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Which Ork unit can reliably cripple (12 wounds) a knight in one turn?

I was at a tournament recently, when I faced an army consisting of 3 imperial knights and Magnus. I was caught of guard and was stomped/blasted. This got me thinking. I usually face imperial guard with many tanks and I have adapted to that by bringing as much rokkits as i can bear in my army. This did not help me in any way. How to anti tank as orks vs t8? I know it's to much to ask to be able to kill the knight in one turn but at least cripple it with 12 wounds?

In the mission the enemy started camped in a corner and the deplyment was diagonal (the one with rectangular zones and a circle in middle). This and Magnus made the short range of my ork weapons a problem. So mobility, survivability and range will also be considered in the discussion. I have considered some units that could be succesfull and what they would cost.

-warbuggies with rokkits. they can outflank so they can reach the knights and shot them pretty reliably. To do 12 wounds i would need 18 buggies! that's 1296pts so it's way too expensive and most will probably die in the enemy turn.
-A full unit of tankbustas on foot with bomb squigs. When using da jump they can come in as a suicide unit, and should reach the knight with their 24" range. When shooting they do roughly 9(rokkits)+7(squigs) damage after saves, but they will surely die and that's 315 pts gone. hard to give them support as only one unit can jump/turn
-Tankbustas in transport (trukk or wagon). I had two such units in the actual tournament match. problem here is that the knights usually goes first (+1 on start roll), so the transports will be gone before my turn, making the jumping bustas a better option.
-30 boys jumping and charging the knight. If this is successfull, with 120 attacks they do roughly 3 damage+nob damage against a knigth, then get stomped/blasted. I think this is not enough. that's roughly 200 points that bareley scrapes the knight. Not what i needed.
-15 lootas,getting 3 shots (luck). They have 48" range so the can reach the knights from the ork deployment zone. That only causes roughly 5 dmg and unless you go first or hide them in a wagon they will die quickly. Maybe this is usefull against light vehicles, but not enough against knights. The cost to reach 12 wounds (with full shots) would be at roughly 600pts+ transport for added survivability.
-Nobs with power klaws using da jump. Now I'm getting desperate. To statisticly cause 12 wounds would require 10 nobs with klaws. That's 420 pts plus a couple of ammo runts to eat the overwatch. I really prefer shooting instead of 9" charge, because if the charge fails that's probably game over as this unit gets murdered in enemy turn.
-Last unit i could think of would be the big guns or mek guns. But they are mostly s8 unless it's zapp kannon. I don't know about these, but maybe they would help. They really suck in kill points missions though.

It seems the options have run out. I'm not even considering stompas or gorkanauts, would they be a good counter? It just angers me that i can not find any good anti tank option for this task in the ork Index. Tank bustas seem to be the best option but it's not great since they will only live and shoot one turn. Then I would still have a couple of "not dead knights" left to handle. The lack of anti tank is less of an issue for me agains leman russes or similar. They can be tied up in CC. But when facing knights, baneblades or huge primarchs I don't know what to do as orks anymore. Maybe some kind of smite spam tactic? Help anyone?

The only thing you've not mentioned is Weirdboyz, sink them deep in the green tide, pop off a few D6 smites and heal em up with a painboy if you feel the need.

hollow one wrote:
The only thing you've not mentioned is Weirdboyz, sink them deep in the green tide, pop off a few D6 smites and heal em up with a painboy if you feel the need.

good point! only problem would be range of smite and speed. If i advance with 3x30 boys plus maybe 6 weirboyz enbedded in the hordes, the smite damage would be awesome, probably around 15 wounds a turn. but only 18" range and 5+d6 move against knights who can walk 12". If the knights just walk away in the other direction (if there is room) it might mean trouble.

How i dealt with the last knight.

Meganobz and killsaws in something tough like BW or Killtank, with weirdboy with warpath, bannernob.
follow the wagon with Zhadsnark. I had badish rolls, lost a nob to overwatch but still managed to take it down to 2 wounds left.

