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I have seen countless threads being posted, like, "Are tacticals being made redundant?" Or, "Will there be nothing but Primaris soon?" Or, "Am I the only one who thinks Primaris are going to take over?"
Yes Primaris Marines are a thing. Will GW eventually stop making normal Marines? Doubtful but possible in a few years.
AoS had the Stormcast come in but that hasn't dissolved the Empire.
I think the main thing to remember here is that the old kits will still be making GW money. If it's making them money, they won't get rid of them. If people stop buying the old kits and they aren't making money anymore from them, that's when they'll start getting rid of the least popular kits and slowly phase them out. So while you all still like normal Marines and keep buying them, they won't be going anywhere.

Did this really merit a new thread?

 Hollow wrote:
Did this really merit a new thread?

Hes adding to the countlessness

Although to be fair OP has a decent point- if you want to make sure existing kits that you have spent hours painting are still valid, keep buying the same kits.

Its like a ponzi scheme

I think so.

Now tell me how many new models has Empire gotten since the summer of 2015.



Oh...

 Tiberius501 wrote:
I have seen countless threads being posted, like, "Are tacticals being made redundant?" Or, "Will there be nothing but Primaris soon?" Or, "Am I the only one who thinks Primaris are going to take over?"
Yes Primaris Marines are a thing. Will GW eventually stop making normal Marines? Doubtful but possible in a few years.
AoS had the Stormcast come in but that hasn't dissolved the Empire.
I think the main thing to remember here is that the old kits will still be making GW money. If it's making them money, they won't get rid of them. If people stop buying the old kits and they aren't making money anymore from them, that's when they'll start getting rid of the least popular kits and slowly phase them out. So while you all still like normal Marines and keep buying them, they won't be going anywhere.

That's a terrible comparison. AoS has ended the Empire and the entire universe of Fantasy. For example my army no longer exists in lore, available models or ability to play most of the time.

None of that fits any of 8th.

Haha fair enough guys

Only someone totally ignorant of how GW works would think that the Primaris aren't meant as a replacement. However, said replacement isn't going to be overnight so there's no reason to think the sky is falling. However, mark my words in the next few years the old style Marines in one way or another will be phased out; it might only be the models however.

My hypothesis: this storyline will play out with the Primaris being destroyed somehow. I'm suspicious of Cawl suddenly being Mr. Imperium and I think it'd be cool if he turns out to be a sleeper agent (Void Dragon anyone?). Regardless, we'll be back to regular Marines, but they'll be at the scale of Primaris going forward. Hopefully we'll get kits of the older marks of armor at truescale at that point.

Man was really hoping for a little mini primarus heresy with a lot of push back

hopefully there may be a little fluff on it.

as for the old line. i wouldnt mind it going away but being revamped to not looking like squat marines.

We probably need a sticky thread to curb the amount of "OMG normal marines are going to be obsoletededededed!!!!11!!!one!!! that are appearing. Given the amount of space marine this that and the other over the years, I highly doubt that regular marines are going anywhere soon. Yes, while many of the WHFB models went OOP when AoS hit, notice how all of the End Times models are still around? Tomb kings are gone, but hey, morghast are still a thing. A better analogy from Empire/Stormcast = marines/primaris might be black orcs vs Ironjaw brutes. Same faction, one's bigger and more elite, but the black orc still has a place.

Stormcast are space marines in fantasy, and primaris are stormcast in space. It does feel like primaris are going to be marines +0.5 rather than +1. The new troops are not much more than stormcast in space with the option to allow people to play true-scale marines if that ever was a thing. Replacing the ENTIRE space marine line including: Dark Angels, Blood Angels, Space Wolves, Templars, LoTD, DeathWatch and Grey Knights is a little too hard to believe. Does the Ynnari faction invalidate and replace all three Eldar factions? Do GSC invalidate nids? Oh and bear in mind that TACTICAL MARINES OUTSOLD WARHAMMER FANTASY BATTLES. Let's nuke that single product line that makes us so much money. Haha, business! One also might ask when did space marines get a new kit, be it for tacs, devs, assaults, a vehicle, etc.

Adding into this is the lore- primaris hit the scene in late M41, given so much of the setting can be played from M32-current, primaris would be odd in the same way as having tau fighting in M33 with their newest mechas.


In summary: No, primaris aren't going to make all marines obsolete but we may see a bit more scale creep to put regular marines close to their size. Primaris are the stormcast of the 41st millennium.

another thing to consider is how carefully GW has gone out of their way to ensure that Primaris units don't obselete Space Marine units. there is still a reason to take tac squads over intercessor squds, devestator squads over hellblast squads etc.

