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From Bolter and Chainsword:

Warhammer Live is going to have Friday's [probably Thursday since Warhammer Live is likely leaving for Vegas on Friday] Battle Report as Custodes VS Thousand Sons (the latter having their first advance preview of the codex during the battle).

Brian888 wrote:
From Bolter and Chainsword:

Warhammer Live is going to have Friday's [probably Thursday since Warhammer Live is likely leaving for Vegas on Friday] Battle Report as Custodes VS Thousand Sons (the latter having their first advance preview of the codex during the battle).

It's gonna be a slaughterfest. It'll be a pretty embarrassing show for the Thousand Sons new codex.

....which is why it would be not at all as ridiculous as you claim for a buffing character to grant them 2+ to hit. Completely unsupported, Tzaangors are essentially worthless, the only reason they're quite useful right now is because they have access to pretty good defensive buffs through the ahriman/exalted reroll buff plus the psychic power that gives them a 4++.

They're really quite solid if you take a single unit of 30 in the army with the idea that you're going to give them that buff and in an emergency keep them from running with the Insane Bravery stratagem...but that's not using them as pure "fodder" - the whole point of them is that they perform a similar task to cultists but actually do kill things in melee quite effectively.

 nintura wrote:

Brian888 wrote:
From Bolter and Chainsword:

Warhammer Live is going to have Friday's [probably Thursday since Warhammer Live is likely leaving for Vegas on Friday] Battle Report as Custodes VS Thousand Sons (the latter having their first advance preview of the codex during the battle).

It's gonna be a slaughterfest. It'll be a pretty embarrassing show for the Thousand Sons new codex.

Probably (I mean, the idea is to advertise the Custodes), but it'll still be amusing to see the Sons play an army that they actually outnumber.

Brian888 wrote:

 nintura wrote:

Brian888 wrote:
From Bolter and Chainsword:

Warhammer Live is going to have Friday's [probably Thursday since Warhammer Live is likely leaving for Vegas on Friday] Battle Report as Custodes VS Thousand Sons (the latter having their first advance preview of the codex during the battle).

It's gonna be a slaughterfest. It'll be a pretty embarrassing show for the Thousand Sons new codex.

Probably (I mean, the idea is to advertise the Custodes), but it'll still be amusing to see the Sons play an army that they actually outnumber.

It's also to advertise the new Thousand Sons codex with a preview of said book. But it's going to be a one sided fight unless they completely rig it or the rolls are horrible.

Okay first off, they absolutely are rigged to a degree these are marketing exercises.

Second, how do you possibly think you can predict the result of an actual fair fight despite having no idea what either codex actually holds?

I mean, unless they nerf the crap out of Magnus he could swing the game on his own.

Maybe tsons get the same CT as custodes do, that'd be a game changer for much of the army. Also be borderline broken in some cases.

There are a lot of things that they could do in the new tsons codex that would make tson rubrics better than rubrics from the chaos codex, but I doubt they will do anything drastic which is a shame.

I mean between death guard in chaos to death guard by themselves there wasn't much of a difference, it was supporting units that got the big boost. So really it is all going to be about the tzaangors since that's where they have free will to change what they want to make tsons play the way they want.

I really hope tsons work well by themselves and am looking forward to the preview to see anything that I can to give an idea of where they are going.

First off, this is only going to supposedly show a preview of some of the new codex things. The full codex will not be being used or people could figure out a lot more of the dex itself. Secondly, I have no rose colored lenses about GW's love for their fanboy loyalists. Thirdly this isn't an advertisement for Thousand Sons, it's for the new custodes.

Lol jesus the self-deprecation in here toward an army people are supposed to "enjoy" playing is pathetic.

Everyone here knows those shows are really just to showcase whats in the book; Thats the primary reason ill tune in anywho.

I think we are in for a treat honestly, cant wait to see whats in store.

the_scotsman wrote:....which is why it would be not at all as ridiculous as you claim for a buffing character to grant them 2+ to hit. Completely unsupported, Tzaangors are essentially worthless, the only reason they're quite useful right now is because they have access to pretty good defensive buffs through the ahriman/exalted reroll buff plus the psychic power that gives them a 4++.

They're really quite solid if you take a single unit of 30 in the army with the idea that you're going to give them that buff and in an emergency keep them from running with the Insane Bravery stratagem...but that's not using them as pure "fodder" - the whole point of them is that they perform a similar task to cultists but actually do kill things in melee quite effectively.

You have to look at effects as a whole, you give them a +1 with an aura and you free up a spell not to mention basically can get multiple instances of what is supposed to be limited. On top of that your going ro end up with multiple squads being able to hit 97% of the time with 2 auras. 2 30 man squads will be able to kill 60+ Guard in a single turn, if you play your cards right you can snipe the Commisars with spells and Blam your talking upwards of 90 Guardsman a turn. Even SM will lose 400 points per turn, assuming a special in 1 of the 6 squads you will kill in a turn. But that's gotta cost like 8-9 hundred points nope might break 650 wont be above 700.

