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Had this question come up.
A Baneblade or its variants is part of a supreme command detachment and you give it the stormtrooper doctrine.

Any reason this is not allowed? The idea of it firing its cannons and weapons for more shots (at half range) is kinda scary.

Can`t give tempestus doctrine to unit without tempestus keyword.

I can't seem to find where it says that. Do you a point of reference i can look at? Page number in the codex

THE_GODLYNESS wrote:
I can't seem to find where it says that. Do you a point of reference i can look at? Page number in the codex

You've not looked hard enough then.
p84.

Militarum Tempestus isn't able to replace <Regiment>

Page 84 tells you you cannot choose to give a unit MILITARUM TEMPESTUS instead of its <REGIMENT> tag

There`s line of thinking where you make your own regiment and pick Storm Troopers doctrine for it, but I would`t use that if I where you.

Thank you gents. (Or gals or both)

You're not replacing <Regiment> with <Militarum Tempestus>. You're just using the Storm Troopers Doctrine (NOT Militarum Tempestus) as treating it like any other custom Regiment using an existing Doctrine. You don't get access to Relics, Warlord Traits and Stratagems exclusive to the Militarum Tempestus, but you CAN use the main doctrine on a custom regiment.

Note that you still can't have Scions in this detachment, because they still have <Militarum Tempestus> as their keyword.

So, in your case OP, if your Baneblade is part of the custom <Generian> Regiment, you can choose which Doctrine you can follow. It doesn't matter if it's Cadian, Catachan, Vostroyan or Militarum, because GW says you get to choose if it's a custom regiment.

However, as said above, I don't think that Doctrine is that good on Baneblade-class tanks, but it's all your choice!

That's correct, you can make the Regiment BOB'S PONY BRIGADE and pick the Storm Troopers doctrine instead.

You actually CAN take Scions in such a detachment as part of the Auxilla and Advisors bit on the same page. They (and Ogryns, Bullgryns, Ratlings, Commissars, etc) can be included in a <REGIMENT> detachment and that detachment still gets it's Doctrine. The Scions would not get Storm Troopers unless in an entirely Militarum Tempestus detachment however.

I think you'll earn more shots for a Baneblade from the Catachan Doctrine than this doctrine, but could do I think - as people say.

Actually it says right under Regimental doctrines (Excluding those in a super heavy Auxiliary detachment). Meaning if you take a Baneblade as part of a Super Heavy Auxiliary Detachment it doesn't benefit from any regimental doctrines.

So for them to benefit from a regimental doctrine they have to be taken as part of either a Supreme Command Detachment which means taking 3 extra HQ's plus 1 lord of war. Or the standard Super Heavy detachment which would require you take 3 baneblades or variants to fulfill.

Edit: nevermind I re-read where you were talking about the supreme command detachment.

 Larks wrote:
You actually CAN take Scions in such a detachment as part of the Auxilla and Advisors bit on the same page. They (and Ogryns, Bullgryns, Ratlings, Commissars, etc) can be included in a <REGIMENT> detachment and that detachment still gets it's Doctrine. The Scions would not get Storm Troopers unless in an entirely Militarum Tempestus detachment however.

Just got to my codex and need to correct myself.

The rule I am referring to is actually "Militarum Tempestus" on p132.

The effect is the same, but it's important I actually point to the correct rule.

From the Designer's Commentary:

Q: If I create an Astra Militarum Regiment of my own and name them, for example, the ‘Emperor’s Finest’, and I then also create an Adeptus Astartes Chapter of my own choosing, and also call them the ‘Emperor’s Finest’, do the abilities that work on the <REGIMENT> and/or <CHAPTER> keywords now work on both the Astra Militarum and Adeptus Astartes units?

A: No. The intent of naming Regiments, Chapters, etc. of your own creation is to personalise your collections and not to enable players to circumvent the restrictions on what abilities affect what units. It is also not intended to circumvent the restrictions on which units are able to be included in the same Detachment.

You still have to abide by all the rules pertaining to abilities and restrictions when choosing a doctri e, chapter tactics, etc. Yous BOBS PONY BRIGADEwith TM doctrines are "count-as" tempestus militarum army and therefore must follow all allowances and restrictions pertaining to Tempestuz militarum.

Custom regiments are not the same as counts as.

Custom regiments are exactly what they are discussing as counts as. You made up a regiment and you want it to count t as something for doctrines.

