Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello ladies and gents.

Well I have a simple question for you all tonight and any answer would be loved please and thank you.

My wife went to work the other day, where her friend showed her, her new puppy that she bought from her sister, it was a pitbull. Needless to say she came home saying she wants a pitbull or a baby now..... well the prospects of making a baby sound nice the long term effects of a 3rd child are horrible.

So we now have 2 pit bull puppies on there way, they will be ready in 1 week. So I dealt with dogs from hounds, terries, labs and such but never a bull. Does anyone have any suggestions? harness will be enough or no? free range dogs are a no go I think?

Any advice would be loved thank you for your time.

Free range dogs are a terrible idea, unless you want your neighbours to hate you because your dogs are constantly gaking on their lawn. Also letting dogs that were bred for violence off the leash is asking for trouble, I don't care how much you say "he would never hurt anyone", all it takes is one kid getting bitten and you're fethed.

Socialize them ASAP. Even if they haven't had all their shots yet and the vet says no. By the time the vet says yes it may be too late to get them comfortable around other dogs, cats and maybe even people. It's a lot harder to fix an older dog who isn't socialized, especially a pit bull.

The harness was not enough for my pit bull. Neither was a choke chain. His neck is thick with muscle and he would pull us around and off our feet. We had to use a pinch collar to get him to stop.

He is super sweet with our son, and with most kids, but he is a 60 dog who still thinks he's a lap dog, so we can't trust him around strangers off leash. He has knocked plenty of people over by jumping or barging into them.

Get them trained early. They are very smart and sweet and just want to know what to do to make you happy. Show them good from bad and they will enjoy doing what you want.
My girl walks on a harness (choke chains are cruel, I'd never subject a dog to something I couldn't wear myself.) and listens well. Train them to listen to you no matter the distraction. Use rewards, they do not respond well to punishment. Enough of that and they decide to mete out their own eventually. Work with them everyday with voice commands and hand signals. As much routine as possible is good too. Reward them with treats and lap time cuddles. If our girl is bad we don't let her onto our bed with us. She can't stand it.

I know people are going to gak on me for this, but I have a problem with pitbulls. Actually, I have a problem with people that raise pitbulls.

The dog breed itself is not necessarily more prone to violence. However, this breed is a statistical outlier when it comes to who owns them. The chances of getting one from someone that treats dogs bad is relatively high, which raises the chance of a future violent outburst.

Now, if you can get one from a known source and trust the person, more power to you.

 cuda1179 wrote:
I know people are going to gak on me for this, but I have a problem with pitbulls. Actually, I have a problem with people that raise pitbulls.

The dog breed itself is not necessarily more prone to violence. However, this breed is a statistical outlier when it comes to who owns them. The chances of getting one from someone that treats dogs bad is relatively high, which raises the chance of a future violent outburst.

Now, if you can get one from a known source and trust the person, more power to you.

This is true, a lot of people who breed pitbulls breed them in a way that nurtures a certain violent streak. My friend has a pitbull and it can never leave the house because even if the mailman comes up to the door it gets aggressive. Granted...he did buy it from some random dude in compton. Pit bulls are adorable as puppies, like most dogs are...i've never owned a dog because to me they are too much like having an actual child... like halfway to the real thing.

I do have two rescue pitbull at home. They aren't different than any other dogs. Give them a consistent discipline and exercise regime. Socialise them early with other dogs and humans. You don't need a harness or any specialised tool if you simply teach them how to walk on a leash and greet people politely. Make sure to sterilise them as soon as possible unless you intend to breed them.

Your "free range dog" is my "dog shot by a farmer for harassing livestock".

My first dog was a pit bull mix, and he was a great, super sweet dog, but he was very strong and needed a lot of exercise. I wouldn't suggest them for someone that doesn't have time to stay on top of them.

So, not to much difference then a regular dog. I checked out those collars and they look abusive as oh hell. Why are the spikes on the inside.

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Free range dogs are a terrible idea, unless you want your neighbours to hate you because your dogs are constantly gaking on their lawn. Also letting dogs that were bred for violence off the leash is asking for trouble, I don't care how much you say "he would never hurt anyone", all it takes is one kid getting bitten and you're fethed.

