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Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Beaumont,TX

UPDATED:

List 1: Saim-hann Centered

Alaitoc Battalion

HQ:
Farseer --- 100

Warlock --- 35

Troops:
3 x 5 Rangers --- 180

Heavy Support:
8 Dark Reapers --- 221
Exarch w/ tempest launcher

Wave Serpent --- 144
3 Shuriken Cannons, Vectored Engines

Battalion: 680


Saim-Hann Vanguard Detachment:

HQ:
Autarch Skyrunner--- 109
Laser Lance, Twin Shuriken 'pults

Elites:
2 x 5 Fire Dragons --- 240
Exarch w/ Dragon's breath flamer

2 x 10 Banshees --- 266
Exarch w/ Executioner

2 x Wave Serpent (Banshees) --- 288
3 Shuriken Cannons, Vectored Engines

Wave Serpent (Fire Dragons) --- 154
3 Shuriken Cannons, Vectored Engines, Spirit Stones

Fast Attack:
5 Shining Spears --- 157
Exarch w/ Star Lance

Detachment: 1214


Saim-hann Supreme Command Detachment

HQ:
Warlock --- 35

Warlock --- 35

Warlock --- 35

Detachment: 105

List 1 Points Total: 1999; 8 Command Points; 7 Drops

Thoughts: I wanted to take advantage of the saim-hann trait so I brought another unit of banshees in a serpent to bubble-wrap units to keep them from falling back after the spears charge in. I've found banshees to be good at taking on most targets, but I'm wondering if I should bring a unit of striking scorpions instead of one squad of banshees to really focus on taking out 'bubblewrap' units like infantry squads and termagaunts. The shining spears are the unit that I'm having the most trouble fitting in strategically. I can webway them in and use quicken or keep them on the table and hope they aren't shot off the table; best case scenario there is enough LOS blocking terrain to move them up and hide them on the first turn. Would you webway the spears in or keep them on the table and rely on their durability(Assuming use of the lightning fast stratagem when necessary)?

=================================================================================================================================================================



List 2 - Alaitoc Only

Alaitoc Battalion

HQ:
Farseer --- 100

Spiritseer --- 45

Troops:
2 x 5 Rangers --- 120

20 Guardians --- 160 (Webway)

Battalion: 395


Alaitoc Vanguard Detachment:

HQ:
Autarch --- 77
Star glaive, forceshield; Relic: Shiftshroud of Alanssair

Elites:
2 x 5 Fire Dragons --- 240
Exarch

Wraithguard --- 225
D-Scythes

2 x Wave Serpent --- 288
3 Shuriken Cannons, Vectored Engines

Detachment: 830


Alaitoc Spearhead Detachment

HQ:
Spiritseer --- 45

Heavy Support:
Fire Prism --- 180
Shuriken Cannon, Crystal targeting matrix, & Spirit Stones

Fire Prism --- 170
Twin Shuriken 'pults & Spirit Stones

8 Dark Reapers --- 221
Exarch w/ tempest launcher

Wave Serpent --- 144
3 Shuriken Cannons, Vectored Engines

Detachment: 760

List 2 Point Total: 2000; 8 Command Points; ~9 Drops

Thoughts: This list might be a little more competitive than the first list even though it isn't my typical play style. I feel that the alaitoc fire prisms combined with the dark reapers will force my opponent to bring some of their big hitters closer to my lines so I can get at them with fire dragons and wraithguard. The guardians will probably drop in turn 2 near the serpents for psychic support and take out any 'bubblewrap' units or units with invulnerable saves. The farseer can guide the reapers and doom either their target or the target of the guardians, while the autarch can provide re-rolls of 1 to hit for the guardians and fire dragons. I think list 2 is more durable than list 1, but list 1 puts out a little more damage than list 2.


So what do you guys think about these lists? Is list 1 (Saim-hann) or list 2 (Alaitoc only) better and why?

This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2017/12/31 23:23:11


Eldar: 6500
Raven Guard: 1500
Tyranids: 1500
 
   
Made in us
Furious Fire Dragon





USA

A couple points to think about.

I assume the Wave Serpent with the Reapers is primarily to protect them 1st turn. Just remember since it is an Alaitoc WS that only your Farseer and that Warlock can utilize it as a transport after they jump out...no one else from Saim-Hann can.

The Fire Dragons web way in at 9+ inches. The Fusion gun is best at 6 inches or less. Unless you get quicken off and past a Deny The Witch roll you will end up with good damage...just not great.

The WraithGuard could take WraithCannons, that weapon is ALSO 12 inches but always just as good no matter and they could webway in at 9+ inches and do the same as if they arrived on a WS. (if your stuck with D-sythes disregard)

The Fire Dragons in a Wave Serpent has opportunity without the need of support to get within 6" by turn 2. (Transport moves 16" They deploy 3 inches out, They move 7 inches. The advance d6 inches (or 6 if Strategem is used) Then they fire within the 6 inch range provided there is not much Bubble wrap on your target.

Since the Dark Reapers will be a Fire base...although a moving one if you want.....do you plan on them sitting back to utilize their 48" range? or will they keep up with the rest so that the Farseers' powers will work in range?