Raw you may not take storm trooper doctrine on a baneblade.

blaktoof wrote:
Custom regiments are exactly what they are discussing as counts as. You made up a regiment and you want it to count t as something for doctrines.

Raw you may not take storm trooper doctrine on a baneblade.

RaW you most certainly can.

Page 132 Codex: Astra Copywritum

If your chosen regiment does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army.

If I pick my <REGIMENT> keyword to be MR. BLOBBY'S HAPPY HAPPY FUN TIME BRIGADE, then it "does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine" and thus I "may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army." I then pick the "Storm Troopers" doctrine.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Custom regiments are exactly what they are discussing as counts as. You made up a regiment and you want it to count t as something for doctrines.

Raw you may not take storm trooper doctrine on a baneblade.

RaW you most certainly can.

Page 132 Codex: Astra Copywritum

If your chosen regiment does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army.

If I pick my <REGIMENT> keyword to be MR. BLOBBY'S HAPPY HAPPY FUN TIME BRIGADE, then it "does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine" and thus I "may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army." I then pick the "Storm Troopers" doctrine.

To add to this correct statement this is different to counts as in that you can't use special characters and Stratagems from the original regiment.

While on a bane blade this seems meh.

On a Storm lord with full sponsons and a Trojan nearby I could get a decent amount of extras.

So as long as i am a custom brigade I can take storm trooper. Cool.

Something like 2x prim psyker yarrick and Baneblade variant. Which the regiment is bobs pony happpy happy fun time regiment. And he would be fine.

THE_GODLYNESS wrote:
While on a bane blade this seems meh.

On a Storm lord with full sponsons and a Trojan nearby I could get a decent amount of extras.

So as long as i am a custom brigade I can take storm trooper. Cool.

Something like 2x prim psyker yarrick and Baneblade variant. Which the regiment is bobs pony happpy happy fun time regiment. And he would be fine.

It's not that good on a Stormlord either, but IMO stormlords aren't that great.

You'd get more extra shots from a Banehammer with Flamer sponsons and the Catachan keyword, and you can get re-roll 1s from harker to boot, instead of needing Yarrick and a Trojan for re-roll everything.

I said yarrick i should have said any commi

Also having to be near enough to use flamers is not my idea of where I want to be. Sure it can happen but would rather have 6 shots hitting on 4s with some sort of re roll than 1d6 hits of flamer. And I can shoot at things across the board. Preference i guess.

Not having to move is also key. Parking lot.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Custom regiments are exactly what they are discussing as counts as. You made up a regiment and you want it to count t as something for doctrines.

Raw you may not take storm trooper doctrine on a baneblade.

RaW you most certainly can.

Page 132 Codex: Astra Copywritum

If your chosen regiment does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army.

If I pick my <REGIMENT> keyword to be MR. BLOBBY'S HAPPY HAPPY FUN TIME BRIGADE, then it "does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine" and thus I "may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army." I then pick the "Storm Troopers" doctrine.

There is no such thing as creating a faction, anytime any player is making up a faction that is using faction rules it is a counts as faction. Because the act of picking a non made up set of doctrines is tied to counting as zomething. The designers commentary FAQ addresses this directly saying anytime someone creates a faction you cannot use it to circumvent a rules restriction.

Creating made up regiment cheeseboard doesn't allow a player to circumvent the rules restriction that you cannot give storm trooper doctrine to unit's that normally have keyword <regiment>. Doing so goes against the designers commentary FAQ.

If a player wants to make up a regiment they can, but it cant circumvent rules to give units regimental abilities they cannot normally have. As such RAW a baneblade cannot get stormtrooper doctrines per the FAQ.

blaktoof wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Custom regiments are exactly what they are discussing as counts as. You made up a regiment and you want it to count t as something for doctrines.

Raw you may not take storm trooper doctrine on a baneblade.

RaW you most certainly can.

Page 132 Codex: Astra Copywritum

If your chosen regiment does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army.

If I pick my <REGIMENT> keyword to be MR. BLOBBY'S HAPPY HAPPY FUN TIME BRIGADE, then it "does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine" and thus I "may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army." I then pick the "Storm Troopers" doctrine.

There is no such thing as creating a faction, anytime any player is making up a faction that is using faction rules it is a counts as faction. Because the act of picking a non made up set of doctrines is tied to counting as zomething. The designers commentary FAQ addresses this directly saying anytime someone creates a faction you cannot use it to circumvent a rules restriction.