If you "free range" a pitbull someone like me is going to shoot it with a shotgun and then point the shotgun at your face when you freak out. Pit bulls are predatory killing animals when not raised properly and this is about the stupidest idea I've heard since someone thought it would be a good idea for Trump to run for President.

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
Get them trained early. They are very smart and sweet and just want to know what to do to make you happy. Show them good from bad and they will enjoy doing what you want.
My girl walks on a harness (choke chains are cruel, I'd never subject a dog to something I couldn't wear myself.) and listens well. Train them to listen to you no matter the distraction. Use rewards, they do not respond well to punishment. Enough of that and they decide to mete out their own eventually. Work with them everyday with voice commands and hand signals. As much routine as possible is good too. Reward them with treats and lap time cuddles. If our girl is bad we don't let her onto our bed with us. She can't stand it.

That is the key - at our old apartment, one of the neighbors had a pitbull* - really freaking smart dog, really freaking sweet.

She once broke into our apartment.

On the second floor.

Going from the ground, to a trash can, to a roof, and then in through a window,

Then curled up to sleep on our couch while the cats hid. (The window that she came in through was right above our bed - she had to wander across our bed - but she curled up on the couch instead of the bed.)

Twitchy with energy, but full of love, that dog.

The Auld Grump

* Technically, a Staffordshire Terrier. Pitbull is used as a bit of a catchall in the US.

There are only two kinds of people who own attack dogs.

People who get off on terrorizing others.

And delusional people who want to prove they can beat nature with nurture.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
There are only two kinds of people who own attack dogs.

People who get off on terrorizing others.

And delusional people who want to prove they can beat nature with nurture.

Or people like me and my wife who wanted a puppy found some who have cute faces and got some lol.

Besides the normal socialization of them, find ways to keep them busy. The saying a good dog is a tired dog is true because tired dog that has constructive playtime/work is less likely to get in trouble. Granted this means you have to have time for this, but that is part of owning a dog. Pitts can be great dogs for therapy work. Also if you can find a place where you can do agility courses they will like that and do well.
Per the Auldgrump's story they are expert climbers, I have seen them climb trees after squirrels so be aware of that. The fact you have two will help keep them from being less lonely and bored which is good.
Be aware that they have a bad rap and people will be afraid of your dogs, but give them love, consistent discipline, and ways for them to constructively burn their energy and you will be rewarded with two sweet, loyal, and silly dogs.

OgreChubbs wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
And delusional people who want to prove they can beat nature with nurture.

Or people like me and my wife who wanted a puppy found some who have cute faces and got some lol.

You're wife has already shown the first step in being an irresponsible dog owner by getting a dog with a spur of the moment decision. Dogs are like kids they take a lot of time and attention and far too many people don't understand the commitment which is why shelters are full of abandoned animals. A lot of people think dogs will be great until they have to deal with the mess , the time required to put in with them and find out that they are already overloaded due to having kids and then the dogs suffer for attention or don't get the proper training which is absolutely critical when dealing with a strong and energetic breed like a pit. They are wonderful animals if you take the time to raise them right, but that's something that a spur of the moment owner isn't ready for. You've already said more children would be difficult, you have to take into consideration that a dog is essentially another child and if not cared for properly can end up seriously hurting other people or your family.

Pits need a lot of stimulation and activity so that means playing with them and walking them a lot, it seems cute when they are puppies in the summer but when they are a full grown pulling machine trying to drag you through the rain, snow, or ice multiple times every day during the winter that part gets old fast and the dog suffers because people get lazy and don't want to put the required physical energy into raising them. Aggression does run in their breed and making sure they have enough activity is critical in helping prevent that, they are a very intelligent breed and you need to help them fight that boredom with activity or they will end up finding other outlets like chewing or turning aggressive.

Getting a dog simply to fill the oh so cute impulse is a terrible idea and one that countless gakky dog owners have committed. So the best suggestion is to get some books on training especially involving pits and then get ready to be spending a gak load of time with the dogs, doubled because she wants a pair. Despite all her insistence that she'll take care of the dogs and put in equal time You will be the one walking them everyday while your wife simply ooh and awws over how cute they are, then when they are grown and no longer as cute she's going to constantly complain about the mess they create, how they wreck everything, and how huge they are and then there's all the bills for the vets. (first year alone is going to cost around 1k per dog). Adorable puppies are just for a couple months, an adult dog is very different reality that lasts for years.

