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How do?

So we all know them, and I dare say we all love them. Each offers a not insignificant saving which is most welcome when starting off a new army.

But, not all appear created equal. Yes, they all offer the same price point of £50, and all offer a decent enough discount. Sadly, not all offer the same ubiquity of models.

For me, the top of the tree are the four Daemon ones. Each one offers a bit of everything for their buyer, and even better if you get two you've pretty much got an army right there, whether you go mono or poly theistic in your approach.

Tau are another solid choice. Yes you get an Ethereal in each, but the rest is all stuff you'll definitely need more than one of, and said Ethereal doesn't make up a large chunk of the cost/saving (depending on how you choose to look at it)

Undead? Now you're talking. Whilst a given boxed set there is likely a one-off, there are three to choose from. Buy one of each, and you've got a solid Undead army where for the most part, I'd just want another box or two of Skellingtons to pad it out.

Then come the worst offenders... Adeptus Mechanicus one isn't great. Yes I get a decent discount on it, but part of that is the Dominus. He's an expensive model I only really need one of, perhaps two. £22 of that sets overall value in a single model. So whilst I may want multiple to get Onagers and a selection of infantry (let's me have 'spare' line infantry, which is useful) too much of it is invested in a single HQ model with few options.

Tyranids are broadly similar, but I'd argue its down to the inclusion of Gargoyles over Gaunts. They're just not as ubiquitous a unit, which means I'd have to go and buy more Gaunts to get my army going properly.

What's your thinking on this, Dakka? Are there any where a single substitution would significantly improve the appeal? Are there those which need a top down review entirely?

We were talking about them in this thread https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/737916.page.
The Daemon ones are excellent and can be doubled up quite easily, the Eldar one needs to be redone because it's the only one you can't make a patrol detachment with.

Tyranids were lucky in that at the time the Start Collecting sets came out, they also had two other boxes that did exactly what you're talking about.

The Tyranid Swarm box was aptly named. It was more expensive but it came with a feth load of gribblies at a discounted price.
The Wrath of the Hive Mind box was another discounted box and less heavy on gribblies but had good stuff in it.

Towards the end of 7th we also saw the Tervigon Brood Progenitor--a $60 box that included Termagants for $3 more than a Tervigon by itself.

True that. I'd like to see the transport and Squad sets return. Those were pretty useful.

I'd like the Dark Eldar one changed to a Venom, reduce the Kabalites and stick a couple more jetbikes

It's likely we'll see some changes eventually, given that they're all still packed with obsolete 7th edition special rules and formations. That's true of a lot of 40K kits in general, other than the Primaris and Death Guard stuff.

 totalfailure wrote:
It's likely we'll see some changes eventually, given that they're all still packed with obsolete 7th edition special rules and formations. That's true of a lot of 40K kits in general, other than the Primaris and Death Guard stuff.

We're already seeing a reboxing that includes new instruction manuals that have the rules present.

For clarity, I'm not knocking any of the Start Collecting sets.

Whilst the Nid one isn't what I'd really consider an army building block, a discount is a discount is a discount.

Just wish each was as ubiquitous as the next is all.

For me, based in part on what I play, as well as a bit of sheer money/models "logic". .

Personally, the Beastclaw box is pretty darn good. . . the vast majority of Beastclaw armies are mournfangs and big guys, even guys with extensive ogor armies from before I rarely see field the Yhetis, hunting cats and hunters.


From a cost standpoint, in the US, the Seraphon box is VERY hard to beat. 85 for a Carnosaur (the base cost for them), and then you get 20 free models on top of that. The Fyreslayer box is pretty similar in this respect, given the original release price.

As for what my local shop seems to be perpetually sold out of, that Tempestus Scions start collecting is almost NEVER in stock for us. . . but that was fueled in large part to 8th, and the points/power costs of the Taurox and how ridiculous it is.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
For me, based in part on what I play, as well as a bit of sheer money/models "logic". .

Personally, the Beastclaw box is pretty darn good. . . the vast majority of Beastclaw armies are mournfangs and big guys, even guys with extensive ogor armies from before I rarely see field the Yhetis, hunting cats and hunters.


From a cost standpoint, in the US, the Seraphon box is VERY hard to beat. 85 for a Carnosaur (the base cost for them), and then you get 20 free models on top of that. The Fyreslayer box is pretty similar in this respect, given the original release price.

As for what my local shop seems to be perpetually sold out of, that Tempestus Scions start collecting is almost NEVER in stock for us. . . but that was fueled in large part to 8th, and the points/power costs of the Taurox and how ridiculous it is.

