Switch Theme:

MCU tv shows, spoilers within.  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Also need to praise the action sequences, as they’re up to the usual “wow! I can actually follow what’s going on!’ standard, without resorting to slow-mo.

No mean feat considering it happened at night, amongst people wearing dark colours.

Also some seriously inventive use of Sam’s suit, something I will always approve of.

Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?

Pfizer vaccine administered 13:40pm 18 Feb 21. Still no second head. Second jab 13:35pm 6 May 2021. At the Masonic Hall. 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Trustworthy Shas'vre





Leicester

Ok, it was a little on the nose, but I was literally shouting at the TV “Be the hero Walker!” when he had the choice to make.

I like the change in title at the end, but I think the suit cowl looked a little goofy.

The one thing that really fell flat to me was the Isaiah exhibit; I really don’t think that would be enough to make him feel that all was forgiven.

DS:80+S+GM+B+I+Pw40k08D+A++WD355R+T(M)DM+
 Zed wrote:
*All statements reflect my opinion at this moment. if some sort of pretty new model gets released (or if I change my mind at random) I reserve the right to jump on any bandwagon at will.
 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Ok, spoiler land!

Spoiler:
Whilst the 5th episode of this series will probably remain my fav, as it finally took all the wishy washy "Are they the baddies?" crap with the Flagsmashers and the "Gee shucks I want to do a good job but now I'm suddenly evil and unstable!" Walker crap and gave it focus and a solid base to move into the final episode, I think that the 6th episode will come second.

Firstly the suit looks great. I was a bit torn on the weird things on the side of his head, but by the end I get why they're there and he's not just helmetless. And his goggles didn't magically vanish whenever he had to deliver dialogue, so that's a nice touch. Love the colour-scheme as well, and the new wings are awesome.

Sam as Cap is fantastic, as was the title change at the end. Basically Sam was Cap through and through, from the shield throwing, to the quick thinking in hard situations, to the speechifying at the end. And giving Bradley his own part of the Captain America exhibition was very cool.

Bucky didn't get to do as much this time around, but he got some good fights and a very sad (if somewhat truncated) resolution with the old Japanese man. And the psychiatrist, for that matter.

Walker got a good end to his story. When he was faced with going after Karli or saving the people, he made the right choice. He couldn't seal the deal, sadly, as the rest of the Flagsmashers gangked him, but he was there, helping people right up until the moment he couldn't. His shield didn't last long though. :( Still, USAgent, reporting for duty!

I like that Batroc remains very hard to beat, unless you're a super soldier. Even with the shield, Sam couldn't do a whole hell of a lot to him in HTH combat. He does earn the name 'the leaper'. Shame about how it ended though, and who ended him.

So let's get to the Sharon of all this: Wow. That was awful. Really bad. The thing that everyone picked almost from the moment she showed up (like who Agetha really was) and in the end the great reveal is... a phone call to someone about government secrets and weapons. Wow. The Power Broker was a virtual non-entity in this show from the moment 'he' was first mentioned, and by the end was still a non-entity because Sharon just doesn't make for a compelling villain. Don't get me wrong. I like the idea of having one of the good guys become so embittered by what happened to her after the events of Civil War/Infinity War that she decides to say 'feth it!' and become a bad guy. But all of it just just felt so... disconnected from everything else.

If the Flagsmashers were a weak villain because Marvel spent too long on the fence about whether they were really bad or not, then the Power Broker was worse. I honestly thought she'd turn into a Skrull at the end as a lead in to Secret Wars, but nope. Not even that.

And finally, there was one thing where I actually very upset when it didn't happen.

24m and 10 seconds into the episode:

Karli - 'Stay down!'
*Sam gets up*
Sam - 'No.'

Awful. Just awful. Why? Because it should have been this instead:

Karli - 'Stay down!'
*Sam gets up*
Sam - 'No. I can do this all day.'

The most perfect opportunity, a bit of meta-torch handing, and they wasted it. Wasted it!!! AHH! So frustrating.

Still, cool episode.

Overall the series would've worked better if it'd been released all at once without the big week gaps between each ep.
 Jadenim wrote:
... but I was literally shouting at the TV “Be the hero Walker!” when he had the choice to make.
I uhh... *cough*... may have done the exact same thing.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







I'm kinda surprised for Isaiah...