Creating made up regiment cheeseboard doesn't allow a player to circumvent the rules restriction that you cannot give storm trooper doctrine to unit's that normally have keyword <regiment>. Doing so goes against the designers commentary FAQ.


If a player wants to make up a regiment they can, but it cant circumvent rules to give units regimental abilities they cannot normally have. As such RAW a baneblade cannot get stormtrooper doctrines per the FAQ.

This ^^^^^^

The example given in the codex is pretty clear. Custom regiments pick a doctrine. No differentiation is made between any of the listed doctrines. There is no keyword trickery here- they absolutely cannot be MILITARUM TEMPESTUS.

I really don't like agreeing with BaconCatBug, but it's pretty clear here.

People are confusing 'Tempetus Scions' with 'The Storm Trooper Doctrine.'

Tempestus Scions Can Only Ever Have The Storm Troopers Doctrine. That's there thing, and that's cool.

There is no provision in the book what so ever to say other homebrew regiments _can't_ have the Storm Troopers Doctrine. The real restriction is that your scions can never ever Ever be Tallarn, or Cadian.

The restriction is Scions only can take stormtroopers. Not that Storm Troopers can only be taken by Scions. I know it's similar, but it's very distinct, and we've had an FAQ released which while clearly establishing you can't also pretend your a space marine chapter, or that you're all part of the air fleet, but pointedly doesn't say anything about the Storm Troopers Doctrine at all.

AdmiralHalsey wrote:
I really don't like agreeing with BaconCatBug, but it's pretty clear here.

People are confusing 'Tempetus Scions' with 'The Storm Trooper Doctrine.'

Tempestus Scions Can Only Ever Have The Storm Troopers Doctrine. That's there thing, and that's cool.

There is no provision in the book what so ever to say other homebrew regiments _can't_ have the Storm Troopers Doctrine. The real restriction is that your scions can never ever Ever be Tallarn, or Cadian.

The restriction is Scions only can take stormtroopers. Not that Storm Troopers can only be taken by Scions. I know it's similar, but it's very distinct, and we've had an FAQ released which while clearly establishing you can't also pretend your a space marine chapter, or that you're all part of the air fleet, but pointedly doesn't say anything about the Storm Troopers Doctrine at all.

What he said - homebrew regiment is not the same as making a tank a Scions Tank when it can't be.

At the risk of kicking a hornets nest when it's down,what are people's thoughts on doctrines interacting with the 3 forge world regiments?

Captyn_Bob wrote:
At the risk of kicking a hornets nest when it's down,what are people's thoughts on doctrines interacting with the 3 forge world regiments?

I thiiiiink it has been cleared up in an official FAQ that the FW Regiments have their own rules so don't benefit from Codex Doctrine rules too.

Edit: yup: https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/imperial_armour_index_forces_of_the_astra_militarum.pdf

If you are using a rule to give an unit an ability it cannot normally have by making up a regiment name you are going against the FAQ.

RAW making up a regiment still does not allow you to give storm trooper doctrine to a baneblade because the base rules do not allow it. You are trying to give an ability to an unit that cannot normally have it which the FAQ is directly addressing.

The restriction is only militarum tempestus scions can get storm trooper doctrine, and any unit with regiment cannot pick that. In the codex a bandeblade cannot get storm trooper, so per the FAQ making up a regiment cannot allow you to give an unit an ability it normally would not be able to get.

Q: If I create an Astra Militarum Regiment of my own and name them, for example, the ‘Emperor’s Finest’, and I then also create an Adeptus Astartes Chapter of my own choosing, and also call them the ‘Emperor’s Finest’, do the abilities that work on the <REGIMENT> and/or <CHAPTER> keywords now work on both the Astra Militarum and Adeptus Astartes units?

A: No. The intent of naming Regiments, Chapters, etc. of your own creation is to personalise your collections and not to enable players to circumvent the restrictions on what abilities affect what units. It is also not intended to circumvent the restrictions on which units are able to be included in the same Detachment.

 JohnnyHell wrote:

Captyn_Bob wrote:
At the risk of kicking a hornets nest when it's down,what are people's thoughts on doctrines interacting with the 3 forge world regiments?

I thiiiiink it has been cleared up in an official FAQ that the FW Regiments have their own rules so don't benefit from Codex Doctrine rules too.

Edit: yup: https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/imperial_armour_index_forces_of_the_astra_militarum.pdf

Ah yes i'd missed that. Answers my question, still not sure if it's intended to restrict All stratagems or just regiment specific ones.