Matter also likely are not helped by the fact that the Tempestus Start Collecting just got reboxed.

The Space Marine ones are not great as far as repeats. For SM, you get Tactical Marines, a Ven Dread, and a monopose Termie Captain. Unless you think you need more Termie Captains, it's really not that great to buy multiples of this box. For Blood Angels, you get Tacticals, a Baal Predator, and the Captain Karlaen model (now just called a basic Termie Captain). Again, not too much repeatability there. Deathwatch get 2 Kill Team sets, a Ven Dread, and WC Artemis. No repeatability there unless you are good at converting to turn the extra Artemis into a regular Watch Captain or something. Space Wolves got the best deal, with a Space Wolves Pack that can be made into PA Wolf Guard, Blood Claws or Grey Hunters, a set of ThunderCav, and a foot Wolf Lord (SM Commander kit). All of those are things you might want more than one of (the Commander kit can make all kinds of different characters).

Improvement ideas:
SM: Replace the Termie Captain with the SM Commander set like SW get. Bam, instant repeatability.
BA: Same as above, plus perhaps include a set of the BA accessories or something.
DW: Also same as above, replace Artemis (a unique character) and put in a generic SM Commander set as a Watch Captain.
SW: It's great as is, nothing really needs to change.
DA: How about giving us a SC box, please! Maybe have a Tac Squad, some RW Black Knights, and if it must include a clampack character, the awesome Interrogator-Chaplain model! Maybe include a set of DA accessories to bling out the Tacticals too!

Oh man, a SC! DA with Interrogator Chaplain, 10 tacticals, a Chapter Sprue and three RavenWing Knights could be lovely.

I tell you what I'd like to see...

GW put a concerted effort into a quality Start Collecting box for each faction, and a quality expansion box to follow on --- and actually keep the things in stock/production for more than 3-4 months. GW is hugely frustrating with their rapid turnover of kits, starter boxes, etc. It can't be good for business rapidly changing all the time. This is all pretty moot since I wouldn't need to buy them myself, but when I recommend stuff to people it's a lot of "Well, they used to make...so if you can find on eBay..." etc.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
The Space Marine ones are not great as far as repeats. For SM, you get Tactical Marines, a Ven Dread, and a monopose Termie Captain. Unless you think you need more Termie Captains, it's really not that great to buy multiples of this box. For Blood Angels, you get Tacticals, a Baal Predator, and the Captain Karlaen model (now just called a basic Termie Captain). Again, not too much repeatability there. Deathwatch get 2 Kill Team sets, a Ven Dread, and WC Artemis. No repeatability there unless you are good at converting to turn the extra Artemis into a regular Watch Captain or something. Space Wolves got the best deal, with a Space Wolves Pack that can be made into PA Wolf Guard, Blood Claws or Grey Hunters, a set of ThunderCav, and a foot Wolf Lord (SM Commander kit). All of those are things you might want more than one of (the Commander kit can make all kinds of different characters).

Improvement ideas:
SM: Replace the Termie Captain with the SM Commander set like SW get. Bam, instant repeatability.
BA: Same as above, plus perhaps include a set of the BA accessories or something.
DW: Also same as above, replace Artemis (a unique character) and put in a generic SM Commander set as a Watch Captain.
SW: It's great as is, nothing really needs to change.
DA: How about giving us a SC box, please! Maybe have a Tac Squad, some RW Black Knights, and if it must include a clampack character, the awesome Interrogator-Chaplain model! Maybe include a set of DA accessories to bling out the Tacticals too!

The Start Collecting sets are just that:
Start Collecting. It's not an "Army Building Set".

That said, I think Elbows' idea is a great one of a "follow up".

They did a follow up box for a short while for like...three races I believe?

I believe this came out after the Start Collecting boxes, correct? Now already out of print or missing.







Generally didn't include stuff from the Start Collecting box, and while more expensive (about doubly so) were still a decent discount I believe. Why just three, and why immediately removed from shelves? It's annoying.

I didn't even know those three boxes existed...they're all pretty solid choices too, depending on the price point. Two or three Tau boxes and you have a pretty legit army.

Those boxes were the Christmas bundles released last year, if I remember correctly. They did a Space Wolves one, as well

GW's rapid turnover of boxed sets is probably to make people buy then when they're new, lest they miss their chance. I think it's a reasonable strategy.

The Start Collecting kits are obviously meant as more permanent entry products for their respective factions, which is why they're still around, and even being repackaged for 8th.

They're not all made equal, nor could they be. The minis were not made for these sets, after all. As far as I know, all are decent to good deals for your money, and they have really good faction coverage.

