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I was very sad that 'The Fall of Cadia' held no IG updates...

So what is next? When will they do something/anything with the backbone of the imperium?!?

Are they waiting so long because they are doing a complete revamp of the line?

What will happen to the IG in a storyline that is now moving forward?

A Leman russ variant with twin-linked heavy grav cannon, and new catachan devil unit with stealth and rending, that can charge after infiltrating.

Also Creed will become a monstrous creature.

more discontinued models ; )

GW may consider that they updated Guard - especially Cadian Guard in the Damocles Gulf campaign books.

They gave various formations and the like just not especially good ones.

Still they are better then the one the Sisters got in C:IA.

Sonic Keyboard wrote:
A Leman russ variant with twin-linked heavy grav cannon, and new catachan devil unit with stealth and rending, that can charge after infiltrating.

Also Creed will become a monstrous creature.

It should say something that I can half beleive that GW would do this.

Cadian built Flak armour is now a scarce and holy artefact for tech priest to recite over!

Commander of planetary force X, 'Listen up! the Bastion of Cadia has been annihilated in the justice and Holy campaign to victoriously defeat Heresy in the name of the Immortal Emperor. By his guiding hand our order of Lasguns and armour survived the planets destruction and is bound within a few weeks. Wear these relics with pride for each of you will be unstoppable with your Holy lasguns! Even as we speak the forces of Chaos are in full retreat! Although the loss of Cadian Manufactorums is a terrible blow, the Cadian pattern is still vigorously produced on other worlds. We will stand out as an unstoppable bastion of defence with Cadias last pure devices. I ask you men, are we not invincible?' *Massive crowd roars and cheers*

Maybe a line of cadians that don't resemble spaceballs?

What we want:
>A points deduction on all Troops choices
>Lasguns become worth a damn (longer range would help)
>Cheaper special and heavy weapons
>Side armour 11 for the Chimera, along with a points reduction
>Vox casters give unlimited order range
>Standards are actually useful
>Relics are not overpriced garbage
>Most HQ units have a 20% points reduction
>Orders become more versatile
>Priests regain access to the Evisicrator
>Storm Troopers get a 20% points reduction
>Hellguns become S4 AP3 Assault 3
>Volleyguns become S5 AP3 Assault 6
>Ogryns are dropped to 20 PPM, gain rending and a 4+ armour save. Oh, and FNP
>Bullgryns drop to 28-30 PPM and gain a 3+ save, FNP and modular loadout options
>Ratlings become somewhat useful
>Sentinels have a 5-10 point reduction in cost
>Hellhound chassis drop in price by 50%
>GW listens to the communities ideas and advice about what to do with Rough Riders... Or just squats them
>Leman Russ chassis drop in price by between 15% to 30%, chassis dependent
>Leman Russ chassis become 4HP models and regain Lumbering Behemoth
>All vehicles gain the ability to become veterans (+1 BS) for 10 points
>The Manticore and Basilisk come down in price by about 20%
>The Deathstrike becomes SD with a +2 on the table
>Griffons, Bombards and Medusas return
>The Vanquisher becomes an actual tank killer
>No more Gets Hot on the Executioner
>Hydras become good against ground targets again and drop in price
>Baneblade chassis become part of the army
>Malcador and Machirus tanks become part of the army and can be used in the place of Baneblades in formations
>Formations that are actually worth a damn and do cripple your wallet and army to bring
>New models that actually look decent

What we will probably get though will be:
>A 10% to 20% pints increase across the board (because Guard still occasionally beat Marines)
>Leman Russ tanks become AV 13/12/10 (because Marine tanks do not have good armour so why should Guard)
>Battlecannons become S7 and Earthshakers S8, and both become AP4 (because Marines should not be vulnerable to heavy ordnance at all, even when caught in the open)
>Lasguns become S2 (after all, Hellguns are S3)
>A new, poorly named, shoddily designed and completely useless model that we didnt ask for

@Master of ordinance

Well that's call being salty...