That there wasn't a caption at the bottom of the statue that said something like, well...


"A Patriot."
   
Made in us
Cabin Zombie






I was surprised when Sam didn’t say The Line either. Also surprised they gave no teaser for the kid having inherited strength or anything.

 
   
Made in es
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






 Compel wrote:
I'm kinda surprised for Isaiah...

That there wasn't a caption at the bottom of the statue that said something like, well...


"A Patriot."


Well, there's the stone at the side:

ISAIAH BRADLEY
Isaiah Bradley is an american hero whose name went unkown for too long.

Isaiah was one of a dozen african-american soldiers who were recruited against their will and without their consent for participation in human testing in pursuit of the super soldier serum. Most did not survie. The few who lived through testing were sent on secret missions during the Korean War. During the conflict, against all odds, Isaiah Bradley rescued his fellow soldiers and 28 other POWs from behind enemy lines.

However, fearful of the ramifications of a black super soldier, some individuals within the government tried to erase Isaiah's story from history. His family was issued a falsified death certificate, and for decades the truth of his unflinching bravery was buried.


(there's another paragrafh, but I can't see a close enough take)
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran





I expected Sam to say “ I can do this all day” too, but maybe it’s better that he didn’t, has San ever heard Steve actually say that? Bucky has, but I don’t think Sam ever did.

Also where was Spider-man? I half expected a cameo of some description, or at least a brief mention to hand wave why he didn’t show up when this was going on in his city. Maybe there will be a passing mention in No Way Home.
   
Made in us
Cabin Zombie






It was a school night.

 
   
Made in es
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






Aash wrote:
I expected Sam to say “ I can do this all day” too, but maybe it’s better that he didn’t, has San ever heard Steve actually say that? Bucky has, but I don’t think Sam ever did.

Also where was Spider-man? I half expected a cameo of some description, or at least a brief mention to hand wave why he didn’t show up when this was going on in his city. Maybe there will be a passing mention in No Way Home.


Well... one of the main threads of the series is "you have to be your own person", so parroting Steve's words might not be the best there.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/23 13:12:56


 
   
Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Yeah. I think that was a deliberate thing. We the audience half expected it, but I reckon not saying it was the right call.

As for Isaiah? He got his recognition. And that’s possibly more powerful than an apology, which might be made in private and compensated on the hush hush.

Because the recognition is as much of him, as the active attempts to cover up his existence.

I’m interested to see how the pick up the reins on Power Broker though.

Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?

Pfizer vaccine administered 13:40pm 18 Feb 21. Still no second head. Second jab 13:35pm 6 May 2021. At the Masonic Hall. 
   
Made in es
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yeah. I think that was a deliberate thing. We the audience half expected it, but I reckon not saying it was the right call.

As for Isaiah? He got his recognition. And that’s possibly more powerful than an apology, which might be made in private and compensated on the hush hush.

Because the recognition is as much of him, as the active attempts to cover up his existence.


I’m interested to see how the pick up the reins on Power Broker though.


There is also another thing... erasure is a horrible thing, and they erased his whole life. Hell, he only was able to live because a nurse took pity on him and falsified a death certificate!

Being able to have your life "back" is powerful, I think. Just saying "this man existed, and we did this to him" is something you don't usually see.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/04/23 13:20:59


 
   
Made in gb
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





Scotland, but nowhere near my rulebook

I dunno. "I can do this all day" comes with a certain assumption that whoever's beating Cap will never stop doing it, but Cap can take it because he's strong.

Sam is DONE with taking it. He's not going to do this all day, because you are going to stop.
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran





 Graphite wrote:
I dunno. "I can do this all day" comes with a certain assumption that whoever's beating Cap will never stop doing it, but Cap can take it because he's strong.

Sam is DONE with taking it. He's not going to do this all day, because you are going to stop.


Isn’t the whole point that it’s about strength of will and heart, which is why Steve says it to the bully before he was given the serum. But yeah, it’s a toss up between carrying on Steve’s legacy and being his own version of Captain America, not just trying to replace Steve. I guess they wanted to emphasis Sam being his own man and making the choice to carry the shield for his own reasons.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/23 13:40:18


 
   
Made in us
Cabin Zombie






Also Sam has at least a bit of history just saying “No” when told to do something.

