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As more and more indie games (usually smaller skirmish games) come on the market I've been wondering about whether they are meeting a need some of us didn't know we had.

As a long time skirmish and indie player, I nonetheless have given in to the pull of big-name, big-games like Kings of War and Runewars and even occasionaly feel the pull to bring out and grow my old 40k armies. However, I really don't have the time to invest in those games. I have neither the time at home to paint up the armies, nor the game time available to play these games regularly. I have a game club that meets every other week, but we don't dedicate more than a few meetings in a row to a given game and as the name suggests (see the link in my sig) we're more likely to play skirmish games than big games anyway.

Obviously the game one chooses is influenced by much more than the time one has to dedicate to it. Visual appeal, what one's friends and community are playing, local availability, etc are all likely more influential. That aside, how many of us find we have chosen games that don't fit our schedule?

Anywho, if you're willing, please try the poll above. Feel free to check more than one selection.

I chose these three.

big games and have the time for it
small games and it fits the small time I have
small games but have lots of time for gaming

It's all very situational. When I don't have much time I play small games, when I have time I play bigger games or lots of smaller games if I'm in the mood for something lighter with less set up.

I have a large collection of games that can fit into any time frame, with any number of people and with different space/time/setup/brainpower requirements.
Basically everything from packs of cards or a few dice through roleplaying, boardgames, skirmish, tabletop, v.large tabletop up to airsoft and larp.

Not 100% which box to tick when fitting in a quick game of dice or cards whilst keeping watch waiting to be attacked by Orcs during a larp?¿?¿?

I didn't vote, but I'll simply give a "yes" to you thread title.

This is a hobby filled with people who spend 94% of their time hobbying (even those who don't like it) compared to 6% actually gaming. There are some exceptions, but generally I think the payout is very minimal compared to the time/effort spent buying/assembling/prepping, etc.

But, that's just reality sinking in. 45 minutes in the evening when you find time to paint is easier to come by than 1-2 hours you find to meet up with someone and get games in. There are a few lucky souls whose lives afford them a consistent "gaming night", heck maybe even two...but generally I think everyone would prefer to game more when given the chance.

Most (all?) of my time is really spent hobbying rather than gaming at the moment (but I enjoy the hobbying too)

Unless you run grey tide of (unpainted) doom on boards with fuzzy felt terrain I suspect most people will be edging into the 'and I don't have adequate time for it' catagory

My answer doesn't quite fit any of those. I play both larger games and skirmish games, but my time for both varies highly. I have a job with a schedule that changes weekly, and other hobbies, so sometimes i've got no time at all, sometimes i've got plenty.

Simpler games, regardless of scale, are better when it comes to playing games with friends, so i do tend to go more for those. But that also tends to lean things more in the direction of board games, rather than miniatures and/or wargaming.

Most people like the idea of wargaming and the hobby....

Then they realize that painting and modeling takes up a huge chunk of your life, so they end up with bare models and armies.

I agree, most people underestimate the amount of time the overall hobby takes from them.

 BuFFo wrote:
Most people like the idea of wargaming and the hobby....

Then they realize that painting and modeling takes up a huge chunk of your life, so they end up with bare models and armies.

I agree, most people underestimate the amount of time the overall hobby takes from them.

While that's true, the lead pile only looks intimidating if a hobbyist considers it as a whole and try to devote large chunks of time to get it all done. This usually leads to burnouts and frustration. With batch painting and 15-30 minutes a day, you can get a lot done.

That's what I do for most of my games - pick a group of miniatures and chip away a little every day/night. I can usually get a group of 10 28mm miniatures or a 15mm DBA army done in less than a week.

 infinite_array wrote:

 BuFFo wrote:
Most people like the idea of wargaming and the hobby....

Then they realize that painting and modeling takes up a huge chunk of your life, so they end up with bare models and armies.

I agree, most people underestimate the amount of time the overall hobby takes from them.

While that's true, the lead pile only looks intimidating if a hobbiest considers it as a whole. With batch painting and 15-30 minutes a day, you can get a lot down.

That's what I do for most of my games - pick a group of miniatures and chip away a little every day/night. I can usually get a group of 10 28mm miniatures or a 15mm DBA army done in a week.

Anecdotally, I find many people who want to paint, suddenly discover how much ADHD they have for the first time in their life, leaving 4 armies bare an unpainted before they know it

I know this may seem off topic, but I think people who push painted armies stick around longer because playing with painted armies is so much more satisfying to hobbyists than cheap looking bare armies.

I guess when people get into wargaming, they severely underestimate the concentration required for the overall hobby, and eventually, leave, regardless of the length (hour or so) of a game itself.

I'd have to tick every box, I'm currently a university student so the time I have to play changes from day to day; some days I'm from 9 till 6 and I don't have the energy to then go out and play games; some days I have no labs and have the day free to play wargames; some weekends I have completely free and others I have 3 reports, a test, revision and weekly chores to get done.

This means that I'll have short games that I'm fitting in between work, short games that I have time to keep re-playing, long games that I have the whole day for and long games that I have to leave early for in order to get back in time for lectures, meetings, deadlines, etc.

I still continue to build, paint and play with my 40k (if nothing else to just stop me from quitting and running off to some exotic country) but I think 40k and a few other smaller games are all I'll be able to maintain with the time I have.

 BuFFo wrote:

I know this may seem off topic, but I think people who push painted armies stick around longer because playing with painted armies is so much more satisfying to hobbyists than cheap looking bare armies.

That's an interesting observation, I can't speak for others but it does describe me. I'm definitely a painted army guy. I can probably count on one hand the number of times I've played with unpainted armies in the past 10 years. It was the specatcle of painted armies and terrain that brought me into the hobby and the spectacle that keeps me here.