The're not fodder and never have been. They are 7 ppm they are almost double guardsman on thier own. Not including HQs to buff them once you do that Guardsman will go up to 6 ppm Tzaangors on the other hand go up to 9 ppm if you include 1 Exalted for 60 Tzaangors. They have never been fodder.

If i had to venture a guess on the Aura i would say some sort of LD buff and reroll 1s to wound in CC. He will basically be a cross between an Exalted champion and a Dark Apostle.

SilverAlien wrote:Okay first off, they absolutely are rigged to a degree these are marketing exercises.

Second, how do you possibly think you can predict the result of an actual fair fight despite having no idea what either codex actually holds?

I mean, unless they nerf the crap out of Magnus he could swing the game on his own.

Maybe tsons get the same CT as custodes do, that'd be a game changer for much of the army. Also be borderline broken in some cases.

I have to agree they are probably rigged, bit to be fair you dont want a set of bad rolls to ruin your sales for the next quaterly becuase someo e wanted to roll 4 1s on 6 dice, or have a bunch of Rubrics blow up and take out half your army.

Azuza001 wrote:There are a lot of things that they could do in the new tsons codex that would make tson rubrics better than rubrics from the chaos codex, but I doubt they will do anything drastic which is a shame.

I mean between death guard in chaos to death guard by themselves there wasn't much of a difference, it was supporting units that got the big boost. So really it is all going to be about the tzaangors since that's where they have free will to change what they want to make tsons play the way they want.

I really hope tsons work well by themselves and am looking forward to the preview to see anything that I can to give an idea of where they are going.

The only thing I can see them doing is maybe a one or two point drop but that's about it, they wont do anything more becuase they went in a different direction and used Tzaangors to fill holes and fix problems.

Most likely rubrics will be unchanged except for points. OST however could be pretty different. An extra wound would really increase their staying power, maybe they’ll give their swords a special rule ala the death guard rust rule

demontalons wrote:
Most likely rubrics will be unchanged except for points. OST however could be pretty different. An extra wound would really increase their staying power, maybe they’ll give their swords a special rule ala the death guard rust rule

unchanged but also have a tactic, strategem access, and *possibly* some kind of new aura to take advantage of.

Possibly a point drop, so overall a much better place.

O I agree, at bare minimum they will be better, question is just how much better. Tomorrow is the live battle so hopefully we get some juicy tidbits

Ahriman21 wrote:

demontalons wrote:
Most likely rubrics will be unchanged except for points. OST however could be pretty different. An extra wound would really increase their staying power, maybe they’ll give their swords a special rule ala the death guard rust rule

unchanged but also have a tactic, strategem access, and *possibly* some kind of new aura to take advantage of.

Possibly a point drop, so overall a much better place.

I don't think so I think the Warpflame pistol will be bumped by a couple points, its not the same thing but it would be a points change.

demontalons wrote:O I agree, at bare minimum they will be better, question is just how much better. Tomorrow is the live battle so hopefully we get some juicy tidbits

I have no doubt we will get tidbits but they will almost exclusively be about Tzaangors, in particular the new units.

I mean, a start for SOT would be to just revert their damn swords back to force swords like they were before. 1 damage S4 melee weapons are so dumb on models that cost 50 odd points a pop.

My last game I used them was the single best performance they ever had, and they still only managed to deal 3-4 wounds per phase for three turns. It just so happened that those were the critical wounds I needed to finish off mortarion, then kill a nurgle herald, then kill a DG lord and tie up one of their artillery tanks.

I know, SOT infuriate me. Some great rules and models, blunted by utter inflexibility in loadout, capped with the worst CC weapon they could have been given, barring chainswords.

grouchoben wrote:
I know, SOT infuriate me. Some great rules and models, blunted by utter inflexibility in loadout, capped with the worst CC weapon they could have been given, barring chainswords.

I'd rather have them equipped with chainswords tbh. I need anti-horde weapons WAY more than I need more low-strength good AP single damage weaponry. Cost 4 points less per model and get an extra cc attack? Sign me up!

So what time is the 1k Sons game? I know it's at 6 but I dont know the timezone.

 nintura wrote:
So what time is the 1k Sons game? I know it's at 6 but I dont know the timezone.

GMT. If you're in EST in the United States, it's at 1 PM.

Brian888 wrote:

 nintura wrote:
So what time is the 1k Sons game? I know it's at 6 but I dont know the timezone.

GMT. If you're in EST in the United States, it's at 1 PM.

Oh wow, thanks for telling me that. I'd have totally missed it.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Ahriman21 wrote:

demontalons wrote:
Most likely rubrics will be unchanged except for points. OST however could be pretty different. An extra wound would really increase their staying power, maybe they’ll give their swords a special rule ala the death guard rust rule

unchanged but also have a tactic, strategem access, and *possibly* some kind of new aura to take advantage of.

