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So my buddy got me into 40k and we're about to play our fifth game, I'm playing my Grey Knights and he's rolling as Ultramarines. He usually plays 'nids but he's switching it up. He's been playing for years and like I said, this will be my fifth game. Can you guys check out my army list and let me know what you think?

I'm going to use my Two purifier squads (combat teams) to scoop up objectives in their rhino while I put my paladin squad and attached Libby into deep strike and engage the SM up close with my terminators and attached Libby back them up with support along with my dread knight. Basically I'm gonna start turn one with my rhino and purifiers on the field and deep strike in my paladins, terminators and dread knight. Or should I put my rhino and purifiers in reserve as well?

EDIT: You're over your points limit. That's a big no-no. If you want to play a 1507pts game, say that to your opponent. Do NOT go over the points limit. You have soooo many upgrades that you can easily drop 1-2 items and be legal. (Ex: two falchions will get you to 1499, or one homer will get you to 1497.) Playing with more points than you've agreed to is definitely cheating, especially if you don't inform your opponent.

Check some of the other posts in the forum for ideas about how to better present your list. I don't want to have to scroll through a whole bunch of pictures with tiny text.

You've got one NDK, so your list is missing the two fundamental parts of a competitive GK list: another NDK and Draigo.
NDKs do so much work in our lists. If you can fit in three then you should!
I'd drop one of the guns on the NDK. He's going to be priority #1 for your opponent, so he probably won't last that long, and you can use the 30pts elsewhere.

Heavy weapons on your Purfs are a bad idea. Bc of their Rhinos and their short-range nova, they want to move ALL THE TIME, but heavy weapons make them want to stand still. That's a conflict of purpose and should be avoided. If you want heavy weapons, put psycans on Termies.
Take two squads of Purfs for two Rhinos. A single Rhino is gonna get you nowhere.

Two melta shots on the Libbys is an interesting idea, but I think it won't work out in practice. You'll prolly do 1-2 HP on a vehicle for that 20pts, which is better spent elsewhere. Psycannons on Termies is the way to pop vehicles.

You need at least one hammer in each unit. At LEAST. (Don't put the hammer on a justicar. He'll get challenged and then die before getting to swing.)

Your uber-unit, the Pallies, really suck at killing anything with a 2+ save, and they also really suck when pitted against AP2. If you're insistent on taking Pallies (which is a terrible idea in the first place), take at least one more body to maximise the FnP and the Banner bonuses.
Here's why they're terrible: Grav and S8, which are both prolific in the game. Spending lots of points on a cool unit, only to have it wounded BECAUSE it has a good save is really sad. Your SM friend will take Grav Cents, which will do 13 hits and 12 wounds at AP2. In one volley you'll lose 2-3 models. Or if he's more up-to-date, he'll take a Skyhammer with 20-40 grav shots, which will kill the unit.
Against Tau, you'll face S8 AP2 blasts, which will deny your FnP and just start removing models. Against Knights, you've got D weapons that will cut you down.
All in all, the points sink on the Pallies isn't worth the work they can do. There are much better, more points-efficient units, like GKSS or GKI or another NDK!
Drop the Pallies, spend ~200pts on another NDK, and then spend the remaining ~150 on a GKI unit with an incinerator. Shunt/burn is a deadly tactic when done with multiple units. Two NDK and a GKI in their face T1 means you'll be in assault T2.

Good call on keeping at least one warding stave on the Libby. A 3+DtW is amazing.

Hi, i'm not super familiar with Grey Knights, but I do know Ultramarines.

So, a couple questions / comments:

1. Is there a reason why you don't have Kaldor Draigo in your list? He's a straight boss and not much in our arsenal will stand up to him.

2. The Gatling psilencer on NDK doesn't scare me. Strength 4, AP-means you should expect 20 hits to land 2 wounds against 3+. It's not an assault weapon so you can't use it and charge. The heavy incinerator scares me way more.

3. Is your opponent using Grav-Centurions? If so, your GKTs will melt ugly. You might be better served with the 3+ save, cheaper generic marines as a troop choice. Ultramarines without grav aren't really scaring anyone, so I would assume your opponent has some of it.

4. Cut points where you can. I personally wouldn't bother with a combi-melta on the librarian.

My recommendation would be to save points where you can and try to squeeze in Kaldor Draigo. I know everyone hates on land raiders really hard, but you might consider it.

 Marmatag wrote:
The Gatling psilencer on NDK doesn't scare me. Strength 4, AP-means you should expect 20 hits to land 2 wounds against 3+. It's not an assault weapon so you can't use it and charge.

MCs have Relentless.

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

 Marmatag wrote:
The Gatling psilencer on NDK doesn't scare me. Strength 4, AP-means you should expect 20 hits to land 2 wounds against 3+. It's not an assault weapon so you can't use it and charge.