I'm not hating on dogs, I love them but having lived my entire life owning them they are a very big responsibility that most people don't understand until they have one, pits are not a good breed to have as a family's "starter dog". The pounds are always full, not of strays but because so many people get a dog then realize it's not what they thought it'd be and dump them there and most end up being destroyed. It's totally unfair to the animals simply because somebody thought they'd be "cute". Just like raising kids you have to decide if you can give them a proper home before you commit to getting them, you also have to decide if you are getting it for the right reasons, "because it's cute" is the worst possible justification as it's the mantra for gakky dog owners everywhere.

Warning: May contain offensive language.

Be on top of the training and socialization and it will be fine. If the puppy displays any violent behavior, use some negative reinforcement to make sure it knows that is a big no no, and reward good behavior. Thats one of the big mistakes people make with all animals, not just dogs. It's cute when a little puppy runs up barking and gnaws on your leg, but if you don't say he can't do that then he'll think its ok to do when he's big and can actually hurt you. Basically think of any of the puppy's behavior from the point of view "what would this be like when he's big?" If the answer is that it would be destructive, then you need to train against that behavior. Trained a few cows and pigs this way. It's all fun and games when a little calf or piglet runs up and wants to rough house, it's not fun when the animal weighs a half ton. Same with a dog.

And yeah, I have to say getting a dog "because it's cute" is generally a bad idea. It would be a little better to fill that void with a smaller dog if you must. Something like a Boston terrier would be better since it would be smaller and stay cute, and wouldn't be as dangerous.

 Grey Templar wrote:

And yeah, I have to say getting a dog "because it's cute" is generally a bad idea

And getting two is an even worse idea.

OgreChubbs wrote:
So, not to much difference then a regular dog. I checked out those collars and they look abusive as oh hell. Why are the spikes on the inside.

They are supposed to create a "nip" for correction when sharply tugged and lie flat (flattish) otherwise. We have had four rescue dogs and never had to use anything other than a normal collar until we had this dog. Over the phone, they told us he was a Lab-Pointer mix, but when we arrived we saw he looked a lot like a pit bull. (Later on, the vet confirmed he was likely mostly or even full pitbull.) We had adopted an energetic dog before (a border collie), but we didn't realize how dog aggressive our new dog was until we brought him home and started training him. Big dogs he'll mostly ignore, but our neighborhood has a lot of free range chihuahuas, and our pit dragged my wife quite a distance chasing after one. He managed to knock me down and run into traffic one time (he was fine), and that's when we realized we needed some way to stop him. The harness just made it easier for him to pull. Choke chain didn't correct his behavior at all. A quick correction with the pinch collar stops him before his lunge becomes a strength test. He will walk next to me, unless I tell him to go sniff, and behave perfectly well, but the moment he sees a cat or toy dog, he still loses it.

We had hired a professional trainer to work with us in the past, but didn't see much progress. We would like to hire one who can help our dog but don't know which method will yield results. I welcome any suggestions on the issue.


And I can confirm the tree climbing bit. He almost Man's Best Friended a lizard basking on a branch 7 feet up.

Whatever you do, make sure you name if Miami.

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Free range dogs are a terrible idea

Exactly. If you want to have a free ranging pet get yourself a cat.

1) take the puppies to a PROFESSIONAL dog trainer for obedience classes...wife,kids,and you should all train the dogs ( if the kids are old enough)
2) let people play with the pups socialize those critters
3) exercise is key, tired dog is a good dog..walk, chasing a ball, playing at dog park, swimming in a pond or creek...tire the buggers out
4) join a dog club if possible, many dog clubs have fly ball teams, dog show groups, lure courses, etc etc...good way to tire the dogs out and socialize them...plus learn tips from dog people

jouso wrote:

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Free range dogs are a terrible idea

Exactly. If you want to have a free ranging pet get yourself a cat.