Possibly a point drop, so overall a much better place.

I don't think so I think the Warpflame pistol will be bumped by a couple points, its not the same thing but it would be a points change.

demontalons wrote:O I agree, at bare minimum they will be better, question is just how much better. Tomorrow is the live battle so hopefully we get some juicy tidbits

I have no doubt we will get tidbits but they will almost exclusively be about Tzaangors, in particular the new units.

Guess again; already shown that we are getting TWO lores, keeping dark hereticus, and on top of that the Rubric and Scarab Occult Sorcerers are getting 1 spell slot each for spell access.

Translation; Smite nerf meant *NOTHING* so all your freaking out means and meant nothing. Back to the army being awesome

Look pretty good to me, I also like the fact that the tzaangor disc unit is a SINGLE unit with weapon options so you can mix and match, the "Greatbow" will be interesting to see.

Shaman is (like I guessed) an elite slot, level 1 wizard.

The Daemon Prince for us has a 4++ invulnerable AND gains an extra spell slot.

Ahriman21 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Ahriman21 wrote:

demontalons wrote:
Most likely rubrics will be unchanged except for points. OST however could be pretty different. An extra wound would really increase their staying power, maybe they’ll give their swords a special rule ala the death guard rust rule

unchanged but also have a tactic, strategem access, and *possibly* some kind of new aura to take advantage of.

Possibly a point drop, so overall a much better place.

I don't think so I think the Warpflame pistol will be bumped by a couple points, its not the same thing but it would be a points change.

demontalons wrote:O I agree, at bare minimum they will be better, question is just how much better. Tomorrow is the live battle so hopefully we get some juicy tidbits

I have no doubt we will get tidbits but they will almost exclusively be about Tzaangors, in particular the new units.

Guess again; already shown that we are getting TWO lores, keeping dark hereticus, and on top of that the Rubric and Scarab Occult Sorcerers are getting 1 spell slot each for spell access.

Translation; Smite nerf meant *NOTHING* so all your freaking out means and meant nothing. Back to the army being awesome

Look pretty good to me, I also like the fact that the tzaangor disc unit is a SINGLE unit with weapon options so you can mix and match, the "Greatbow" will be interesting to see.

Shaman is (like I guessed) an elite slot, level 1 wizard.

The Daemon Prince for us has a 4++ invulnerable AND gains an extra spell slot.

Where is this new information from?

the Warhammer live stream, and the army-list they showed. They showed the T-sons army list.

I presume by the end of the twitch game we will know ALOT about our army.

I'm honestly shocked that we're keeping Dark Hereticus. That is incredible!

List for today's game is up here: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/01/16/week-warhammer-live-9/

So, no points listed on either the TS or Custodes lists. I'll go on a limb and say they're maybe using power levels in this case (unless it's mentioned otherwise on the stream). Which means... the Icon of Flame is still garbage in the new Codex. And here I was hoping the Tzaangors would get the same banner they have in AoS. Or at least an update on Icon of Flame for a TS army.

For reference, the Tzaangor Banner in AoS reads: At the start of your hero phases, take a dice for each WIZARD (friend or foe) within 9" of this unit. Then, pick an enemy unit within 18" and roll the dice; the unit suffers a mortal wound for each roll of 4 or more."

And here...we...go!

Its points, not power levels.

the TS army is 1999 points, missed the custodian count.


This much at 2000 points seems rather solid.
Actual spells on rubrics is an amazing update (I wonder if CSM rubrics get it in FAQ?)

Yea, this codex has potential.

The Sons Legion Trait: Each of the psykers adds 6" to his spell ranges.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Apparently Magnus no longer rerolls 1s on his inv save. :(


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Fatecaster Greatbows do auto-damage on 6s to hit (but not mortal wounds).

I don't even know what auto-damage, as in automatically wound on to-hit of 6?

They were not very clear on that honestly.

 BoomWolf wrote:
I don't even know what auto-damage, as in automatically wound on to-hit of 6?

They were not very clear on that honestly.

I think that's what it means, yeah, just do the wounds without having to do a to-wound roll.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Apparently the Mutalith offers a varying buff to your army at the start of the shooting phase. Interesting, because in AoS it's a debuff/damage dealer.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The Dark Matter Crystal lets you re-set-up a unit on the board.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The Mutalith can blow up when it dies like a vehicle.


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The Tzaangor Shaman can reroll a failed casting roll once per battle (like AoS).


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Based on what was said earlier, it sounds like the Enlightened with the Greatbows do 3 damage automatically on a 6 to hit (but not mortal wounds).


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Not enough use of Death Hex in this game, IMO. Those Custodes invulnerable saves are punishing.


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The Sons won on points!