BrianDavion wrote:
another thing to consider is how carefully GW has gone out of their way to ensure that Primaris units don't obselete Space Marine units. there is still a reason to take tac squads over intercessor squds, devestator squads over hellblast squads etc.

Not to wear the "no-hat", but look at it from a business perspective.

If they just launched a new model range of normal marines (without different names and rules), like they have done several times in the past 30 years, players would just keep their current army and not buy new models.

If they obsoleted the old marines by making primaris marines clearly superior they would run the risk of a large portion of the dedicated players would reject 8th and continue playing older editions (might even go backwards and pick the best "legacy edition").

Either way, they would not sell a lot of new models to existing players. Leaving their model sale completely up to new player acquisition, which is damn hard these days.

Now, on the flipside, if they did make the primaris marines equal at first, players would adopt them, weave them into existing armies and new players might start their collection with the new models instead of ebay'ing a used collection. Then once the codixes come out, primaris marines will get more lovin' and be positioned as the true replacement of the old model ranges. Not because of lore or thematic evolution, but purely because GW want to sell more models to the existing players.

With the "yes-hat" on: New models with new unit types encourage players to expand their armies with more variety. Expansions of armies earn GW money. Another large reason is royalties, "space marine" is not a trademarkable term. GW pretty much got twarted in 2013 trying to defend their IP. Seems like a realistic timeline that now 4 years later they are executing on their decision to just re-brand to "primaris space marines" as that can be protected. I would not be surprised if when the codex comes out they are renamed to "primaris marines" (kill off the space part). The eldar went through a similar identity change, likely for the same reason.

Tacticals have been redundant since 6th - 8th is honestly the best they've been in nearly a decade, most Primaris Marine units available sit somewhere between Tacticals, Devastators and Terminators but not really excelling at any particular role.

Inceptors are the only ones I've been impressed by.

Just dont buy Primaris marines, and instead buy the normal kits

Until primaris marines can take specials and heavies, ride in transports, or take close combat weapons, I don't see them getting much play.

 Bludbaff wrote:
My hypothesis: this storyline will play out with the Primaris being destroyed somehow. I'm suspicious of Cawl suddenly being Mr. Imperium and I think it'd be cool if he turns out to be a sleeper agent (Void Dragon anyone?). Regardless, we'll be back to regular Marines, but they'll be at the scale of Primaris going forward. Hopefully we'll get kits of the older marks of armor at truescale at that point.

So Primaris are like Terminators (the Schwarzenegger kind, not the 2+ kind)? No, wait. I'm going with Screamers on this one. Head cannon accepted!

 Marmatag wrote:
Until primaris marines can take specials and heavies, ride in transports, or take close combat weapons, I don't see them getting much play.

A new unit of Primaris was just revealed, and they have a bolt pistol and close combat weapon. The captain and lieutenants all have close combat weapons. The other models all have bolt pistols, so they can shoot and fight in close combat. Their grav tank transport was revealed a couple weeks ago. Everything we have seen so far makes the Primaris look like a complete army.

This is the new way that GW will roll out a new faction: In dribbles, with the rules included in the box. Codex to follow at some point in the future.

To the OP: My Space Marines might be safe NOW, but give GW a couple more years and I bet it'll be just Space Marines that look like Primaris models. Won't happen in 8th ed, but the phase out will start and will probably conclude by 10th ed, which is what, 5-6 years from now? When units start disappearing from the GW Online Store, that'll be the signal that it has started.

Hardly a complete army. Maybe a mini army like elf clowns or stealer cults, but it doesn't compare to most xenos armies, let alone the big boys like real marines or guard.

 Tamwulf wrote:

 Marmatag wrote:
Until primaris marines can take specials and heavies, ride in transports, or take close combat weapons, I don't see them getting much play.

A new unit of Primaris was just revealed, and they have a bolt pistol and close combat weapon. The captain and lieutenants all have close combat weapons. The other models all have bolt pistols, so they can shoot and fight in close combat. Their grav tank transport was revealed a couple weeks ago. Everything we have seen so far makes the Primaris look like a complete army.

This is the new way that GW will roll out a new faction: In dribbles, with the rules included in the box. Codex to follow at some point in the future.

To the OP: My Space Marines might be safe NOW, but give GW a couple more years and I bet it'll be just Space Marines that look like Primaris models. Won't happen in 8th ed, but the phase out will start and will probably conclude by 10th ed, which is what, 5-6 years from now? When units start disappearing from the GW Online Store, that'll be the signal that it has started.

Yes I saw the reavers.