MCs have Relentless.

Thanks. Still, I view that psilencer as a waste of points. I misread and did the math with 20 shots. Drop that to 12 and it's 1 wound on a tac squad. The second you go up to 5 toughness it drops below 1 expected wound, on a 3+ save. So are you really going to try and manifest force, to shoot this at some thunderwolf cavalry or wulfen, for the instant death? Where would this be useful?

It's very useful against multi-wound models. I regularly get First Blood on Fateweaver with my Psilencer
Screamers, Hounds, Riptides, Zoanthropes, Tyrants, Cents, Paladins, Wracks, Iron Hands Star...there's a lot of things that are scared of ranged Force.
And yes, psilencers kill Wulfen.

The incinerator is the right choice if you have only one NDK. On the second one I always take a psilen, and on the third I take another incin.

I know I'm just over points and I wouldn't field anything without agreeing if it's okay to go over points or not. Like I said, I'm still trying to get a feel for my troops in general and it's my first time playing against Ultramarines. The last time I played against his 'nids I was able to hold my own. I don't have Draigo yet which is why I'm not fielding him and I'm currently waiting to get another NDK

 Marmatag wrote:

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

 Marmatag wrote:
The Gatling psilencer on NDK doesn't scare me. Strength 4, AP-means you should expect 20 hits to land 2 wounds against 3+. It's not an assault weapon so you can't use it and charge.

MCs have Relentless.

Thanks. Still, I view that psilencer as a waste of points. I misread and did the math with 20 shots. Drop that to 12 and it's 1 wound on a tac squad. The second you go up to 5 toughness it drops below 1 expected wound, on a 3+ save. So are you really going to try and manifest force, to shoot this at some thunderwolf cavalry or wulfen, for the instant death? Where would this be useful?

I can't really imagine a scenario where the Psycannon or the Heavy Incinerator is just not vastly superior in every way.

Force Psilencer + Misfortune is a fun combo if you can get it off.

What about tactics and deployment though? Should I keep everything in deep Strike and my rhinos in reserve?

Joey_Fingarelli wrote:
What about tactics and deployment though? Should I keep everything in deep Strike and my rhinos in reserve?

Can you tell us what models for GK you have? Like in total?


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Joey_Fingarelli wrote:
What about tactics and deployment though? Should I keep everything in deep Strike and my rhinos in reserve?

The problem with 1 NDK is that you have no redundancy, if it gets blasted off the table on turn 1 by either poor luck or he just dumps all his firepower on it you are left without the versatility and mobility it provides. If you have just one I guess you just gotta use it but I think you should use a Psycannon instead of the Psilencer.

Purifiers should have incinerators, they "in my mind anyway" are not meant to fight high toughness models. You should have other vehicles or have two 5 man groups of them with 2x incinerators so you can have two rhino's. This prevents him from having to pop a single rhino and stranding your entire squad in the middle of the board as the other rhino can still move and it can provide a model LOS block for the squad that got stranded. What you want to do is drive up and pop them out where they can drop a cleansing flame and hit as many things as possible and then use the incinerators to finish of weaker unit as the incinerators autohit. As for kitting them out weaponwise I am not sure you need to really do that, if they have 2 incinerators it will be rough for anyone to charge them and they are better off staying out of melee and using the flame templates as much as possible, once you pop them out if your opponent can blast them to pieces rather than charging into their incinerators the weapons will do no good if they never even get into an assault phase and the points are wasted.

As for the paladins I think you would be better off not using them, it is such a huge point sink, GK are an elite unit army and to a certain degree you want to put as many models on the table as possible, you can get nearly 3 squads for GKSS for the price of the paladins. You also don't really have any units in your current setup to just sit on objectives or play the mission, I guess you don't need that if you can table your opponent but you can't rely on doing that.

The terminators are the ones I would suggest giving melee weapons too, daemon hammers or falchions and psycannon's or melta bombs if you need to beat heavy armor, but the hammers should do that just fine against vehicles.

Ideally if you can get an ally with cheaper models to absorb fire and play the mission you can leave your GK open to fight the more powerful units. Inquistorial Henchmen are good for that, so are IG or Skitarri Vanguards which are 100pts for 10 man group.

Here's what I have in total: 10 power armor units (i.e. Strike squads, etc)
1 nemesis dreadknight
1 dreadnought
1 rhino/razorback
1 land raider
10 termies
2 librarians
1 storm raven
Castellan Crowe


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I have another ten man squad, dreadknight, razorback and Draigo in the mail

I would play the dreadnought probably as a mobile support platform since you dont currently have your 2nd NDK yet, and the purifiers are a blob mopup squad having them sit around on objectives is kind of a waste may as well just use strike squads for that and save the points.