Don't do that either, actually. They're fuzzy little serial killers, and you'd be setting yourself up for heartbreak when it gets hit by a car or grabbed by a fox or something.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Socialize them ASAP. Even if they haven't had all their shots yet and the vet says no. By the time the vet says yes it may be too late to get them comfortable around other dogs, cats and maybe even people. It's a lot harder to fix an older dog who isn't socialized,

Oh goodness yes

i have two rescues that are like 10+ years old and they are NOT good with other doogs or people.

 Spinner wrote:

jouso wrote:

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Free range dogs are a terrible idea

Exactly. If you want to have a free ranging pet get yourself a cat.

Don't do that either, actually. They're fuzzy little serial killers, and you'd be setting yourself up for heartbreak when it gets hit by a car or grabbed by a fox or something.

Maybe if you're getting a fancy posh breed. All three of my cats are from the street and have scared off foxes, dogs and assorted vermin and they're good enough at hiding from bigger threats. They form a clan of sorts and I've seen them working together to establish sovereignty over feral toms trying to get too close to them (they're all neutered females).

According to my vet, 99% of cats ran over are either males in heat (you know what hormones do to your brain) or sick individuals. Cats can plan for traffic and will see and hear incoming vehicles.

I've left them for up to 10 days on their own with a food and water dispenser and it's been OK every time, and the oldest is turning 9 sometime this year.

jouso wrote:

 Spinner wrote:

jouso wrote:

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Free range dogs are a terrible idea

Exactly. If you want to have a free ranging pet get yourself a cat.

Don't do that either, actually. They're fuzzy little serial killers, and you'd be setting yourself up for heartbreak when it gets hit by a car or grabbed by a fox or something.

Maybe if you're getting a fancy posh breed. All three of my cats are from the street and have scared off foxes, dogs and assorted vermin and they're good enough at hiding from bigger threats. They form a clan of sorts and I've seen them working together to establish sovereignty over feral toms trying to get too close to them (they're all neutered females).

According to my vet, 99% of cats ran over are either males in heat (you know what hormones do to your brain) or sick individuals. Cats can plan for traffic and will see and hear incoming vehicles.

I've left them for up to 10 days on their own with a food and water dispenser and it's been OK every time, and the oldest is turning 9 sometime this year.

Agreed. Cats superior all other pets inferior.

I dont see how a roaming gang of cats is really your pet.

Dogo life.

 Spinner wrote:

jouso wrote:

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Free range dogs are a terrible idea

Exactly. If you want to have a free ranging pet get yourself a cat.

Don't do that either, actually. They're fuzzy little serial killers, and you'd be setting yourself up for heartbreak when it gets hit by a car or grabbed by a fox or something.

As mentioned, that's not really the case. A healthy cat will avoid most trouble. And if its a larger cat it can even chase off some predators. And anything that it can't fight off they can run away from. Cats are quite wily and can take care of themselves as long as they aren't sick or old and have plenty of places to run. So just once the cat starts aging you can start keeping it inside.

As for being serial killers, that's a good thing. Keeps the vermin population down.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Desubot wrote:
I dont see how a roaming gang of cats is really your pet.

Dogo life.

See, with a cat you can have mutual respect and a dignified relationship. Dogs are slavering morons with no dignity.

Maybe you guys have had better luck with outdoor cats than I have, or maybe people just drive more carefully where you are. I've lost a few childhood pets - just your average tabby from a neighbor's litter, nothing particularly fancy or delicate, all neutered - to predators and vehicles. My current cat isn't setting foot outside if I can help it. The cat has to be lucky/quick every time - the hungry coyote only has to be lucky once. They're pretty Wile E - er, bright - themselves.

Of course, she's blind, so that factors into the decision as well.

As for the serial killing - they don't just go after mice and squirrels or what have you, they'll do a number on basically anything they can get their claws on. Cats are totally capable of decimating local bird populations. It's actually quite a problem.

 Spinner wrote:
As for the serial killing - they don't just go after mice and squirrels or what have you, they'll do a number on basically anything they can get their claws on. Cats are totally capable of decimating local bird populations. It's actually quite a problem.

Exactly so. Cats that still have their hunting instincts will kill stuff that's too small or weak to escape, no matter what it is. And as they're fed pets they don't really need it for food either so you might find dead critters in surprising places, or pick up some extra crows, rooks or other opportunistic birds that find your neighborhood an interesting place to be thanks to free food being left lying around.