More seriously, I think that guardsmen will change flagship. With the official destruction of Cadia, the age and underwhelming esthetic of the models it's possible we will see Vostroyan or Catashan become the new standard guard model. As for new stuff, Guards will probably get a new "Macro-formation" build, probably see the return of a few basilisk variant and the Rough Riders go the way of the Dodos. No, guardsmen will not become a powerhouse. Ogryn will still be problematic, while not bad, ratling will be situational due to the poor effectveness of snipers and Scions will be underwhelming or overcost. Tanks will be decent and artillery pretty good.

As the scale of the combatants becomes ever larger with the inclusion of primarchs and deamon primarchs, the imperial guard will start to feel even weaker than they have before. Not to mention the fact that the IG at cadia were the ones that traditionally holding chaos back and have failed in that task. The guard seem increasingly irrelevant.

 Sledgehammer wrote:
As the scale of the combatants becomes ever larger with the inclusion of primarchs and deamon primarchs, the imperial guard will start to feel even weaker than they have before. Not to mention the fact that the IG at cadia were the ones that traditionally holding chaos back and have failed in that task. The guard seem increasingly irrelevant.

It's indeed a problem with a setting that becomes more and more "mythical" in its scope. The little people fall behind rather quickly. It's entirely possible for the Guards to remain relevent and interesting in such a setting. You only need to focus on one thing: strength of character. The Imperial Guard cannot live up to Primarchs and the like in terms of sheer power, but it's entirely possible for a "normal human" to possess the genius and, more importantly, the will to become a leader of such a magnitude. They don't even need to be psykers, even if they could be one, the Guards could use a new Ollianus or Macharius. They almost already have one in the person of Yarrick. Maybe we will be given a new Lord Solar/Warmaster to lead the Imperial Guard in the future or maybe a ore humble and quirky hero like a Rogue Trader turned general inspired of people like Drake for example. They are growing increasingly irrelevant due to lack of attention, not lack of potential. Normal badass heroes have proven multiple time to just as popular than Mythical heroes.

CplPunishment wrote:
Maybe a line of cadians that don't resemble spaceballs?

omg... I want to start a guard army just to make spaceballs now.

 master of ordinance wrote:
What we want:
>A points deduction on all Troops choices
>Lasguns become worth a damn (longer range would help)
>Cheaper special and heavy weapons
>Side armour 11 for the Chimera, along with a points reduction
>Vox casters give unlimited order range
>Standards are actually useful
>Relics are not overpriced garbage
>Most HQ units have a 20% points reduction
>Orders become more versatile
>Priests regain access to the Evisicrator
>Storm Troopers get a 20% points reduction
>Hellguns become S4 AP3 Assault 3
>Volleyguns become S5 AP3 Assault 6
>Ogryns are dropped to 20 PPM, gain rending and a 4+ armour save. Oh, and FNP
>Bullgryns drop to 28-30 PPM and gain a 3+ save, FNP and modular loadout options
>Ratlings become somewhat useful
>Sentinels have a 5-10 point reduction in cost
>Hellhound chassis drop in price by 50%
>GW listens to the communities ideas and advice about what to do with Rough Riders... Or just squats them
>Leman Russ chassis drop in price by between 15% to 30%, chassis dependent
>Leman Russ chassis become 4HP models and regain Lumbering Behemoth
>All vehicles gain the ability to become veterans (+1 BS) for 10 points
>The Manticore and Basilisk come down in price by about 20%
>The Deathstrike becomes SD with a +2 on the table
>Griffons, Bombards and Medusas return
>The Vanquisher becomes an actual tank killer
>No more Gets Hot on the Executioner
>Hydras become good against ground targets again and drop in price
>Baneblade chassis become part of the army
>Malcador and Machirus tanks become part of the army and can be used in the place of Baneblades in formations
>Formations that are actually worth a damn and do cripple your wallet and army to bring
>New models that actually look decent

