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Hi Dakka,

any chance of a quick critique of this list I've come up with for a casual 1k game. Potential opponents would be either Guard / Genestealer Cults or Tyranids

Plan would be for the farseer to jump in the serpent with the wraithguard and use the warlock in amongst the 3 units of avengers. The Hemlock would be my main unit for dealing with threats until the wraithguard pop out

thanks


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [47 PL, 1000pts] ++

+ HQ +

Farseer [6 PL, 113pts]: 1. Guide, 2. Doom, Witchblade

Warlock [3 PL, 37pts]: 1. Conceal/Reveal, Witchblade

+ Troops +

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 82pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Shuriken Pistol & Diresword

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 82pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Shuriken Pistol & Power Glaive

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 92pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Two Avenger Shuriken Catapults

+ Elites +

Wraithguard [10 PL, 200pts]: Wraithcannon, 5x Wraithguard

+ Flyer +

Hemlock Wraithfighter [10 PL, 221pts]: 1. Conceal/Reveal, Spirit Stones

+ Dedicated Transport +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 173pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Star Engines, Twin Shuriken Cannon, Vectored Engines

++ Total: [47 PL, 1000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe

Dire avengers are overpriced currently.

You could run 3x10 guardians instead. They are fine in this edition.

Also consider d-scythes over wraithcannons. Both are good choices tho.

I'd probably keep the farseer on foot. So can throw out psychic the whole time.

+1 to Wyldcarde's feedback. D-scythes are almost as good as Wraithcannons against vehicles/monsters and much better against infantry. Their overwatch is fearsome and they can Advance and shoot without penalty since they auto-hit.

Thanks for the feedback,

valid feedback. Unfortunately i only own 1 squad of guardians so the dire avengers will have to do for now.

I could drop some of the upgrades on the Exarchs and on the serpent and switch the wraithcannons to D-Scythes i guess.

My other option is dropping the farseer altogether and getting a Spiritseer to accompany the wraithguard?

If you have 10 Guardians, then one option you could do is run 2x 10 Guardians using 5 Dire Avengers models in each unit.
Just have them be in the back of the unit and take them off as you take casualties. The models are close enough in appearance that no one will care.

Another way you can save points is by paying the correct points for the Hemlock, which is 211, not 221.
Hemlocks have an ability called "Spirit stones", they do not actually have the wargear option "Spirit stones" so why would you pay 10pts extra?

And you cannot quote the Index: Imperium 1 FAQ as that only applies to Index: Imperium 1. GW has had 2 chances so far to clarify if Spirit Stones on Hemlocks or Force Shield on Autarchs are meant to paid for as wargear, but they have not.
Therefore the rules as written dictate that those items are abilities and not wargear. You pay for wargear, but abilities are built into the cost of the model. I fully believe this was intentional for Autarchs & Hemlocks

-

Actually you do have to pay for the spirit stones and forceshield: https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1851315258522438&id=1575682476085719

DSToast wrote:
Actually you do have to pay for the spirit stones and forceshield: https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1851315258522438&id=1575682476085719

The link you posted said basically what I just said. "1.If it has a points value in the points section, yes you do. If it's an inherent ability on the model, no you don't."
Hemlocks do not have "wargear - Spirit stones" which indeed do have points listed. They need to be listed in their wargear section on their datasheet, but they are not.
Hemlocks have an ability called "Spirit stones" which according to what you posted, is an inherent ability on the model, so you do not pay for them.

This could easily change in an Errata, but until it does (and GW has had 2 chances to do so thus far), rules as written AND rules as intended = Stones do not cost on Hemlocks

-

"If it has a points value in the points section, yes you do"

That is clear. Forceshield and Spirit Stones have a points value, therefore you pay for them. That is rules as written, not an interpretation, but if you want extra interpretation as support... There is not a single unit that has a forceshield listed as an option in their wargear section, and yet it has a point cost in the index. If they did not intend for you to pay for it, by virtue of it being an inherent ability, why give it a cost at all?

