March is a movement founded for women and everyone that supports them, no matter their religious beliefs, race, ethnicity, gender identity, sexual orientation, ability or party affiliation. As Americans we have the right to come together, march and demand equal treatment under the law. That is why we here at the Women’s March Hawai‘i are so dismayed that the Republican members of the Hawai‘i State House would choose to punish Representative Beth Fukumoto Chang for participating in the Women’s March on O‘ahu on January 21, 2017.

Their decision to remove Rep. Fukumoto as House Minority Leader just for showing up and speaking hopefully about the future of our country is un-American in our view and a slap in the face for the women of Hawai‘i.

Since its inception the Women’s March has been and continues to be a non-partisan Movement because we believe that women’s rights are not be a party issue; they are a human rights issue. We were grateful for Beth having the courage to be a part of the march, to speak her mind so eloquently, on the future of this country and this planet. From all of us here at Women’s March Hawai‘i we are proud to say “Mahalo nui loa” to Rep. Fukumoto for standing with her fellow citizens and for being part of this global movement.


This seems to be the new norm. Better ride that party line!


That's why I think we should just ditch the whole "representative democracy" thing and switch to a system of awarding party seats by percentage of total vote rather than by "person wins a district". More and more it doesn't matter what the district wants, it doesn't even matter what the representative wants. It's all about what the party wants. The very existence of majority and minority whips goes against the principle of representing your districts or your state.
   
 
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