If it is the former....you don't have much to protect the Reapers from Deep Strikers other than the WS to shield one side.....perhaps some good Ranger placement can keep those alpha strikers out.


 koooaei wrote:
We are rolling so many dice to have less time to realise that there is not much else to the game other than rolling so many dice.
 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Beaumont,TX

The Wave serpent is a big points sink for the dark reapers, but I think it will make its points back by being able to transport rangers and harass objectives. They're really durable and the serpent shield can help make some points back later in the game.

I was really second guessing my self on the d-scythe wraithguard because I really don't like rolling to determine how many shots I get, but they are a little more multi-purpose than the wraithcannons. Switching to wraithcannons lets me bring another fire dragon though so I think I'll make the change. You're right about the dragons coming in from the webway too so I'll put them in the serpent and have the wraith guard come in from the webway.

The reapers usually stay pretty cohesive with the rest of my forces, I probably keep them about 30'' away from the enemy to stay within range of the warlocks and farseer if needed.

Eldar: 6500
Raven Guard: 1500
Tyranids: 1500
 
   
Made in us
Furious Fire Dragon





USA

Remember that Fire And Fade can work with those WraithGuard.

If you pop them in and then move them 7 inches.....all your WS needs to be is empty and within 10" of the WebWay portal and then they are inside a pill of a transport to take down. I have never seen anyone kill a WS and then do any meaningful damage to the WraithGuard inside in one turn.

If you can put 1 model inside with the wraithguard so that if the transport dies and you roll a 1(s) then it wont hurt so much. I lost 2 WraithGuard that way due to poor dice.

 koooaei wrote:
We are rolling so many dice to have less time to realise that there is not much else to the game other than rolling so many dice.
 
   
Made in us
Sure Space Wolves Land Raider Pilot





That list looks fun. Don’t know enough about Eldar to give great advice, but I could see it working out well!
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Sorry, but looks more like a fund of models than an army list.
Too less focus for my liking.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Beaumont,TX

 wuestenfux wrote:
Sorry, but looks more like a fund of models than an army list.
Too less focus for my liking.



I can see what you're talking about. I tried to combine a lot of different elements that work cohesively, but I think I ended up with a few extraneous units that are highly situational. I looked over the list and found that I really need to decide whether I want to play a saim-hann centered list or an alaitoc list. So I came up with 2 lists to choose between.



UPDATE: The original list was replaced by two alternatives that I feel are more TAC and less situational.

Eldar: 6500
Raven Guard: 1500
Tyranids: 1500
 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 Helvost wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
Sorry, but looks more like a fund of models than an army list.
Too less focus for my liking.



I can see what you're talking about. I tried to combine a lot of different elements that work cohesively, but I think I ended up with a few extraneous units that are highly situational. I looked over the list and found that I really need to decide whether I want to play a saim-hann centered list or an alaitoc list. So I came up with 2 lists to choose between.



UPDATE: The original list was replaced by two alternatives that I feel are more TAC and less situational.

Looks much better now.
Not sure if you need the Warlocks.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Beaumont,TX

I think warlocks are fantastic. They are really cheap force multipliers that are hard to kill because they are all characters. If anything I could see dropping 1 warlock to make the rest spiritseers to get the full damage smite, but I really like how warlocks have been working out because they are so cheap. Quicken, Enhance/drain, empower, conceal, and protect/jinx are all great powers that can be switched out depending on the opponent.

What would you replace the warlocks with anyways? They seem pretty critical due to quicken mostly

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/31 06:41:35


Eldar: 6500
Raven Guard: 1500
Tyranids: 1500
 
   
Made in ru
Sneaky Striking Scorpion




Moscow

With Spiritseers for full damage Smite.

IMO, you only want Saim-Hann if you run multiple squads of Shining Spears.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/31 06:47:16


 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Beaumont,TX

My thinking behind Saim-hann was that the banshees would rarely ever fail a charge, and the Saim-hann stratagem and nova lance relic are pretty awesome. The saim-hann stratagem + quicken would give the shining spears 44'' of movement to make the most opportune shooting + charge possible. I think the stratagem can even work if they come in off of deep strike and are quickened.

I'll try out the spiritseers for the smite spam; it should be especially useful late game.

Eldar: 6500
Raven Guard: 1500
Tyranids: 1500
 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Well, instead of Banshees and cc, I'm more into Wraithguard with D-scythes.
They are very killy vs. infantry and the enemy is hard pressed to remove them (via shooting, since charging them can be suicide).

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Beaumont,TX

Wraithguard would make a great replacement for the banshees. I like to have some sort of counter-charge element in my lists, and the d-scythes will fill it perfectly. It should also help discourage people from getting within 12'' to take away my -1 to hit.
I made some changes to the pure alaitoc list according with what you guys have been recommending. I dropped the banshees and 2 warlocks and replaced them with D-scythe wraithguard. I was barely over 2k points after that so I dropped a single dark reaper & used the extra points from that to upgrade the remaining two warlocks to spiritseers for the full damage smite.

I think I'll leave the warlocks in the saim-hann list to get that extra command point from the supreme command and get out a couple extra powers per turn.

Eldar: 6500
Raven Guard: 1500
Tyranids: 1500
 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

I like the look of the 2nd list.
However, I use the Serpents without upgrades. They are redundant for my liking. My Serpents equipped with shuricannons move gradually and are constantly shooting.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
 
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