But that doesn't help the Intecessor squads, which are 100 points for 5 souped up Necrons without RP.
It doesn't help the Inceptor squads, which are overpriced to the max, over 70 ppm for 6 heavy bolter shots.
It doesn't help the Captain in Gravis armor, who is massively expensive and provides far less utility than a jump pack captain.

The one, *one* thing so far that's primaris that i'd take, are the Lieutenants, for the fact that (a) they're a cheap HQ and (b) they let you reroll wound rolls of 1, which is a rare and amazing ability for how cheap they are.

So yeah, you could take 3 Reavers with their (most likely) power sword and pistol, and stuff them in a Repulsor after it comes out, but why? I guarantee you there are more cost effective options out there.

Primaris marines try to be survivable in an edition where everything dies fast. The age of the glass cannon is here, and slow 2wound Necrons without RP aren't replacing anyone.

 Bludbaff wrote:
My hypothesis: this storyline will play out with the Primaris being destroyed somehow. I'm suspicious of Cawl suddenly being Mr. Imperium and I think it'd be cool if he turns out to be a sleeper agent (Void Dragon anyone?). Regardless, we'll be back to regular Marines, but they'll be at the scale of Primaris going forward. Hopefully we'll get kits of the older marks of armor at truescale at that point.

Wouldn't it be out of character if Cawl just gave out his designs for the primaris stuff for the FWs to craft? I certainly don't see him single handedly pumping out the numbers to replace the chapters with entirely primaris marines.

Not only that, the marines themselves aren't even accepted as "not filthy heresy" by all the chapters yet. There are so many story reasons they would/could not phase out the current.

MrPyro wrote:

 Bludbaff wrote:
My hypothesis: this storyline will play out with the Primaris being destroyed somehow. I'm suspicious of Cawl suddenly being Mr. Imperium and I think it'd be cool if he turns out to be a sleeper agent (Void Dragon anyone?). Regardless, we'll be back to regular Marines, but they'll be at the scale of Primaris going forward. Hopefully we'll get kits of the older marks of armor at truescale at that point.

Wouldn't it be out of character if Cawl just gave out his designs for the primaris stuff for the FWs to craft? I certainly don't see him single handedly pumping out the numbers to replace the chapters with entirely primaris marines.

Not only that, the marines themselves aren't even accepted as "not filthy heresy" by all the chapters yet. There are so many story reasons they would/could not phase out the current.

And all it takes is out SPIRITUAL LIEGE to declare them Heretics. With the Ward era "Successors all suck on the Ultramarine's nads" fluff still in effect, the handful of chapters who refuse will be trivially wiped out.

GW wont be phasing out Space Marines entries, codexes, armies, etc...

But they have laid the (fluff & modeling) ground work for people to make SM armies with Primaris models and call them (true scale) Space Marines. So, yes, in one sense I think this is the end of the line for SM models, but not Space Marines as an army choice.

I've seen it before my friend. I went from Rogue Trader era marines to the new and shiny better models several times as the years went on.... Same is gonna happen. It's all about upgrading to the newer better thing.

The writing is clearly on the wall.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The beauty of this is that you can run them as either Space Marines OR Primaris. GW is clever.

I think the existing SM kits are likely to see more promotion in assosciation with Horus Heresy and less promotion in assosciation with 40K. Notable that the last release was Deathwatch; it took the form of upgrade frames, largely forward-compatible with Primaris, and also note that the Corvus Deathstar is not forbidden from carrying Primaris.

A lot has been invested in a lot of power armour plastic mounds, and it'd be bad economics to just dump it all, especially with demand for another bunch of HH foxes with new plastic marks of PA. But if I were GW and I wanted to launch one last new SM army before Power Armour was gradually but persistently replaced by Primaris in 'modern era' games and new releases, I'd do exactly what was done with the Deathwatch.

I'm just wondering what's going to happen with Chaos. Already got a releanched major Legion well committed to maintaining their scale...

Regular marine models will always be interchangable with Primaris Marines I think, however there will come a time where GW stops making new rules for regular marines and all new rules are Primaris-only.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Regular marine models will always be interchangable with Primaris Marines I think, however there will come a time where GW stops making new rules for regular marines and all new rules are Primaris-only.

it is inevitable. Which is why I don't want to buy any more Deathwatch. I'll wait until they do them in Primaris even if it takes like 6 years. Although I hope they get to them sooner than that. Also they better include a Blood Raven pauldron on the default sprue and not in the board game models only. That was a lame move GW.

I wish I had nothing but those bald and foolish blood ravens. I'll just have to settle for naming every scout Cyrus. THE CYRUS CANNOT BE KILLED.