Didnt even fire the blasta from my killtank at it.

Its a good amount of points but a knight is also 1/4 of his army in your example. Hopefully you can do it in a way that allows you to avoid next turn fire from at least 1 of the other 3 baddies.

Against an army of 4 superdudes the most reliable orks hard counter is (surprise) the green tide. This way you'll invalidate all their anti tank and can dominate the battlefield scoring the objectives you need. Against armies of superheavies there's no efficient anti tank in the ork codex, just tons of low strenght attacks, smite and some better hits from warbosses.

I've played against knights, if you bring tons of cheap bodies you shouldn't have any trouble, if you have vehicles and/or expensive units like meganobz, flash gitz or bikes those knights could evaporate a significant part of your list by turn 1.

Gitdakka wrote:

hollow one wrote:
The only thing you've not mentioned is Weirdboyz, sink them deep in the green tide, pop off a few D6 smites and heal em up with a painboy if you feel the need.

good point! only problem would be range of smite and speed. If i advance with 3x30 boys plus maybe 6 weirboyz enbedded in the hordes, the smite damage would be awesome, probably around 15 wounds a turn. but only 18" range and 5+d6 move against knights who can walk 12". If the knights just walk away in the other direction (if there is room) it might mean trouble.

Yep, that is the case for anything, boyz are slow, you'll take losses until they finally cede the board. Honestly though, if you're trying to table three imperial knights, you won't get it done. But with any average list you will win on objectives and board control. And if there is line of sight terrain? Well, now you probably can't lose.

 Dojo wrote:
How i dealt with the last knight.

Meganobz and killsaws in something tough like BW or Killtank, with weirdboy with warpath, bannernob.
follow the wagon with Zhadsnark. I had badish rolls, lost a nob to overwatch but still managed to take it down to 2 wounds left.

Didnt even fire the blasta from my killtank at it.

Its a good amount of points but a knight is also 1/4 of his army in your example. Hopefully you can do it in a way that allows you to avoid next turn fire from at least 1 of the other 3 baddies.

aye this might work. If I buy 10 meganobs@ 630 pts. Either transport them or da jump them and assult. 40 attacks->20 hits->14 wounds->28dmg (no saves with -4ap).

so a smaller unit of 6 meganobs (if 1 dies to overwatch) should be enough to achieve my goal. I overlooked this unit entirely but they seem like the best melee option.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Blackie wrote:
Against an army of 4 superdudes the most reliable orks hard counter is (surprise) the green tide. This way you'll invalidate all their anti tank and can dominate the battlefield scoring the objectives you need. Against armies of superheavies there's no efficient anti tank in the ork codex, just tons of low strenght attacks, smite and some better hits from warbosses.

I've played against knights, if you bring tons of cheap bodies you shouldn't have any trouble, if you have vehicles and/or expensive units like meganobz, flash gitz or bikes those knights could evaporate a significant part of your list by turn 1.

Yeah i just don't like the idea of being locked to infantryspam. But I guess planting 30 orks on every objective and filling the board with walls of boys gretchins and weirboys is a way to play the game. It does not appeal to me but I suppose it could work against knights to win maelstorm and such. The thing I'm looking for is mostly some way to hurt the knights, not to simply outlast them. In this i think green tide would fail.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

hollow one wrote:

Gitdakka wrote:

hollow one wrote:
The only thing you've not mentioned is Weirdboyz, sink them deep in the green tide, pop off a few D6 smites and heal em up with a painboy if you feel the need.

good point! only problem would be range of smite and speed. If i advance with 3x30 boys plus maybe 6 weirboyz enbedded in the hordes, the smite damage would be awesome, probably around 15 wounds a turn. but only 18" range and 5+d6 move against knights who can walk 12". If the knights just walk away in the other direction (if there is room) it might mean trouble.

