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Didn't know which forum this was appropriate for so here it goes. I recently listened to a story about the inevitablitkly of artificial intelligence, or A.I and want to propose an idea. Often when you think of AI Terrminator and Skynet come to mind ,AI determining humanity is a threat and being intelligent enough to attack, kill, subjugate ( Matrix). This is a legitimate concern by all means. But what if the greater threat is if AI gets it oh so right.
What happenes when AI can build machines that can build machines? When the food can be grown, students taught, etc by AI. Most importantly, what happens when innovation itself is commendeered by AI due to the raw speed at which it can operate. What happens to us? I said this was the wrong forum because I can't help but think of the Eldar from 40k and their fall from glory. When there is nothing left for people to do, to work for then what happenes to us? I don't think we have ever, as a species had to grapple with this because we have always had class. Immediately communism starts to appear here due to the equality nature of the AI effect, but communism, and its effects are still based on human effort and the dignity that goes with that. What happenes when everyone is fed and has nothing to wake up for? In its potential inclusivity in providing everything for everyone all the while denying purpose for everyone, will we descend into thrill seeking in order to find meaning, going mad in the process of increased debauchery? What happenes to morality when everyone can have anything for nothing?
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
That is indeed the biggest pitfall for any society which gets to the point at which all needs are met and any and all wants can be given.
Of course, an AI is unnecessary for this to occur. So it's really a separate question from the merits of having and creating artificial intelligence.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Your scenario is a good deal further away than you think it is, but ultimately whether the world turns into star trek or any number of the many, many sci-fi dystopias out there will basically depend on the lawmakers of the next 40 years.
I pick 40 because I recall reading something saying that was a conservative estimate for when a significant number of workers would be displaced by advancements in automation. I'll have to see if I can find that article again.
It's one of the reasons why talking about UBI now is essential, even if we're not acting on it.
I think that when people talk about AI there's a weird discrepancy where we happily talk about incredible developments in power and processing for that AI, but we also still talk about them in terms of the very limited software we have today. We need to realise that as AI reaches that greater power, then its complexity and how we relate to it will also change.
To put it in Star Trek terms, the all knowing personality free 'computer' seems almost impossible*. Whereas Data or the Doctor, if we can ever get AI that sophisticated, their personality development will be almost inevitable. AIs as smart as people will have personalities as complex as people.
The next thing, which I think is possible but by no means certain, is that people might be happy to let these kinds of hyper-developed AI be the next generation. As a species we are hardwired to build for the next generation, to die and leave it for our kids to carry on. We've already shown a willingness to take on pets as proxy children, and we adopt children, so it isn't a purely biological function. If we build a generation of AIs, and grow those AIs through interactions, I think it is possible over time that more and more people will choose to not have children of their own, and instead leave their legacy through the AIs they've developed. That's really speculative, but it becomes a lot more likely if our future is outside of our own solar system.
*Which to be fair is something the original series did explore in an episode or two.
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Twoshoes23 wrote: When there is nothing left for people to do, to work for then what happenes to us? I don't think we have ever, as a species had to grapple with this because we have always had class. Immediately communism starts to appear here due to the equality nature of the AI effect, but communism, and its effects are still based on human effort and the dignity that goes with that. What happenes when everyone is fed and has nothing to wake up for?
Very little of what we do now is about our absolute needs. Even the food and shelter we have is so much more elaborate than it needs to be. A lot of this is done because having larger, more elaborate stuff is about showing status. Move to a future where material wealth no longer establishes status, and we'll find something else to battle each other over.
People might instead try to prove who is the best read, or the strongest, or the best at arguing on the internet, whatever else.
We're humans. We'll find a way to be anxious, and desirous of a way to prove we're better than other people.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/21 06:02:24
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
EDIT: Personally I can already see the "click bait" headlines and story titles; AI Generation growing up lazy. How AIs are killing fast food. Why AIs will never be ready for the draft and America will lose WWIII!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/09/21 07:11:10
EDIT: Personally I can already see the "click bait" headlines and story titles; AI Generation growing up lazy. How AIs are killing fast food. Why AIs will never be ready for the draft and America will lose WWIII!
World War IV*
You can't take losing World War 3 from us millenials, we have already lost it.
Lenin was right after all. "Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them", he said. Capitalists will give us robots. Robots will bring an end to capitalism and give us communism.
All hail the supersmart communist robot future.
Also, I want to have my personality and memories implanted onto a robotic body, then I can become a supersmart android.
Becoming robotic totally is the next step in the evolution of our species. In the future, we will all be immortal communist robots. Nothing will stop us then.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/21 11:24:29
Didn't know which forum this was appropriate for so here it goes. I recently listened to a story about the inevitablitkly of artificial intelligence, or A.I and want to propose an idea. Often when you think of AI Terrminator and Skynet come to mind ,AI determining humanity is a threat and being intelligent enough to attack, kill, subjugate ( Matrix). This is a legitimate concern by all means. But what if the greater threat is if AI gets it oh so right.
What happenes when AI can build machines that can build machines? When the food can be grown, students taught, etc by AI. Most importantly, what happens when innovation itself is commendeered by AI due to the raw speed at which it can operate. What happens to us? I said this was the wrong forum because I can't help but think of the Eldar from 40k and their fall from glory. When there is nothing left for people to do, to work for then what happenes to us? I don't think we have ever, as a species had to grapple with this because we have always had class. Immediately communism starts to appear here due to the equality nature of the AI effect, but communism, and its effects are still based on human effort and the dignity that goes with that. What happenes when everyone is fed and has nothing to wake up for? In its potential inclusivity in providing everything for everyone all the while denying purpose for everyone, will we descend into thrill seeking in order to find meaning, going mad in the process of increased debauchery? What happenes to morality when everyone can have anything for nothing?
Just wondering what you all think
Maybe we get to become the Culture.
Maybe we get exterminated or enslaved by the machines
Likely something in between
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
LordofHats wrote: EDIT: Personally I can already see the "click bait" headlines and story titles; AI Generation growing up lazy. How AIs are killing fast food. Why AIs will never be ready for the draft and America will lose WWIII!
I have no witty response, which says something pretty grim about my fate in this brave new world of status decided by clever internet posts.
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Iron_Captain wrote: Lenin was right after all. "Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them", he said. Capitalists will give us robots. Robots will bring an end to capitalism and give us communism.
Lenin was just rephrasing Marx' central concept, that each stage of economic development produces the circumstances that will drive the next stage.
In terms of the central concept Marx was right of course, the problem is Marx dragged in a whole bunch of other stuff that tried to make his theory predictive of future developments, none of which panned out at all. So really the part Marx got right is that things change, and they're gonna keep changing.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/09/22 04:25:06
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