What we will probably get though will be:
>A 10% to 20% pints increase across the board (because Guard still occasionally beat Marines)
>Leman Russ tanks become AV 13/12/10 (because Marine tanks do not have good armour so why should Guard)
>Battlecannons become S7 and Earthshakers S8, and both become AP4 (because Marines should not be vulnerable to heavy ordnance at all, even when caught in the open)
>Lasguns become S2 (after all, Hellguns are S3)
>A new, poorly named, shoddily designed and completely useless model that we didnt ask for

Forgot being able to put Heavy Weapons, Special Weapons, Conscripts and such into Chimera's or Taurox's, the lack of giving them a dedicated transport bites the big one.

All I want for the IG is infantry that actually looks like humans instead of gorillas in uniform.

Astra Auxilium. Sick of summoning shenanigans? Does your Imperial faction require cheap expendable troops? Buy this supplement! Field as many as you can fit on the table - provided you buy enough models.

epronovost wrote:

 Sledgehammer wrote:
As the scale of the combatants becomes ever larger with the inclusion of primarchs and deamon primarchs, the imperial guard will start to feel even weaker than they have before. Not to mention the fact that the IG at cadia were the ones that traditionally holding chaos back and have failed in that task. The guard seem increasingly irrelevant.

It's indeed a problem with a setting that becomes more and more "mythical" in its scope. The little people fall behind rather quickly. It's entirely possible for the Guards to remain relevent and interesting in such a setting. You only need to focus on one thing: strength of character. The Imperial Guard cannot live up to Primarchs and the like in terms of sheer power, but it's entirely possible for a "normal human" to possess the genius and, more importantly, the will to become a leader of such a magnitude. They don't even need to be psykers, even if they could be one, the Guards could use a new Ollianus or Macharius. They almost already have one in the person of Yarrick. Maybe we will be given a new Lord Solar/Warmaster to lead the Imperial Guard in the future or maybe a ore humble and quirky hero like a Rogue Trader turned general inspired of people like Drake for example. They are growing increasingly irrelevant due to lack of attention, not lack of potential. Normal badass heroes have proven multiple time to just as popular than Mythical heroes.

Cain is your man - reluctant but effective

 master of ordinance wrote:
What we want:

I'd be on board with all of this. And revamped roughriders. Because I want to love them...

What we will probably get though will be:

...But I know this is what's going to happen...

Unfortunately I don't see the IG getting the attention it deserves, we are in the same boat as DE, Orks and Bugs in the fact that we are often overlooked or only given "Band Aid" style updates to try and keep us somewhat relevant. The wishlisting above has a lot of good things that are necessary however I would even settle for the following which sadly might be more reachable:

-IG Tanks get a variant that is effective in dealing with Monstrous Creatures (Beast Hunter Shells anyone?)
-IG Tanks get 4 HP base
-Points reduction across the board

 gmaleron wrote:
Unfortunately I don't see the IG getting the attention it deserves, we are in the same boat as DE, Orks and Bugs in the fact that we are often overlooked or only given "Band Aid" style updates to try and keep us somewhat relevant. The wishlisting above has a lot of good things that are necessary however I would even settle for the following which sadly might be more reachable:

-IG Tanks get a variant that is effective in dealing with Monstrous Creatures (Beast Hunter Shells anyone?)
-IG Tanks get 4 HP base
-Points reduction across the board

That would be nice.

I run BH shells already with my IA book (it REALLY throws people for a loop when I say its Instant Death. Kill Kharne and countless other big things with these lovely shells).
But I wish I could run them normally instead of a special tank (Commisar tank is usually how I run them).

 gmaleron wrote:
Unfortunately I don't see the IG getting the attention it deserves, we are in the same boat as DE, Orks and Bugs in the fact that we are often overlooked or only given "Band Aid" style updates to try and keep us somewhat relevant.

Basically everyone has received "band-aid style updates" over the past few years. Some of those band-aids have been covering minor scrapes, others are trying to hold severed limbs together.