Yep, that is the case for anything, boyz are slow, you'll take losses until they finally cede the board. Honestly though, if you're trying to table three imperial knights, you won't get it done. But with any average list you will win on objectives and board control. And if there is line of sight terrain? Well, now you probably can't lose.

yeah I never meant to table them I know killing even one in a turn is hard to achieve. If I could have killed 2 of his knights during the entire match and left magnus and the last knight untouched, He would have been unable to complete the scenario objective meaning at least a draw for me. Also regarding board controll and line of sight blocking, i tried to put small units of kommandos and gretchins hidden on some objectives. I then found out the hard way that the cannons on their backs reached 72" d6 anti infantry ignore line of sight. So LOS-blocked small units died anyways.

Depending on the amount of reliability you would like, it would take 6-8 Meganobz. 6 give you about 80% odds:

Yeah I think I have a new attack plan for my army. First wave will be aggressively deployed blobs of shoota boyz (with maxed rokkits) and tankbustas in trukks. Behind them will be battlewagon with 6 meganobz (perfect if i buy 2 boxes of them). First wave tries to do some initial wounds against tanks or superheavies with rokkits and thin any potential infantry screens that's protecting the big stuff. In my round 2 the meganobz disembark and a weirdboy teleports them close to enemy tanks/superheavy. They charge in and should cripple it or finnish it if the initial rokkits were lucky.

Then my army could at least tackle one imperial or renegade knight/baneblade and still work agains guard or other armies. I like that meganobz have 3 wounds aswell so stomps and the knight gatling cannon doesn't instakill them

this tactic would probably still lose my given tournament match example, but at least it would not be as pathetic. Definitely have to get Meganobs.....

I know I'm going back an edition but I ran the bullyboyz formation back in 7th. Three units of meganobs in trucks with planks were just boss. One of my peeps was playing the three knight formation (forget what it was called now). I rammed those meganobs right down those knights throats. What hurt the most were the explosions :( By turn three he had no knights on the table and I think I still had a handful of meganobs meandering about. I know...different edition but meganobs couldn't have changed that much.

I don't play orks but I took the bullyboyz formation as an ally in my primary armies mostly for sh*ts and giggles but those guys rarely let me down.

I'll be honest and say that I did not read this post in its entirety. However I experienced something similar. I fought three knights. I used 2 weird boys to jump ghazghkull and 30 slugga boys in range of a knight. Then I charged with two deffkoptas which eat the over watch until one made it in combat. Then ghaz and the boys made it in untouched. Next the boys attacked wth their 150 attacks because of ghaz giving them plus 1. I dealt the knight over half its wounds first turn. Then I finished it off easily turn two. I imagine a 3rd weirdboy casting warpath would have been better giving the boys 6 attcks each.
My opponent abdicated as I also did damage to a second knight and he felt he wouldn't be able to win the battle. Plus he was tired of me rolling so many dice.

Look below. 180 dice in combat from 1 mob is bound to roll some 6s lol. Combo this with the banna nob to hit on 2s. My formula for success would be:

Multiple weirdboys for dajunp and warpath.
Ghaz for the +1 plus he is a badass
Banna nob
Tons of boys.
Some back field dakka to shoot at long range and fill up deployment to stop opponent deep strike.

Would this be a pain to move ? Yes. Can it win against many enemies? Yes. Is it 1 deimensional? Perhaps. But we orks are good at 1 thing assault!

TheunlikelyGamer wrote:
I'll be honest and say that I did not read this post in its entirety. However I experienced something similar. I fought three knights. I used 2 weird boys to jump ghazghkull and 30 slugga boys in range of a knight. Then I charged with two deffkoptas which eat the over watch until one made it in combat. Then ghaz and the boys made it in untouched. Next the boys attacked wth their 150 attacks because of ghaz giving them plus 1. I dealt the knight over half its wounds first turn. Then I finished it off easily turn two. I imagine a 3rd weirdboy casting warpath would have been better giving the boys 6 attcks each.
My opponent abdicated as I also did damage to a second knight and he felt he wouldn't be able to win the battle. Plus he was tired of me rolling so many dice.