I agree that the Eldar one stands out in a negative way now that Windriders are no longer Troops, which isn't very helpful for a new player. I don't think it's bad enough that it needs to be redone though.

The Start Collecting box for the Fyreslayers was a straight-up discount on a model, and then they give you more on top of that. Seriously, they took what was a $100+ USD model and cut its price by roughly 20%, and then added in a $60 USD on top of that. GW took what was one of the more expensive armies to get into and dropped the prices to get more players into that army. It's a marvelous thing.

The weakest of the AoS Start collecting boxes, IMHO, are the Khorne Bloodbound, Slaves to Darkness, Sylvaneth, and Stormcast boxes, since you get a mono-pose character that you don't necessarily want multiples of. Ironjawz have that as well, but the Warchanter is an excellent game piece and an army could easily use multiples of them.

I think the Tau and AdMech boxes are among the best, in fact the Admech box was how I started my copy of that army.

To me, the two worst are the Eldar (with bikes instead of infantry) and Imperial Guard. On the latter, it should have come with two full infantry squads and/or 3 weapon teams, instead of one. It is, however, one of the more repeatable ones - three copies of IG and you have a pretty fieldable army (just convert one Commisar into some sort of Platoon commander).

 BunkhouseBuster wrote:
The Start Collecting box for the Fyreslayers was a straight-up discount on a model, and then they give you more on top of that. Seriously, they took what was a $100+ USD model and cut its price by roughly 20%, and then added in a $60 USD on top of that. GW took what was one of the more expensive armies to get into and dropped the prices to get more players into that army. It's a marvelous thing.

The weakest of the AoS Start collecting boxes, IMHO, are the Khorne Bloodbound, Slaves to Darkness, Sylvaneth, and Stormcast boxes, since you get a mono-pose character that you don't necessarily want multiples of. Ironjawz have that as well, but the Warchanter is an excellent game piece and an army could easily use multiples of them.

Agree. Stormcast unfortunately became a bad deal, relatively, as they reduced the price per model on the liberators and prosecutors after the SC was already out. The savings on the Stormcast one is small now and you get stuck with those 2 Retributors.

Interestingly enough, the SC boxes are 'more' value now than when they started (in 7th). I just look at the marines - in 7th, you got a terminator hq, a tactical squad and a dreadnought/baal pred. Yes, they were cheaper. But no, they weren't worth the money spent on them if you were any way serious about building an army. Ironically, the eldar one started really good in 7th, and then got whacked in 8th.

GW has traditionally always had 'discounted' packages. But if you're in any way serious about the game, they weren't necessarily of any value. They always seemed to me a sly way to move kits that weren't selling (although there are/were of course exceptions).

 Elbows wrote:
They did a follow up box for a short while for like...three races I believe?

I believe this came out after the Start Collecting boxes, correct? Now already out of print or missing.







Generally didn't include stuff from the Start Collecting box, and while more expensive (about doubly so) were still a decent discount I believe. Why just three, and why immediately removed from shelves? It's annoying.

Those were holiday bundles.

The Deathwatch one is a good 'un.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
For me, the top of the tree are the four Daemon ones. Each one offers a bit of everything for their buyer, and even better if you get two you've pretty much got an army right there, whether you go mono or poly theistic in your approach.

Well not the Tzeentch one. They put the prices up on its components prior to releasing the Start Collecting box. It's only a 'saving' because they increased the price first.

I was never interested in the Eldar one.

I think it's because it's mostly overpriced models and a tank.

Which even with the start collecting discount is not a great deal.

You're basically paying the price of two tanks and the second one is replaced by 4 jetbikes, one of which is an HQ.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

Tyranids are broadly similar, but I'd argue its down to the inclusion of Gargoyles over Gaunts. They're just not as ubiquitous a unit, which means I'd have to go and buy more Gaunts to get my army going properly.

Gargoyles - I can see for having the Flying Tyrant setup - but I'd happily have a squad of 10 termagants in there instead. I'd buy two this week!

Instead of what I'm currently doing and selling the gargoyles for pennies.

the Eldar start collecting box springs to mind as the most pointless one. give us a unit of guardians or dire avengers with it!

It's great for someone who has neither Jetbikes nor Fire Prisms. I'd actually consider getting two.

The Admech one would've been perfect if it was packaged with a standard techpriest. You could pick up 3-4 of those at that point and have a really solid core for a list.

A fair point. I'd go so far as to say swap out the Dominus and Onager, replace with Sydonian Dragoon, Techpriest and Rust Stalker kits.

Far more flexibility there.