 
   
Made in gb
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





Scotland, but nowhere near my rulebook

I also think it ties into his later speech to the Senator about the vote. Which boiled down to "it's your turn to change".

Just because you have the strength of will to put up with something, doesn't mean you should have to.
   
Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Indeed. I particularly enjoyed the “don’t ask people to step up if you won’t meet them half way”.

Though I’m sure it’ll have upset someone out there!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Albertorius wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yeah. I think that was a deliberate thing. We the audience half expected it, but I reckon not saying it was the right call.

As for Isaiah? He got his recognition. And that’s possibly more powerful than an apology, which might be made in private and compensated on the hush hush.

Because the recognition is as much of him, as the active attempts to cover up his existence.


I’m interested to see how the pick up the reins on Power Broker though.


There is also another thing... erasure is a horrible thing, and they erased his whole life. Hell, he only was able to live because a nurse took pity on him and falsified a death certificate!

Being able to have your life "back" is powerful, I think. Just saying "this man existed, and we did this to him" is something you don't usually see.


Especially with the whole history of race relations in the USA. It was as much a “they’ve acknowledged my existence” as it is “well, I guess things do get better”. Remember Isaiah was sceptical about folk accepting Sam as Cap at all, and seemed proud to be proven wrong.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/23 15:48:22


Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?

Pfizer vaccine administered 13:40pm 18 Feb 21. Still no second head. Second jab 13:35pm 6 May 2021. At the Masonic Hall. 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





So we're up to 4 on the YA role call right? 5 with Hawkeye? Very curious what format that will take.

I don't think the end quite lived up to the show that proceeded it. The dark fighting wasn't as clean and they didn't really make the most of the characters, wasting time I things like Batroc vs Sam where they could have spent on Walker or just not really needing that kind of fight. Sam did a pretty great job proving himself through means other than direct confrontation and those bits were a lot stronger than when he ported in and sparred with the guy from Cap2 over what felt like nothing.

I suspect some of the resolutions are a result of Covid. There were a LOT of scenes with one or two characters very far apart with only 1-2 other characters. I don't think it really hurt the series, but it feels like there were definitely things they couldn't wrap up quite the way they wanted. Similarly, I would have liked to see Sam's speech in a more formal setting than the impromptu street lecture. It made it feel more soapboxy than it would have had it been as part of the actual vote for the resettlement rather than directed at one man.

That's a lot of negative, but I still really liked it. The actual message was strong, Zemo was GREAT, Sam's suit and powers and choreography and attitude and presence are all huge wins I'm excited to see more of. Walker finding a purpose again while being JUST dumb enough to not realize he's a tool. Bucky getting closure, both by seeing a failure try to do better and his own faith in Sam rewarded pushing him to own up to himself was great. I did kind of expect Sharon to kidnap Karli for experimentation but she's still an interesting foil. All in all, quite enjoyed it.

Oh, and did one of the senators say something like "isn't Cap supposed to be on the moon?". I know it's a callback but I'm curious if they really plan to do something with that.
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Trustworthy Shas'vre





Leicester

It would have been funny if they'd had a little shot of Bucky flirting with Sam's sister again...

DS:80+S+GM+B+I+Pw40k08D+A++WD355R+T(M)DM+
 Zed wrote:
*All statements reflect my opinion at this moment. if some sort of pretty new model gets released (or if I change my mind at random) I reserve the right to jump on any bandwagon at will.
 
   
Made in us
Proud Triarch Praetorian





 Jadenim wrote:
It would have been funny if they'd had a little shot of Bucky flirting with Sam's sister again...


The end montage at the party, he is holding up 3 kids with his bionic arm in front of her and chatting with her, clearly showing off.
   
Made in us
Exalted Beastlord




That was pretty good, overall for the series very good. Ending felt a little weak just because they were wrapping up too many threads far too neatly.

Liked it better than Wandavision, really, since it wasn't a muddled pass on heroes being villains, but its ok because sadness.

Weakest part, I think, was the GRC and the general Flaggsmashers movement (not just Karli and her crazy patrol) are way too vague, and doing non-specific things in sort-of villainous ways. They tried to clear that up a little at the end, but its way too late to invest any sort of emotion in it.

