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So I haven't played a lot of 8th at all, and the thing that's so exciting about Khorne Berzerkers now is being able to go for chainsword + chainaxe... so... do I have do do some arm swaps with my old 'zerkers, or is there still a reason to have, say, just one Berzerker squad armed with bolt pistols? I mean add 21 points and give the squad 3 plasma pistols, and you actually have something that can get out of a rhino and cause some damage; at least do some overwatch... A question for those of you who know 8th better --- if one can take a chainsword plus chainaxe, when would one ever opt for a pistol?

As I understand it Berserkers want to be in combat. Since they get to attack twice every additional attack granted by the Chainsword becomes two. If they stay in combat then the next turn they will gain the additional two attacks for a total of 4 bonus attacks over the battle round. Compare this to a bolt pistol which only gets to shoot in your shooting phase, and you can easily see that the chainsword provides 3 additional attacks per model over the pistol!

With regards to Plasma pistols that is something you will have to weigh up for yourself. Does a single S7 AP -3 shot outweigh the benefit of 4 S5 AP - attacks? Against power armour or worse the answer is probably not.

I say no pistols except Plasma. I like getting 3 in a squad.

Pistols become useful if you're expecting to murder your primary target without chainswords anyway, you can throw some odd shots at units behind their screen.

If your meta has you massively overkilling screens, the pistols might give you a bit of flexibility.

However one guy in each squad at least should be sword and axe, because he'll probably be throwing grenades anyway.

I don't see the point of the bolt pistol, in a squad of 10 v MEQ they average less than 1 wound a turn. Would rather have the chainsword and the axe. They are there to dish out a ton of hits in combat.

Depend of your meta. If you wipe already in cc then pistol is better.

Sword+Axe (sword+fist on the champ) is generally accepted as the superior load out as it synergises with the fighting twice ability to give two bonus attacks a turn, so for the pistol to be better you would somehow have to be in pistol range but also out of charge range for the majority of the game.

On top of the swords better "rate of fire", pistol kills can edge you out of charge range costing you your entire fight phase output and additional movement for the benefit of tickling something with a handful of bolter shots.

Finally, if you think the pistols will pull their weight with overwatch, nope the swords are still better. 1 shot per model hitting on 6+ (0.16 hits per berserker) is no contest to 2 stabs hitting on 3+ (1.33 hits per beserker) - it's about 8 times better than the overwatch, as long as you don't loose 7/8ths of the unit before you swing the swords still win.

The standard loadout if bolt pistol and chainsword anyway?

If you have a chainsword and a bolt pistol, can't you attack 4x with the chainsword anyway? As with 2 attacks, times the x2 attacks you get with a chainsword.
Or is it that you get 1 extra attack? As it's every time the bearer "fights". So a normal chainsword/bolt pistol will get 3 attacks in melee (and a shot), where two chainswords get you 4x attacks

TarkinLarson wrote:
The standard loadout if bolt pistol and chainsword anyway?

If you have a chainsword and a bolt pistol, can't you attack 4x with the chainsword anyway? As with 2 attacks, times the x2 attacks you get with a chainsword.
Or is it that you get 1 extra attack? As it's every time the bearer "fights". So a normal chainsword/bolt pistol will get 3 attacks in melee (and a shot), where two chainswords get you 4x attacks

Sword is +1 every time you fight, so a pistol and sword Berserker fighting twice would be 6 attacks, plus 1 pistol shot if it's your shooting phase. Axe and sword is the same number of attacks, but 4 of them are at better strength and AP (you still get the bonus sword attacks).

While pistols are good on other units, the opportunity to put out so many attacks at above average strength makes the cheap axe a must, and the sword is always better than the pistol as it activates every time you fight, not every friendly shooting phase or overwatch.