The wishlisting above has a lot of good things that are necessary however I would even settle for the following which sadly might be more reachable:

-IG Tanks get a variant that is effective in dealing with Monstrous Creatures (Beast Hunter Shells anyone?)
-IG Tanks get 4 HP base
-Points reduction across the board

Forget anything and everything about tanks. Until we get an edition change and vehicles get a change, don't even bother.

>Ogryns are dropped to 20 PPM, gain rending and a 4+ armour save. Oh, and FNP

Is.. that really necessary? Or is this just full wishlisting.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

>Ogryns are dropped to 20 PPM, gain rending and a 4+ armour save. Oh, and FNP

Is.. that really necessary? Or is this just full wishlisting.

Have you ever used Ogryn?

Yeah. Absolutely necessary.

gmaleron wrote:
-IG Tanks get a variant that is effective in dealing with Monstrous Creatures (Beast Hunter Shells anyone?)

Forgot abut this. We need an anti MC choice or ywo, and they need to be good.

ZebioLizard2 wrote:

>Ogryns are dropped to 20 PPM, gain rending and a 4+ armour save. Oh, and FNP

Is.. that really necessary? Or is this just full wishlisting.

Have you ever run Ogryns? Which reminds me:
>An effective delivery system for Ogryns.

 gmaleron wrote:

-Points reduction across the board

I think we're well past this being a viable fix. The cost of almost everything has gradually crept downwards, in some cases combined with increased offensive power. It's at the point where how much lower should we go? 3ppm? 2ppm? Start pointing IG by squad, say, 6-8pts per squad? Diminishing returns is already a big thing when it comes to large guard blobs. The alternative is to make guardsmen individually better, which runs counter to what attracts many of us to play the faction.

The problem is now that if guardsmen are to stand out on their strength of character they must well, standout. To stand out is to be important as an individual and to make a difference as an individual. The guard are at an impasse where they are either a monolith of facless goons, or they are a group of heroic and laudable individuals.


This change into strength of character must translate into gameplay mechanics as well. I do not see that happening sadly.

Meagre pay and a genuine expectation of dying in service?

 Elbows wrote:
Meagre pay and a genuine expectation of dying in service?

Exalted

In the "agents of the Imperium" book the officer of the fleet and all guards psykers are listed. This "could" indicate that they and the valkyre are dropped from the codex. I'm expecting to see the vendetta dissapeared, though I converted one so I hope not. It might change name to something not impressive like "Auxilias Solaris" or "Militarum sapiens" with where the fluff is heading.

Guards are my favourite army but all horde armies really seem to have taken a beating. I don't want super bio-engineered killing machines or demigods or monsters. I want the good simple men complaining about having to kill them.

I hope for Guarsmen sculpts that are not holding their fifles sidewards from their torsos, but actually aim foward.

Wish list:
1. ability to upgrade any infantry unit or vehicle to "veteran status (BS4)
2. Tank commanders may issue orders to infantry or vehicle squads other than their own/ infantry commander may issue orders to vehicles
3. Vox give orders unlimited range
4. Valks are considered dedicated transports
5. upgrade for for the MoO that allows him to use his special ability more than once per turn (For lets say 20 points)
6. Leman russ variant with twin linked las canons. And give all russes some rear Armour.
7. Do something with scions, they look great but aren't cost effective next to vets.
8. Vehicle mounted plasma weapons do not suffer "gets hot"

I don't think GW will be drooping the Cadians anytime soon, but; I've been wrong before. If they were to do so I doubt they would replace them with Catchan, those guys just never seemed popular. Maybe new models for Tanith? Maybe Death Korp or one of the other WW1ish armies? Or some previously undisclosed guard army that looks something like the new Scions. Either way, we will see.

 master of ordinance wrote:
What we want:

Damn fine list!

How about this one;
The ability attach a command squad to the platoon it commands so everyone in the platoon can get FNP from the platoon medic?