Wraithblades have a force feild for a 5++ that you have to pay for, and spirit stones are on the vehicle equipment list i thought.

Ah good call, wraithaxes do use forceshields. So that anecdote is out but a GW employee still clear stated, if it has point, you pay the points.

but a GW employee still clear stated,

Warning! Extreme SARCASM to follow. Read at your own risk!



A local GW employee said, "All <insert your favorite unit here> cost ten points less than stated!"

Yay! for my favorite unit. I can now field hundreds of them.

Hey, local GW employee can you email/instant message/facebook/etc. that ruling to me so it's in writing? Great thanks!

Yay! Again for me!



Now I'd like to apologize for the sarcasm. (Maybe not. I'm not sure yet.)

Although I am sure I was just labeled a "Troll", amongst a great many other things, that I can assure I've been called worse than.

However my point is this; until the ruling is printed in an FAQ or designers notes update, we are clearly shown how to tally points. We have to pay points for everything listed in the wargear section of the datasheet, or it's substitute counterpart. If it's not listed in the wargear, then you don't have to pay for it as it may just be an ability that the unit has.

Also, just because a GW employee "said so", even in writing, doesn't make it an official ruling until it's been ratified by an FAQ, etc.

I've had plenty of discussions with GW employees over the years and typically about half the rulings that they made were overturned when the next FAQ dropped.

So RAW you pay for wargear not abilities.

Once again, forgive the sarcasm, but please understand where I'm coming from.

Thanks and have a great day!

Lol, as for raw and rai of shimmersheild its in the rulebook under wargear for the dire avenger exarch load out. I had to go look for myself, no freebies there to be had.

The ability is for the item unless you can show otherwise.

I don't know. If I were a tournament organizer, I would go with what the official 40k facebook page said rather than someone's personal interpretation of the rules. I know that employees can be wrong, saw one at a tournament, but I hope that they have someone in the know who is making these kind of rulings on the FB page.

This won't be settled until an FAQ brings it up or we get a codex, but I would personally air on the side of caution and say you have to add the cost.

vaurapung wrote:
Lol, as for raw and rai of shimmersheild its in the rulebook under wargear for the dire avenger exarch load out. I had to go look for myself, no freebies there to be had.

The ability is for the item unless you can show otherwise.

Yeah, I never assumed the Forceshield was free on the Wraithblades. It is for the Autarch though, just as an Iron Halo is free to a Space Marine Captain. Not listed under wargear just under the abilities notes.

An example of this is the Space Marine Librarian. Under his abilities it states Psychic Hood. It is not listed under his wargear and there is no option to purchase one.
However listed under the Space Wolf Rune Priest datasheet, the Psychic Hood is listed under abilites and under wargear "options" that you "may" purchase as extra.
When you look at the base points costs of these two units. The Space Marine Librarian has already clearly had the cost of the Psychic Hood included in his cost (hence no option to purchase it) while the Rune Priest hasn't (ie. the "option" to purchase one even though it's listed under abilities, he's only able to use it when equipped with it).
All that being said, if you have to pay for things listed under abilities then all SM: Librarians just went up 26pts apiece as that's the points cost for a Psychic hood listed under the SW: Wargear section. So as far as reasoning things out that's alot to consider when we're talking about Wargear vs. Abilities.

Anyway, I was more or less referencing the Spirit Stones on the Wraithfighter.

I haven't used one yet (later this week maybe) and will probably err on the side of caution when I do and add the ten points to it's cost.

However, I still stand by my opinion that until it's been FAQ'd; I wouldn't have a problem with someone building it without paying for the Spirit Stones as they're not actually listed under it's wargear, and as was pointed out they've had two rounds of FAQs to update it and haven't.


I digress, as to the OP's list:

I'll add +1 to what Wyldecarde suggested, and second what Galef said about throwing the Dire Avengers into the Guardian Squads to get the numbers up and use them instead. Dire Avengers are truly rubbish this edition.

Good Luck!