Look below. 180 dice in combat from 1 mob is bound to roll some 6s lol. Combo this with the banna nob to hit on 2s. My formula for success would be:

Multiple weirdboys for dajunp and warpath.
Ghaz for the +1 plus he is a badass
Banna nob
Tons of boys.
Some back field dakka to shoot at long range and fill up deployment to stop opponent deep strike.

Would this be a pain to move ? Yes. Can it win against many enemies? Yes. Is it 1 deimensional? Perhaps. But we orks are good at 1 thing assault!

May I ask how you jumped both Gaz and the boyz? I thought that in matched play you could only cast a psychic power once per turn, making it impossible to get them up together. The mob with P.K. nob can be expected to do about 7 wounds to he knight if they have warpath. not bad for the points. If I had 4 full mobs and jump one every turn they could likely kill a knight unsupported in 2-4 turns. It would be a pain to build and play such an army though and rolling those dice....and this is if I succed all 9" charges...

Ghaz will deal around 6-9 wounds to a knight on the charge. Combined with a ton of attack from boyz or nobz nearby it's gona be enough to cripple a knight.

I don't think meganobz are a good unit to kill knights or...really anything. They're overpriced and ride in overpriced transports. Overpriced + overpriced doesn't stack very well. Than the knight's weapons are way more effective at killing manz than they are at killing boyz point-for-point. For example, a stomp attack from a knight will kill around 100 pt of manz (statistically 1.67 * ~60pt) while it's going to kill only 40 pt of boyz (statistically 6.66 boyz * 6pt). The shooting is also going to be way more effective vs MANZ. Another thing we should consider is that MANZ + transports are so expensive, the same amount of points in footslogging boyz is going to end up with not much less punch and, most importantly, MUCH more board controle. You win via scoring points. The knight won't be able to outscore a single boy that's within 3" of an objective. Boyz live longer than MANz point for point. Both their damage output is not enough to down knights left and right. So, this makes boyz a preference once again. Sadly. I have 16 manz that have nothing to do in 8-th so far.

 necron99 wrote:
I know I'm going back an edition but I ran the bullyboyz formation back in 7th. Three units of meganobs in trucks with planks were just boss. One of my peeps was playing the three knight formation (forget what it was called now). I rammed those meganobs right down those knights throats. What hurt the most were the explosions :( By turn three he had no knights on the table and I think I still had a handful of meganobs meandering about. I know...different edition but meganobs couldn't have changed that much.

I don't play orks but I took the bullyboyz formation as an ally in my primary armies mostly for sh*ts and giggles but those guys rarely let me down.

Sadly they did. The bullyboyz formation was awesom, I run it very often too. But now meganobz are more expensive, their transports are more expensive and their damage output is way lower. They're just a bit more durable.

Gitdakka wrote:

TheunlikelyGamer wrote:
I'll be honest and say that I did not read this post in its entirety. However I experienced something similar. I fought three knights. I used 2 weird boys to jump ghazghkull and 30 slugga boys in range of a knight. Then I charged with two deffkoptas which eat the over watch until one made it in combat. Then ghaz and the boys made it in untouched. Next the boys attacked wth their 150 attacks because of ghaz giving them plus 1. I dealt the knight over half its wounds first turn. Then I finished it off easily turn two. I imagine a 3rd weirdboy casting warpath would have been better giving the boys 6 attcks each.
My opponent abdicated as I also did damage to a second knight and he felt he wouldn't be able to win the battle. Plus he was tired of me rolling so many dice.

Look below. 180 dice in combat from 1 mob is bound to roll some 6s lol. Combo this with the banna nob to hit on 2s. My formula for success would be:

Multiple weirdboys for dajunp and warpath.
Ghaz for the +1 plus he is a badass
Banna nob
Tons of boys.
Some back field dakka to shoot at long range and fill up deployment to stop opponent deep strike.

Would this be a pain to move ? Yes. Can it win against many enemies? Yes. Is it 1 deimensional? Perhaps. But we orks are good at 1 thing assault!

May I ask how you jumped both Gaz and the boyz? I thought that in matched play you could only cast a psychic power once per turn, making it impossible to get them up together. The mob with P.K. nob can be expected to do about 7 wounds to he knight if they have warpath. not bad for the points. If I had 4 full mobs and jump one every turn they could likely kill a knight unsupported in 2-4 turns. It would be a pain to build and play such an army though and rolling those dice....and this is if I succed all 9" charges...

It was a casual game at my FLGS not a tournament. I'm not even sure the FLGS has that particular limitation on a psychic power in local tournaments either.

The best way og handling a Knight is to

1) Ignore it
2) Secure objectives
3) Kill Magnus
4) Swamp the Knight with bodies. It will not kill more than 12 a turn or so

Keep in mind a knight can shoot in close combat because it is Titanic. This means he can stomp and shoot all of its weapons at you. I'm not sure if a knight can do this but the Stompa can walk right over units it is engaged with.

TheunlikelyGamer wrote:
Keep in mind a knight can shoot in close combat because it is Titanic. This means he can stomp and shoot all of its weapons at you. I'm not sure if a knight can do this but the Stompa can walk right over units it is engaged with.

I dont think a Knight can Shoot in close-combat, but it can certainly fall back through enemy infantry units and shoot normally. You can block it from doing so by bracketing it with bikes og vehicles. If you use big meks and warbosses on warbikes, then you can easily place them so that the Knight cannot fall back but cannot stomp the bikes either.

It's tricky. Meganobz can do the trick if you can catch them, but knights are fast and meganobz are not.

Tankbustas can do good work, but you'd have to put them in a battlewagon, and a full unit of tankbustas in a decent wagon is like 500 points. And your average BW will barely survive the firepower of one knight, much less 3.

Boyz won't do it. They can't do any reliable damage, and they can't lock the knight in close combat as it can walk over units and fall back without penalty.

If anything can do it reasonably well for a reasonable cost, it would be KMKs. Assloads of KMKs. They're our best ranged support option by FAR.

Don't need transports, 6W each, can't target the krew, and get D6 str 8 ap3 hits on 4s shots each.

And because each gun is it's own unit (somehow), enemies have to choose how to divvy up their high strength attacks, and potentially waste many. For example, the avenger gatling kannon can shred tons of things, but it can kill exactly 1 gun per turn.

Their only drawback is that bringing them is basically an auto-lose in kill points games.

But in all honesty, 10 KMKs cost about the same as a battlewagon crammed with tankbustas, and is a ton better in every way. Durability, effectiveness, accuracy, you name it. I guess they have D3 damage instead of straight 3, but I'll take 10D6 shots hitting on 4s at D3 damage over 15 shots hitting on 5s at 3 damage any day.

 Kap'n Krump wrote:
It's tricky. Meganobz can do the trick if you can catch them, but knights are fast and meganobz are not.

Tankbustas can do good work, but you'd have to put them in a battlewagon, and a full unit of tankbustas in a decent wagon is like 500 points. And your average BW will barely survive the firepower of one knight, much less 3.

Boyz won't do it. They can't do any reliable damage, and they can't lock the knight in close combat as it can walk over units and fall back without penalty.

If anything can do it reasonably well for a reasonable cost, it would be KMKs. Assloads of KMKs. They're our best ranged support option by FAR.

Don't need transports, 6W each, can't target the krew, and get D6 str 8 ap3 hits on 4s shots each.

And because each gun is it's own unit (somehow), enemies have to choose how to divvy up their high strength attacks, and potentially waste many. For example, the avenger gatling kannon can shred tons of things, but it can kill exactly 1 gun per turn.

Their only drawback is that bringing them is basically an auto-lose in kill points games.

