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So here is the thing, according to GS3 Guilliman and Voldus are now army list entries for all imperium armies/detachments

This means that I could take Voldus as my HQ choice in a Champions of Fenris (Space Wolves) detachment or an Angel's Blade (Blood Angels) detachment correct?

By the same token Guilliman can be LOW for any space wolves/blood angels/imperial guard/etc detachment ?

And the big one.....what I really want to know is...does this now make Guilliman also a valid LOW option in an Imperial Knight detachment?
Seems like a great easy way to get guilliman into any list if you can bring him with "no tax" in the IK Detachment, legal?

Yes. See GS3 p. 118.
There is/will be a FAQ for the IK Household detachment, prohibiting the attempt to include Robby G there and end up in unit type trouble.

The Oathbound detachment has a rule that prevents it from being your primary detachment. Which means that Robby G can use it to be added on to an imperial list tax-free, but that he cannot be the warlord in that case. Which in turn is a waste, considering his great 12" Warlord trait bubble.

He can join a household just fine - so long as he is not nominated as the baron - its this special rule that creates the issues

Angels blade is a formation it requires specific units. Their is no LOW slot to put guilliman in so it doesn't work. now the flesh tears detatchment for babies does so he can go in that.

Essentially you have to have hq or low slot

Voldus is awesome but lacking EW and being T4 makes a 240 point investment hard to swallow. I'm curious what other army you would field him with.

Yes the option exists, but... who cares?

For the record I really like Voldus and I field him in my army. But, I don't play in hyper competitive metas. Also, I definitely put Endurance on him if he might even sniff combat, since we have a low AP meta.

Roboute is cool, but i'm not sure how to effectively field him just yet. If he had better warlord traits that would be a different story.

 Marmatag wrote:
Voldus is awesome but lacking EW and being T4 makes a 240 point investment hard to swallow. I'm curious what other army you would field him with.

Yes the option exists, but... who cares?

For the record I really like Voldus and I field him in my army. But, I don't play in hyper competitive metas. Also, I definitely put Endurance on him if he might even sniff combat, since we have a low AP meta.

Roboute is cool, but i'm not sure how to effectively field him just yet. If he had better warlord traits that would be a different story.

Taking him as a psychic beatstick seems a pretty good option. Rolling on Biomancy, you're pretty much garunteed to get a good buff for his CC build. Warp Speed and Iron Arm, Warp Speed and Endurance, Iron Arm and Endurance...
Plus, you can take him in an Inquisitorial Detachment for a free Warlord Trait if you don't care about the Primaris Power.
(For the record, the ideal is Warp Speed, Might of Heroes, and Fists of Lightning, for 10 attacks at I9 S10 Ap2 that cause bonus hits, but that requires crazy luck.)

It's not a BAD option but there are already better options....it would be like if they released a new wraith knight that cost 325 points but was basically the same. Would people take it? No, because the other wraith knight is cheaper.

Here the same principal applies. Draigo is a better tank. Normal GK librarains are cheaper and better for the WC/points ratio. If you want both in one package, then Voldus is situationally pretty ok, but I can't think of a reason why I'd field him over both of the other two options if I wanted both of those things, unless I just didn't care how good my list was.

With how many detachments people can have nowadays, the "no tax" concept really is pretty foreign at this point. Take a single strike squad (really not much of a tax with AP 3 force and turn 1 DS, which also unlocks as many Dreadknights as your heart desires) and you're set to go.

 luke1705 wrote:
It's not a BAD option but there are already better options....it would be like if they released a new wraith knight that cost 325 points but was basically the same. Would people take it? No, because the other wraith knight is cheaper.

Here the same principal applies. Draigo is a better tank. Normal GK librarains are cheaper and better for the WC/points ratio. If you want both in one package, then Voldus is situationally pretty ok, but I can't think of a reason why I'd field him over both of the other two options if I wanted both of those things, unless I just didn't care how good my list was.

With how many detachments people can have nowadays, the "no tax" concept really is pretty foreign at this point. Take a single strike squad (really not much of a tax with AP 3 force and turn 1 DS, which also unlocks as many Dreadknights as your heart desires) and you're set to go.

Small aside, but the 'No tax' wasn't my point. It's nice, but being an Inquisitorial Representative ALSO gives him his Warlord Trait, which was the larger draw.
How are normal librarians both Cheaper AND Better? They are better because they're cheaper, that's it. (Yes, one can take a relic to get better Sanctic powers, but that's one singular Librarian, and he still can't roll on the Librarius powers, so he's only better when fighting Daemons.)

Just two points:

1. Voldus can't roll on Biomancy. No Grey Knights can.

2. The Librarius argument may be a bit moot. Most major tournaments (like Nova) and local groups seem to allow GK's to roll on that tree.

Grabbing him as an Inquisitorial Representative is clever though. Hadn't thought of that.

Audustum wrote:
Just two points:

1. Voldus can't roll on Biomancy. No Grey Knights can.

2. The Librarius argument may be a bit moot. Most major tournaments (like Nova) and local groups seem to allow GK's to roll on that tree.

Grabbing him as an Inquisitorial Representative is clever though. Hadn't thought of that.

I... Derp. Did not notice that.
Okay, roll on Librarius, hoping for Might of Heroes, Veil of Time, and Null Zone. Might of Heroes still gives a buncha S10 I7 attacks, and he can buff up Melee deathstars nicely or nerf enemy ones. Not as good, though, I agree.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Say... Could Cypher get a Warlord Trait now?

He can't get Biomancy, but he CAN get Might of heroes. +2s,t,a,i. It is quite nice. He comes with a 4++ which you can't get with any other GK libby and that hammer is incredible. A GK libby with lv3, the book and a hammer is 165 points, so for 75 points +1 ws,bs,w,i, +2a, PE(chaos), a hammer that hits at I5, an Iron halo all the new psychic powers, and the ability to take him in any HQ slot. I personally am running him with rockfist and a group of hammernators in my wolf-wing detachment. With 4 sanctic rolls he turns all those 3++'s into 2++'s or with a roll on lib he makes them re roll those 2/3++'s.

when It comes down to it in that particular list, that 75 points would net an additional 2 terminators. His extra wound and attacks is the equivalent of the first and all the other gear is well worth the second.

As for tax, yes a strike squad is nice but pure points wise I just want that librarian. 110+165 is still more than voldus w/o all the other buffs.
On another note if they ever release a GK lib conclave I'll drop him like a rock.

When i said biomancy, i meant that i had another librarian put it on him.

Fact is, he's not super difficult to remove and he costs 240 points.

Hardly overpowered.