Not sure the soap-box speech of 'Its best to work together while remembering when you've been helpless' really does the trick. The emotion that feeling evokes in me is blind panic, which is not a state I want to be making rational decisions in.

Zemo was definitely the stand out, and all the more impressive since he was such a non-entity in Civil War.

Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in us
Cabin Zombie






And they’ve confirmed a Captain America 4 from the show runner of this.

 
   
Made in us
Hangin' with Gork & Mork






Voss wrote:
Zemo ... was such a non-entity in Civil War.


Gonna need some more justification for such a ludicrous statement. As a non powered dude he tore through HYDRA, manipulated governmental entities, manipulated Bucky, and tore the Avengers apart.

Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







I think it's a fair statement, I tend to forget he's even in the movie. - The drama is all about Stark, Cap and Bucky.

By the end of the film, I typically forget he's even in the movie until T'Challa catches up with him for that chat.
   
Made in us
Member of the Ethereal Council




USA

 Ahtman wrote:


Gonna need some more justification for such a ludicrous statement. As a non powered dude he tore through HYDRA, manipulated governmental entities, manipulated Bucky, and tore the Avengers apart.


There's a habit in some cases where people associate how impactful a character is with their screen time. Zemo was not much of a presence in the film compared to everyone else, but his actions set in motion and drove the entire plot from start to finish. But he got a lot less screen time. I've seen it in other works too. Because Gundam Seed was on my mind; Rau la Creuset is one of the story's most impactful characters. Almost every major plot beat has his hand directly in it. But he was never the focus of the plot (until the very very end) or the story and it's sometimes surprisingly easy to forget how much stuff he actually did.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/24 14:46:30


   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran





 Ahtman wrote:
Voss wrote:
Zemo ... was such a non-entity in Civil War.


Gonna need some more justification for such a ludicrous statement. As a non powered dude he tore through HYDRA, manipulated governmental entities, manipulated Bucky, and tore the Avengers apart.


Zemo wasn’t a character in Civil War, he was a plot device.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/24 17:02:25


 
   
Made in us
Dominating Dominatrix






A plot device with motivations, history, goals, a plan for how to get there.

The red winter soldier book is a plot device. Zemo was a character.


These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
 
   
Made in ca
Rampaging Carnifex





Toronto, Ontario

Yeah, Zemo was absolutely a character in his own right. Aside from Killmonger, he's probably got like the best developed motivations in the MCU rogues gallery.
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran





I feel quite differently. Zeno wouldn’t even crack the top 10 MCU villains for me based on Civil War. I thought in falcon and the winter soldier he became an interesting character.

For me civil war was all about iron man vs cap and I feel that zemo is an afterthought. They needed something to manipulate the titular civil war and who and why they were doing it seemed like distant secondary concerns.

But each to their own.
   
Made in ca
Krazed Killa Kan




Monarchy of TBD

I think it has to do with how recently you saw Civil War- one of the best, and most frightening things about Zemo is how incredibly forgettable he is. You wouldn't notice him walking down the street, but he's an incredibly effective mastermind. If you've forgotten he was in the movie, well, then he did his job exactly right.

In a month, we'll be talking about Sam's cap suit, Isaiah Bradley, US Agent maybe the Power Broker- but not the 2 humble, hardworking support cast- Bucky and Zemo. By the time the next cap movie rolls around we'll have again forgotten all about Zemo.

Klawz-Ramming is a subset of citrus fruit?
Gwar- "And everyone wants a bigger Spleen!"
Mercurial wrote:
I admire your aplomb and instate you as Baron of the Seas and Lord Marshall of Privateers.
Orkeosaurus wrote:Star Trek also said we'd have X-Wings by now. We all see how that prediction turned out.
Orkeosaurus, on homophobia, the nature of homosexuality, and the greatness of George Takei.
English doesn't borrow from other languages. It follows them down dark alleyways and mugs them for loose grammar.

 
   
Made in ca
Stormin' Stompa






Agreed. You don't necessarily always need theatrical levels of evil like Thanos or Darth Vader to be an effective villain. Having understated and competent guys like Zemo is honestly refreshing given how often the villain is just a bad guy mirror of the hero.
   
 
Forum Index » Geek Media
Go to: