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I didn't want to post this in the "In Memorium" thread because it is just not fitting.

http://www.intouchweekly.com/posts/charles-manson-dead-146901

"After spending nearly half a century in prison, Charles Manson has passed away at the age 83 on Sunday, Nov. 19, TMZ reports. Debra Tate, sister of actress/Manson victim Sharon Tate, confirmed the news to the online outlet. The 83-year-old mass murderer was rushed to a hospital in Bakersfield, CA on Nov. 12, according to TMZ and his condition quickly deteriorated. "It's not going to get any better for him," a source said shortly before his death, explaining that the inmate had undergone various procedures, all while being accompanied by five cops. "It's just a matter of time."

Charles' situation seemed beyond repair ever since he was sent to the hospital for internal bleeding in January. He needed to get surgery to repair a lesion in his intestines, but the doctors said he was too weak to operate on, so he was sent back to prison. It's a wonder he lasted almost a whole year without the lifesaving procedure.

Charles' death means relief for the many families affected by the murders of his cult in the late 1960's. Nine people were killed under his instructions, and he was sentenced to the death penalty in 1971, but his life was spared when California abolished capital punishment just one year later. Charles went on to spend 46 years behind bars.

The cult leader was perhaps at the peak of his pop culture relevance when he died, after many TV shows referenced him in 2017. American Horror Story: Cult used his image as portrayed by Evan Peters while his name came up multiple times in Law & Order True Crime: The Menendez Murders. There have also been many documentaries and shows about the killer, including the 2015 drama Aquarius, where Gethin Anthony played Charles. We hope this brings closure to the many people affected by Charles' crimes."

Well, hopefully that's the end of that.

Evil man, and hopefully all the fuss over him will die out too. Hopefully the families if his victims can find some peace with his passing.
Never saw why he was a pop culture icon - he's simply a unhinged murderous psychopath. But Ho hum.

It’s not often we get good news these days. I hope the families of the victims can find some peace now.

 Dr. Mills wrote:
Well, hopefully that's the end of that.

Evil man, and hopefully all the fuss over him will die out too. Hopefully the families if his victims can find some peace with his passing.
Never saw why he was a pop culture icon - he's simply a unhinged murderous psychopath. But Ho hum.

Infamy I guess. And that whilst certainly the orchestrator, he wasn't physically involved in any of the murders.

Totally deserve his time, regardless. But you can easily see how to sad little rebels without a clue he can be seen as a martyr.

 Dr. Mills wrote:
Well, hopefully that's the end of that.

Evil man, and hopefully all the fuss over him will die out too. Hopefully the families if his victims can find some peace with his passing.
Never saw why he was a pop culture icon - he's simply a unhinged murderous psychopath. But Ho hum.

He's as close to the Joker as we've ever seen. His crimes happened in a time before we got bored with mass killings. He was charismatic and outspoken any time a camera was around. America ate it up. Think a saner more reasonable version of Kayne West.

Back in the 60s, the guy was able to schmooze with celebs and at the same time build a cult of followers that would kill on his command. He thought the Beatles' White Album was a secret call for him to start a race war FFS, and people still followed him.

He was interesting in the same way any other particularly remarkable figure of evil can be. I'm very glad he wasn't executed in the 70s. He lived long enough in prison to become a pathetic old man, and his myth has largely been destroyed.

Too bad they had to waste time and money giving him those surgeries to try and make him stay on this earth longer.

 Necros wrote:
Too bad they had to waste time and money giving him those surgeries to try and make him stay on this earth longer.

Utter waste of time and money.

Necros wrote:Too bad they had to waste time and money giving him those surgeries to try and make him stay on this earth longer.

Future War Cultist wrote:

 Necros wrote:
Too bad they had to waste time and money giving him those surgeries to try and make him stay on this earth longer.

Utter waste of time and money.

Nah, he was total scum because of his callous disregard for human life. We are better than that.

About fething time.

Good riddance.

No one will miss him I'm sure.

Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

It's what lime pits are for.

Goodbye, Charlie.

The Auld Grump - I'm sure somebody, somewhere, fully expects him to get out of his grave in three days' time.

 feeder wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

The sea is a big place...

I mean middle of Atlantic. No one is gonna ever find you again.

 jhe90 wrote:

 feeder wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

The sea is a big place...

I mean middle of Atlantic. No one is gonna ever find you again.

Solid plan. Someone call the governor.

 jhe90 wrote:

 feeder wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

The sea is a big place...

I mean middle of Atlantic. No one is gonna ever find you again.

I would hate to pollute the Atlantic.


I hope the son of a bitch rots in hell for all eternity. If anybody was the personification of charismatic evil, it was Manson.

 oldravenman3025 wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:

 feeder wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

The sea is a big place...

I mean middle of Atlantic. No one is gonna ever find you again.

I would hate to pollute the Atlantic.


I hope the son of a bitch rots in hell for all eternity. If anybody was the personification of charismatic evil, it was Manson.

Let's not get carried away. He convinced a handful of life's losers to follow him down the rabbit hole, and then society immediately gave him his Go to Jail card.

It's not like he got an industrial superpower to engage in a continent spanning genocide program. He's strictly small time.

 oldravenman3025 wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:

 feeder wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

The sea is a big place...
I mean middle of Atlantic. No one is gonna ever find you again.

I would hate to pollute the Atlantic.
I hope the son of a bitch rots in hell for all eternity. If anybody was the personification of charismatic evil, it was Manson.

I met Ian Brady's lawyer the other week at a party. Interesting fellow, he was forced by his contract to request Brady's insulting last wishes, to be cremated and have his ashes scattered on Saddleworth Moor. The prison coroner blocked the initial request. The lawyer had the good sense to publically disclose Brady's request, which fulfilled his legal obligations and triggered subsequent press reaction that forced the Home Secretary go through the legal paperwork to formally overrule.

Last I heard Brady has finally been quietly cremated, it took a long while to find somewhere which would take his remains, and his ashes were 'scattered at sea' according to Home Office stipulation, a bit like what was done to Eichmann. Though I suspect a more accurate description would be 'dumped overboard'.

 Orlanth wrote:

 oldravenman3025 wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:

 feeder wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

The sea is a big place...
I mean middle of Atlantic. No one is gonna ever find you again.

I would hate to pollute the Atlantic.
I hope the son of a bitch rots in hell for all eternity. If anybody was the personification of charismatic evil, it was Manson.

I met Ian Brady's lawyer the other week at a party. Interesting fellow, he was forced by his contract to request Brady's insulting last wishes, to be cremated and have his ashes scattered on Saddleworth Moor. The prison coroner blocked the initial request. The lawyer had the good sense to publically disclose Brady's request, which fulfilled his legal obligations and triggered subsequent press reaction that forced the Home Secretary go through the legal paperwork to formally overrule.

Last I heard Brady has finally been quietly cremated, it took a long while to find somewhere which would take his remains, and his ashes were 'scattered at sea' according to Home Office stipulation, a bit like what was done to Eichmann. Though I suspect a more accurate description would be 'dumped overboard'.

I have to admire that lawyering.

He basically ensured he did everything correctly yet got his last wish shut down totally, and utterly.

However working for a lawyer for that man. Well someone gotta do it but I would not exactly want the job.

Each to there own, and I gotta respect that bit of games he played to ensure the last wish never happened while competing his jon at same time.

 jhe90 wrote:
No one will miss him I'm sure.

Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Alternatively monetize his grave by charging people to dance and/or defecate on it. Send the proceeds to charity.

I'm glad he's finally dead, but I'm sorry for all the taxpayers who in part paid his living expenses in prison for all those years. He should have been executed so the state wouldn't have to pay for his worthless ass for nearly half a century.

They should have cremated him and let the families of his victims take turns peeing in the ashes.

 feeder wrote:

 oldravenman3025 wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:

 feeder wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:
Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

Cremate him and scatter him in a random field somewhere. We definitely don't need any kind of marker for this guy.

The sea is a big place...

I mean middle of Atlantic. No one is gonna ever find you again.

I would hate to pollute the Atlantic.


I hope the son of a bitch rots in hell for all eternity. If anybody was the personification of charismatic evil, it was Manson.

Let's not get carried away. He convinced a handful of life's losers to follow him down the rabbit hole, and then society immediately gave him his Go to Jail card.

It's not like he got an industrial superpower to engage in a continent spanning genocide program. He's strictly small time.

Hitler was a bastard and had the gift of gab of a master politician. But he just came along at the right time and right place. And Hitler could get along with people that weren't considered enemies. Manson? He didn't need a battered and demoralized population, and a stroke of luck, to sway others to do his bidding. Manson could sway a nun in paradise, given a little time.

Not all of Manson's "family" were losers and failures at life. Some of them were intelligent, decent people caught up in the counter-culture at the time.


Sometimes, the level of evil cannot be judged by deeds or scope. Hitler was evil, but Manson had charismatic and sinister qualities about him that makes him stand out from the crowd.

The revenge fantasies are pretty tacky, guys. I've got no sympathy for Manson or any of his cronies, but there's not much to be gained wallowing in doing horrible stuff to him or to his corpse.

Anyway, Manson's death is another door closed on a very different period of history. There was a period through the 60s and 70s when new age cults appeared to be an unstoppable rising force - Sun Myung Moon's Unification Church, Jim Jones, David Berg's Children of God, the Hare Krishna, and countless others. These cults aren't all now gone, most linger on, but that is all they do now - linger. Those old orders have long since stopped growing, they're either gone completely, or hanging on to a handful of old members who still refuse to believe they were conned, meanwhile any new orders rarely grow outside of a handful of core members and their very unlucky families. Manson's group was one of the smallest, but quickly became one of the most famous because of those high profile murders.

I'm not sure why these groups stopped being so appealing, but then I'm not sure why they were ever appealing in the first place. Still, it's a good time to reflect on how for a time a couple of decades ago it really seemed like the world was going to be locked in battle for generations with these powerful, terrifying cults.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
I'm glad he's finally dead, but I'm sorry for all the taxpayers who in part paid his living expenses in prison for all those years. He should have been executed so the state wouldn't have to pay for his worthless ass for nearly half a century.

Doesn't it usually cost more to execute someone than it does to Life-Without-Parole them?

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 ZergSmasher wrote:
I'm glad he's finally dead, but I'm sorry for all the taxpayers who in part paid his living expenses in prison for all those years. He should have been executed so the state wouldn't have to pay for his worthless ass for nearly half a century.

Doesn't it usually cost more to execute someone than it does to Life-Without-Parole them?

It does, because killing someone triggers a whole lot of additional legal challenges and a lot of pro bono work by various innocence projects, which the government has to defend, costing everyone a lot of money. Whereas leaving someone's ass in jail until they die of natural causes normally means they have little access to resources to appeal their sentence. Which is actually pretty fethed in a lot of ways, when you think about it.

Either way, though, the money involved is close to bugger all. In California it costs $47,000 per inmate, per year, which is one of the more expensive states in the US. But exactly how many people you could execute and reduce that number is a whole other question. You can't just take the count of people serving life or life equivalent, because almost all of them are in for things like having three strikes for using a firearm in a crime, things like that. People it makes sense to take of the street, but you aren't going to execute them. So for an estimate of how many people might be executed, well Texas has averaged 15 people a year since 1982 (though its been higher more recently). California is about 50% bigger than Texas, and we're being generous so we'll bump that figure up to 25, and so lets say California would execute about 25 people a year. Assuming there's no additional legal costs of execution then each executed person would save $47k, for the 25 executions the saving in the first year would be $1.18m. Of course that compounds year on year - year 2 there'd be 50 less people in prison, saving $2.36m, and so on. Assuming people live an average 40 years in prison before they'd die anyway, and you can end up with a final saving of roughly $47m a year.

Which isn't a tiny in itself, but in a state like California, it works out around $1.20 per person per year. And that was using the most generous assumptions I could think of to make the number as big as possible. Nobody actually cares about any cost that small, no-one decides to do or not do a thing for the sake or $1.20. It really comes down to a question of whether you want to execute people or you do not want to execute people.

So really, the cost of keeping people in prison is a pretend argument people use to bolster the position they've already decided on.

It’s a valid counter argument to “execute them so the state doesn’t have to pay for them to live in jail.”

Maybe they can cremate him, and then add a couple teaspoons of him to 1000 random portapotty toilets? Or would that be how Nurgle gets born?

 jhe90 wrote:
No one will miss him I'm sure.

Buried in a unmarked or just numbered grave to keep the crazies from finding it.

I assumed some lab somewhere would want to dissect his brain. Or do we not do that anymore?

Just bury/cremate him and be done. No need to feticize this.