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Now that we've had a chance to check out all the kill teams rules ( https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/ShadowWar/SWA_Killteams_ENG.pdf ) which teams do you think made out the best with their rules? Who are the big losers?

I've played a few games so far.

Orks vs CSM
Orks vs IG
Orks vs Craftsworlders
Witches vs Necrons

Shooting is really powerful. I don't think that purely mellee lists are gona be all that viable. It's really hard to get to a shooty opponent enemy that's trying to avoid mellee.

However, it's neat to have at least someone mellee-capable. That's good for missions as you can get to a certain point and hide there denying ground. It seems to be more effective than overwatch. More risky at the same time. Another thing is that mellee fighters tend to be a bit less expensive.

Leadership and ini are very important there. Most games end with a failed bottle test. And initiative is needed to get up on your feet after getting hit.

Anywayz, from what i see there, shooty armies are in a good place and mellee armies wholly depend on terrain. Especially forces like witches and harlequins. If your gaming table can not provide cover for minimum 50% table space most of which can be blos, i don't think it's possible to be successful with a mellee army.

There is a thread about Harlequins in SWA.
Their melee appears to be extremely powerful. the thread was saying that they have won games without firing a single pistol shot.
But, that would be the Harlequins stat-line being wildly different to their enemies. A big gap in WS and I looks to have a big effect.

 Skinnereal wrote:
There is a thread about Harlequins in SWA.
Their melee appears to be extremely powerful. the thread was saying that they have won games without firing a single pistol shot.
But, that would be the Harlequins stat-line being wildly different to their enemies. A big gap in WS and I looks to have a big effect.

And i have to repeat myself. It depends on terrain A LOT. Also, don't forget that the further the campaing goes, the stronger shooting becomes cause shooting talents are very powerful and give straight performance bonuses.

Another thing about harlies is that they can't get pinned with non-high impact weapons. So, in this regard they can be good for starting games - especially with dense terrain tables. But they'll start to lag behind after 3-5 games. Well, at least witches will. It's kinda like mordheim when mellee is nice at start and than shooting is king. The moment gunner gets ignore cover or +1 bs, he's becoming almost twice as effective cause he's suddenly hitting on 5-s and 4-s instead of 6-s. And not many things other than harlies ignore pinning.

 koooaei wrote:

 Skinnereal wrote:
There is a thread about Harlequins in SWA.

And i have to repeat myself. It depends on terrain A LOT.

That is mentioned in the thread, they rely on that cover mod, as it is all they get.
LoS and speed are the big reasons that the Harly team worked at all.

Yeah, speed is a thing. I didn't manage to reach mellee with orks as they were simply too slow and couldn't escape pinning with i1-2. On the other hand, i had a bigshoota boy that alone killed 600 pts of chaos space marines, won a game vs ig early on and was killing eldar left and right - but i failed a ld9 bottle neck test and lost. Will probably need to thin down points on equipmenet and get a 9-th naked boy to avoid bottle neck tests for 2 casualties.

So, i think that, at least for orks, the best killteam is probably: 2 bigshoota boyz with lazer dots and...the rest is not that important - just a couple shootas here and there and 9 models total. Nob can do well with just a choppa cause he's quite killy with ws4, s5 and 4 attacks. Could be useful for a counter-charge. Not sure he even needs armor cause everything seems to ignore 4+ armor in mellee, yoffs and regular boyz can act as bullet catchers and his ini could really help the constantly pinned boyz to get up and not be dead weight.

Interesting. So Nids get the shaft again?

Nah Warriors are just straight nasty from what I hear...

No access to Jump Infantry?

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
No access to Jump Infantry?

CSM have a raptor as special operative. 16" charge and ignores terrain. IIRC he also causes fear which is very potent there.

CW Eldar get the Autarch as a special op, and it gets SH wings.
12" move in any direction, and 12" charge range.

I wonder why there's no Gargoyles...

We need Orks with Jump Packs.
Rokkitrash: Losers, beaten and downtrodden. The Rokkitrash are the lowest of the Boyz ranks, not strong enough to fight their way to the top, the Rokkitrash risk it all - strapping Rokkits to their backs in an effort to engage and fight the enemy before their stronger bretheren arrive.

Movement 6"
Charge 54"
When Rokkitrash make a charge roll a d6.
1-3 Blaze of Glory, put a small blast marker on the enemy for every three models in the Rokkitrash unit.
4-6 Successful charge.

I have only played Tau vs Guard (3 games) and it was pretty evenly matched. Lots of terrain. Really fun games.

The Guard heavy flamer is nasty! I only managed to get it into range one out of the three games but when I did I bbq'd everyone under the template. It was awesome.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
No access to Jump Infantry?

CSM has a Jump Pack equipment addition that treats all terrain as open ground.
Not exactly the same, but

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
I wonder why there's no Gargoyles...

We need Orks with Jump Packs.
Rokkitrash: Losers, beaten and downtrodden. The Rokkitrash are the lowest of the Boyz ranks, not strong enough to fight their way to the top, the Rokkitrash risk it all - strapping Rokkits to their backs in an effort to engage and fight the enemy before their stronger bretheren arrive.

Movement 6"
Charge 54"
When Rokkitrash make a charge roll a d6.
1-3 Blaze of Glory, put a small blast marker on the enemy for every three models in the Rokkitrash unit.
4-6 Successful charge.

Orks with jump packs? What a good idea. Strange how no-one has thought of that before...
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Ork-Stormboyz