But in all honesty, 10 KMKs cost about the same as a battlewagon crammed with tankbustas, and is a ton better in every way. Durability, effectiveness, accuracy, you name it. I guess they have D3 damage instead of straight 3, but I'll take 10D6 shots hitting on 4s at D3 damage over 15 shots hitting on 5s at 3 damage any day.

yeah with meganobz slow movement i think da jump would be the best way to move them.
I actually prefer trukks for tankbustas. They are almost as survivable as battlewagons. Slightly lower toughness and wounds, but ramshackle sometimes helps.
Mek guns seem interesting, costing under 50 pts each. The expected damage of 14 guns is about 12 wounds to a knight. It seems like the most survivable option for the task so far. I'll have to convert a few of them to test them.

Well your right my opponent lied to me. It did not help him though when I played him. Tons of attacks from boys still take down a knight no problem. 200pts of boys can take a knight down with average rolling. I've done it. Add some big bosses with klaw for their higher strength and your opponent will have to choose. Between being whittled down by boys or by high strength multi wounds weapons.

If you are willing to look at Forge World then Kill Burstas and/or Meka Dreads with Big Zzapas and KFFs might have potential. I haven't done the math on it, but it might be worth a look.

Also, maybe Killa Kans with KMBs?

5 Bubblechukkas.

Each bubblechukka has a (very remote) possibility of getting 36 wounds. Total for the unit....180 wounds.

Then just roll a lot of sixes.

 JimOnMars wrote:
5 Bubblechukkas.

Each bubblechukka has a (very remote) possibility of getting 36 wounds. Total for the unit....180 wounds.

Then just roll a lot of sixes.

I had dismissed bubblechuckas earlier because of their unique nature. I thought they would only be time consuming and have little impact. But now I'm considering them. They are highly unpredictable, so the math is close to impossible to do for them. I rolled a three test batches of 5 bubblechuckas instead and did 16 wounds to a knight on my first try! but only 2 and eight wounds on the second and third batch. It did not take that much time (rolling 120 ork boy attacks is worse). My impression is that they might be even better than the kustom mega cannons... but highly unpredictable.
I suppose I could convert some big high-tec guns with grot crew and use them as both KMK or bubblechukkas depending on the flavour of the day. Not like any of them has a distinct look.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

TheunlikelyGamer wrote:
Well your right my opponent lied to me. It did not help him though when I played him. Tons of attacks from boys still take down a knight no problem. 200pts of boys can take a knight down with average rolling. I've done it. Add some big bosses with klaw for their higher strength and your opponent will have to choose. Between being whittled down by boys or by high strength multi wounds weapons.

Actually the knight can disengage, shoot and ven charge. This is even better than shooting from close combat as it's even more likely to strike first. I would not call 200pts boyz reliable. An average roll for them causes 6 wounds to a Knight, including the Power klaw nob. 120 attacks->80 hits->~13 wounds->~4damage after saves. then add the power klaw nob. I'm not entirely dissmissing boyz as they can reach higher damage, especially if the Nob is lucky. I rolled a test batch and caused 13 dmg! But it might as well have gone below expected value and done nothing. Good when desperate though. It does not help that they have to jump and roll 9" charge or footslog.

If current well placing ork lists are an indicator, spamming basic kannons might also be an option.
They cost 27 points, hit on 4+ and d6 damage is arguably better than 3 damage on rokkits.
Kill points are an issue (even in Maelstrom, you're basically giving away free VP when someone draws an elimination card), but keep in mind that the gretchin cannot be shot unless they are the closest unit, so they don't offer up their KP that easy.
After you've lost three kannons you can have 6 gretchin sitting around on an objective, which would then force the knight to move towards them to shoot them at all and then needs at least one entire turn to clear them out (shoot one unit dead, kill the other two through charge). That's a lord of war dedicating an entire turn to killing 24 points of gretchin.
I haven't tried yet, but maybe you can even prevent the knight from killing two units in one charge through placement.

