Progenoid glands?

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**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

How do?

So as we know, when a Marine snuffs it, an Apothercary will aim to recover his two Progenoid Glands to ensure the future of the Chapter.

But it also mentions mature Progenoid can be extracted without any deleterious effect on the Marine himself.

However, so far as I'm aware, it's not covered in the background whether or not a Marine's body can replace lost Progenoid Glamds following their harvest?

Can anyone shine a light on this, with references. Been bugging me for a while!

**MechaEmperor7000**

There's one Progenoid Gland located lower in the body that matures faster, presumably because it's closer to the organs it's trying to duplicate the gene-patterns of. The other one (located in the throat) takes a lot longer to mature. I remember reading that traditionally the one in the torso is harvested out of combat, as it would mature enough. The one in the throat takes longer and presumably usually marines are sent off to deployment before it is ready to be extracted. This is the one that's often extracted in the battlefield.

As far as I know, Marines can't create new progenoid glands after harvesting, so all of the ones that the Apothecary harvests are just the ones they didn't take yet. Presumably the one in the throat would require surgery that would put the marine out of commission too long, so they deemed that apothecaries harvesting it in the field is a suitable compromise. Given the marine is already dead, stabbing him in the throat with a needle/vacuum device would be much less of a hassle than prepping an entire surgery room for each marine.

EDIT: See pelicaniforce's response and IGNORE EVERYTHING I JUST SAID.

**pelicaniforce**

Sorry MechaEmperor, it's given to be the other way around.

After five years the neck gland is mature and ready for removal. After ten years the chest gland becomes mature and is also ready for removal. A gland may be removed anytime after it has matured.

Origins of the Legiones Astartes white dwarf 98

Nothing indicates that space marines can regrow any organ that has been lost, so far.

What are you thinking about, Mad Doc?

**MechaEmperor7000**

Bleh, I knew I should have double checked my codex (it's in there now too).

Forget EVERYTHING I SAID.

**nerdfest09**

Seems weird now. All the stories and fluff I read makes a focus of making sure the fallen marine's glands are taken for the chapter, that an Apothecary is near to make sure none of the glands are lost or devoured or used by anyone for nefarious means, and now that part of the fluffy lore isn't actually fluffy lore!? now it doesn't matter if a marine falls and burns on a planet or ship, he may not even have a gland to even worry about!

**Spetulhu**

nerdfest09 wrote:
now it doesn't matter if a marine falls and burns on a planet or ship, he may not even have a gland to even worry about!

That's where superstition and lost knowledge comes in. Many (or most) Chapters remove the first progenoid when safe, so their investment is covered. But the remaining one is usually left because of reasons, like believing it'll be "better" than the other if the marine carrying it does many heroic deeds and dies like a hero.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Well there was also the legend that the Progenoid gland carries the memories of the marine, so maybe that part got kinda out of hand and they believe that the longer it's in there, the more "experience" it absorbs.

**Grey Templar**

Basically each Progenoid can make a single space marine. Removing the first progenoid ensures that the chapter doesn't have a net loss in gene seed. The second gene seed allows the chapter to built up reserves, but its usually only harvested upon death due to the difficulty in removing it plus the belief that it gets enhanced the longer that marine is alive.

Marines don't regrow their progenoids. The only way to grow progenoids from scratch is the way the mechanicus rapidly recreated gene seed. In the bodies of specially modified human guinea pigs who pump out gene seed stocks to create a new chapter.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Actually even the AdMech lacks ways to create new progenoid glands. What they do is they take the existing geneseed from a progenoid gland (which includes the materials to grow two more) and stuffs them into human guinea pigs and wait till maturity. Harvest both, rinse and repeat until they have roughly 1000 or so progenoids for a new chapter. This is why defects in existing geneseed can't be fixed since there's no way to actually make them from scratch.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Was just a random pondering.

Given its not explicitly said one way or the other, was wondering if I'd missed some snippet.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Wouldn't be surprised if we all missed some snippet. I just learned about the halo artifacts about a month ago.

**NoiseMarine with Tinnitus**

Apparently the progenoids retain a form of genetic memory of the previous host. This may have an advantage e.g. a marine whose is particularly proficient at being a pilot?

Damn, point being the longer retained by the host the more compulsive and ingrained the memory.