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This is not a serious suggestion, but I came with this idea after reading the "Why bother with Chosen?" thread. There is absolutely a problem with jack of all trade units where if you have both options from range weapons while also having higher melee stats means that you'll be worse compared to specialist at either. So my idea is:

*A Infantry or Walker unit with multiple attacks may reduce their models attack characteristic to a minimum of 1, allowing it to fire it's weapon(s) again that shooting phase, until the beginning of the player's next turn.

This allows something like Chosen or Nobs or SM Veterans to have a use for those extra attacks when they're not in melee. It does also help melee units that have pistols, but that would be limited by the range. Since it's based on their innate attacks, weapons or abilities that add to their melee attacks don't count towards it. It also gives those beatstick characters with a shooting weapons something to do

The problem would be that units that are already shooting focused but have extra melee attacks anyway get much more powerful (obliterates, crisis suits, sternguard), while when outside of charge there's no reason to not use such a rule. And I think it would make the Primaris Marines straight up broken, so that's why this is not a serious suggestion.

A mechanic like that would be incredibly cumbersome to keep track of. For example, say you have 10 units of nobs. The unit # 1, 3, 7, 9, & 10 elects to 'trade in' its attacks for more shooting. Units # 2, 4, 5, 6 & 8 shoot as normal. Comes the assault phase and you forget which of your squads traded in their attacks for shooting. I think it'll be a nightmare keeping track.

The problem with chosen being that they're basically a shooty unit that gets buffed in melee as their veteran 'thing'. What if, instead of getting the +1 ld and +1 attack, they got +1 ld and could reroll a to hit in shooting or melee result of 1 each turn? Was suggested in another thread, and seems like an interesting idea.

Maybe something like that would be good if every unit had a similar option. So maybe the player should declare action point use at the start of the turn, and some units would have two base melee points and one base shooting point, and could trade the two melees for one shooting or something like that. In such a case the unit would bemleft with zero melee attacks so if charged would be effectively effed. But that is the price they would pay. If one melee and one shooting point base, then no trade ins would be possible. Thus vet and elite uniswould have flexibilities that lower units would not.

 Torga_DW wrote:
The problem with chosen being that they're basically a shooty unit that gets buffed in melee as their veteran 'thing'. What if, instead of getting the +1 ld and +1 attack, they got +1 ld and could reroll a to hit in shooting or melee result of 1 each turn? Was suggested in another thread, and seems like an interesting idea.

Yeah the equity between shooting and cc buff for veteran troops is important. There needs to be some automatic stat or rule for "veteran" that applies to more than just close combat and any army anywhere can use to make their veteran unit different from the basic version. +1 attack isn't chosen' veteran "thing," it is the veteran "thing." It is for celestians, trueborn, wyches, all types of marine, and for guard sergeants. They are all designated elite units that troops have to be elected for and inducted into by the hierarchy. The only veteran that isn't a special elite formation is guard veterans, their fluff has been that they are the survivors of normal platoons that were reduced by casualties, and coincidentally they don't have +1 A or Ld. The guard model that has +1 a and Ld over its base equivalent is the squad sergeants, and they are called out by the hierarchy for talent and extra responsibility, like the loyal first co, the chosen, the celestians, etc.

+1 a should just be given a useful function for the non-assault phases of the game. It isn't about weapon skill, because there is already a WS, and it isn't about speed, because there already initiative and move stats. Attacks are about being a grizzled ship's captain whose ship has been boarded, and puts up a really good fight even though they have never been a close combat expert. Attacks is grit, scrappiness, ambition, or autonomy, it's the quality that makes the top of the class not because of talent but because of applying all the talent it has all the time.

Attacks just have to be a stat that help in all phases, the close combat use is left over from the transition from
Fantasy thirty years ago.

What Chosen actually need are the ability to choose a Veteran skill of some kind to help differ them from the Cult Marines.

Dread shooting an assault cannon 4 times. Buffed by Girlyman, he's killing 11.85 meq per turn. Or 23.7 orks. That's higher than his own point cost.

1. Your mechanics are inspecific. How much do you reduce the attack characteristic by? 1? 10? pi? Is both the reduction in the attack characteristic AND the ability to fire a weapon "again" in the shooting phase limited by the player turn, or is the reduction in attack permanent? Does this bonus shooting stack to allow sacrificing multiple attack characteristic amounts for multiple extra shootings (given the wording, I don't see why it couldn't)?

2. Even in the most tame of interpretations, this would be an insanely large boost to shooting firepower for quite a few units, though I must say that T'au in particular would benefit immensely (every single Crisis Suit, Stealth Suit, Broadside, Ghostkeel, and Riptide model will have multiple base attacks, so every single model will essentially have double their firepower for free. Even Crisis Suits might be worth it then). In the non-tame interpretations, an appropriately-equipped Commander might well be able to solo-kill damn near any target in the game, aside from Warlord Titans.

This is not a balanced suggestion. Good thing this isn't serious, I guess?

 Unusual Suspect wrote:
This is not a balanced suggestion. Good thing this isn't serious, I guess?

Yep

 Luke_Prowler wrote:

 Unusual Suspect wrote:
This is not a balanced suggestion. Good thing this isn't serious, I guess?

Yep

If 40k ran on d8 system, giving vets +1's on WS, BS & A could potentially work. It would be nice if it were so, but it isnt.