To be a threat against knights you need at least 10-12 kannnos though. Then they may work, otherwise they'd all be dead in the first turn of shooting giving the knight a more appropriate target to shoot at than 6 points boyz.

I think lootas match better with greentides.

 Blackie wrote:
To be a threat against knights you need at least 10-12 kannnos though. Then they may work, otherwise they'd all be dead in the first turn of shooting giving the knight a more appropriate target to shoot at than 6 points boyz.

I think lootas match better with greentides.

How is this an issue?

10 kannons are 270 points and are good against both vehicles and hordes, so the only real problem is getting models that are both cheap and less ugly than the ones from GW

 Blackie wrote:
To be a threat against knights you need at least 10-12 kannnos though. Then they may work, otherwise they'd all be dead in the first turn of shooting giving the knight a more appropriate target to shoot at than 6 points boyz.

I think lootas match better with greentides.

To me it sounds like kannons would be somewhat survivable against knights, given that they are separate targets. Lootas on the other hand has to group up and should be the more vulnerable target.
a knight can only kill 1-2 kannons per round using it's main- and shoulder mounted weapon. To expect 12 wounds in a round though you would need 20 kannons @ 540 pts

TheunlikelyGamer wrote:
Well your right my opponent lied to me. It did not help him though when I played him. Tons of attacks from boys still take down a knight no problem. 200pts of boys can take a knight down with average rolling. I've done it. Add some big bosses with klaw for their higher strength and your opponent will have to choose. Between being whittled down by boys or by high strength multi wounds weapons.

Boyz taking down a knight, no problem? You must have mork's own luck. Hell, 30 boyz with warpath and ghaz buff (6 attacks each) AND a waaagh banner will only do ~9 wounds to a knight. Who can simply slip away from combat at will and do anything he wants.

I mean, I'm not going to call you a liar when you say you kill knights with boyz, but I would strongly not recommend anyone to try it. Boyz are great, but they are NOT great at taking out something that's T8 with 24 wounds and a 3+ save.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Gitdakka wrote:

 Blackie wrote:
To be a threat against knights you need at least 10-12 kannnos though. Then they may work, otherwise they'd all be dead in the first turn of shooting giving the knight a more appropriate target to shoot at than 6 points boyz.

I think lootas match better with greentides.

To me it sounds like kannons would be somewhat survivable against knights, given that they are separate targets. Lootas on the other hand has to group up and should be the more vulnerable target.
a knight can only kill 1-2 kannons per round using it's main- and shoulder mounted weapon. To expect 12 wounds in a round though you would need 20 kannons @ 540 pts

That's exactly my point. Things like tankbustas and lootas are big, fat, EASY targets for knights (and others) to take down, but 5-10 independent guns with 3W (or 6 if you use mek gunz!) are a different story entirely. I strongly feel that guns (KMKs especially) are our best ranged support option by far and away, mainly because cover is basically useless for things like lootas and tankbustas.

Gitdakka wrote:

 JimOnMars wrote:
5 Bubblechukkas.

Each bubblechukka has a (very remote) possibility of getting 36 wounds. Total for the unit....180 wounds.

Then just roll a lot of sixes.

I had dismissed bubblechuckas earlier because of their unique nature. I thought they would only be time consuming and have little impact. But now I'm considering them. They are highly unpredictable, so the math is close to impossible to do for them. I rolled a three test batches of 5 bubblechuckas instead and did 16 wounds to a knight on my first try! but only 2 and eight wounds on the second and third batch. It did not take that much time (rolling 120 ork boy attacks is worse). My impression is that they might be even better than the kustom mega cannons... but highly unpredictable.
I suppose I could convert some big high-tec guns with grot crew and use them as both KMK or bubblechukkas depending on the flavour of the day. Not like any of them has a distinct look.

In your tests, you should assume the use of 1 cp reroll somewhere. One of the guns will likely get 3 high numbers and a 1 or 2...reroll that one, or maybe just re-roll one of the d6 damage, as these are after the invul save.