 Eilif wrote:

 BuFFo wrote:

I know this may seem off topic, but I think people who push painted armies stick around longer because playing with painted armies is so much more satisfying to hobbyists than cheap looking bare armies.

That's an interesting observation, I can't speak for others but it does describe me. I'm definitely a painted army guy. I can probably count on one hand the number of times I've played with unpainted armies in the past 10 years. It was the specatcle of painted armies and terrain that brought me into the hobby and the spectacle that keeps me here.

I'm the opposite. The last game I played with all painted factions was BFG. Ain't no one got time for that now.

I'd much rather enjoy my hobby by assembling minis while I am still interested in them, my main source of enthusiasm, and then playing whatever game I currently feel like playing with unpainted minis, than by burning out trying to finish painting a skirmish force that I just don't feel hot for. I embrace my hobby ADD. Painting my minis is living the lie.

Nowadays, with two kids and a new house the only way I am going to play full army-sized games with my 40k and Warhammer forces is with the rules from the excellent One Page Rules (formerly of One Page 40K and Warhammer, but now with what is essentially 2.0 of each of those games plus a skirmish-level game of each game setting that use the same rules).

That way, I remove the time commitment involved with learning and retaining large amounts of rules that only get played maybe once a month or less, as well as having to teach my usual gaming partners anything overly-complicated as they are all more casual than me. And even then it's most likely I will be using the two skirmish rulesets off of One Page Rules for Age of Fantasy and Grimdark Future, respectively. That way, I can get smaller, but fully painted forces on my games table with the much smaller free time I have than before kids.

Most of my full-size armies that will hit the table will involve updating all the various forces I have collected over 20 years (like my currently all-metal Necron force!!), rather than starting any new ones from scratch, though I'm really, really debating starting a new force of Primaris marines, as it would be more akin to painting up a small-elite Deathwing faction of Terminators than tons of old-style marines, especially since with One Page Rules, I can start the core of the starter set marines as a skirmish force.

Of course, then I have to balance that with the occasional game of Star Wars Armada with my father, my constant urge to drag out my collections of Confrontation Age of Ragnorok, AT-43, and several other small indie games (Mech Attack, a couple of different game ideas that will use Song of Blades/Heroes as their rules, etc) that keep trying to get the attention of my ADD.

Small games and not enough time for them.

With work, continued modifications to the house (only 20% of it looks like it's still in the 70's now), and a baby on the way, I'm probably getting an hour a week to paint, and three games a year. That'll drop again when the baby arrives.

Might be time for a scale down...

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Eilif wrote:

 BuFFo wrote:

I know this may seem off topic, but I think people who push painted armies stick around longer because playing with painted armies is so much more satisfying to hobbyists than cheap looking bare armies.

That's an interesting observation, I can't speak for others but it does describe me. I'm definitely a painted army guy. I can probably count on one hand the number of times I've played with unpainted armies in the past 10 years. It was the specatcle of painted armies and terrain that brought me into the hobby and the spectacle that keeps me here.

I'm the opposite. The last game I played with all painted factions was BFG. Ain't no one got time for that now.

I'd much rather enjoy my hobby by assembling minis while I am still interested in them, my main source of enthusiasm, and then playing whatever game I currently feel like playing with unpainted minis, than by burning out trying to finish painting a skirmish force that I just don't feel hot for. I embrace my hobby ADD. Painting my minis is living the lie.

I love the honesty!!!!

My answer is a bit strange, beacuse it's two first options, sorts of...

Because I very much preffer to heavily invest in a limited amount of large games (Necromunda could be treated as a small skirmish, but it is so terrain heavy, that I spent equal amounts of time modeling for Necro as modeling for 40K), but then do not differentiate the time for playing and time spent on other parts of the hobby - it is a whole, complex experience that drove me into minature gaming in the first place. And since I have achieved a nice equilibrium between various aspects of my life I spend exacly the amount I can and want to spend on this hobby - in other words, I don't ever feel like a "junkie on withdrawal" that desperately need to play/model to satisfy my hunger but cannot find time for it. I do have a huge backlog of painting to do and quite large "grey pile of shame", but I'm in this for the long run, so it doesn't really bother me, I simply know I won't run out of things to do for a very, very long time.

Choose? One can collect whatever one like, but the games they are used counts-as in is not as free a choice. Although we do have plans to try out specialist games, Kings of War and Lotr (and got minis for the latter) at home, in my tiny hobby group energy is directed toward what games there exist other players for in the region: 9th Age and 40k. It does not exist tournaments for much else around here, and the nice aesthetic of GW's settings indirectly keep us away from Infinity or whatever those games are called.

Couple this with me being inherently lousy at rules, making learning new rules sets a true chore, and WHFB/T9A & 40k are the go-to options.

Also couple this with me being much more suited for taking care at converting and painting small gangs/warbands/retinues rather than slaving away at masses of miniatures, and you've got a mainly grey plastic/sloppily basecoated army (3 colours limit and all that) brought to tournaments, with a handful of carefully finished individual models scattered in the front ranks.

You play the games you can find opponents for.

I spend 10 hours a week painting... and maybe 10 hours gaming once a month on a weekend

Interesting responses all around. As I'm trying to build a train layout for my son, my hobby time for games has virtually disappeared.

I'm on the verge of telling my game crew that t I'll keep playing in our bi-weekly game nights but After Adepticon I won't be painting any new figures or making any new terrain for the rest of the year. Won't be a huge change as I've got tons of painted figures for many games but it also won't be like last year where I started armies for both Runewars and Konflikt '47.

Small games for small time (and small money)

I actually spend way more time writing and reading games than playing them! :(