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I'd like to preface this with, granted it's been a while sense I've actively played, I believe it was 5'th ed when last i had. Most of the 8th ed rules & changes make sense to me and I've gotten a decent handle on the game again. I had a question however when I went to a local shop with my friends whome I normally only play with and had a few games with the randos I was quickly called out about one of my unit choices in particular for having a impossible load-out combination. That being my terminators running with Chainfists and Storm Shields. A combination I took a liking to as it was one of the few things more hilarious than shields and powerfists.
Anyways
For reference, all of my guys are painted up in Deathwatch colors as I thought their fluff was weirdly interesting. And with them now having their own codex in 8th I restructured my army accordingly. Being able to run Vets with Shotguns and Termies as Troops is hilarious. In their entry for the terminators in a Kill Team it does list both Storm Shields and Chain Fists, so I thought nothing of it. And while I know they're not as point efficient or as effective as the standard TH/SS, I don't really care all that much as the laughs I get from when they walk up to a Hammerhead Gunship and eat it alive in one turn. Sorry I got off topic...

Anyways, so my question is; As it was pointed out to me I can only take certain combinations of gear, in this case, a Chainfist with a Stormbolter or a Thunder Hammer with a Storm Shield, I can no longer pick and chose everything. Is this right? Or am I free to keep fielding perhaps my second favorite units in my army.

At the risk of being not particualarly helpful, which Codex are you using and what does it say?

Every Codex is different. A legal load out for a Terminator is different for Space Marines, Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, and Deathwatch.

Stigafel wrote:
I'd like to preface this with, granted it's been a while sense I've actively played, I believe it was 5'th ed when last i had. Most of the 8th ed rules & changes make sense to me and I've gotten a decent handle on the game again. I had a question however when I went to a local shop with my friends whome I normally only play with and had a few games with the randos I was quickly called out about one of my unit choices in particular for having a impossible load-out combination. That being my terminators running with Chainfists and Storm Shields. A combination I took a liking to as it was one of the few things more hilarious than shields and powerfists.
Anyways
For reference, all of my guys are painted up in Deathwatch colors as I thought their fluff was weirdly interesting. And with them now having their own codex in 8th I restructured my army accordingly. Being able to run Vets with Shotguns and Termies as Troops is hilarious. In their entry for the terminators in a Kill Team it does list both Storm Shields and Chain Fists, so I thought nothing of it. And while I know they're not as point efficient or as effective as the standard TH/SS, I don't really care all that much as the laughs I get from when they walk up to a Hammerhead Gunship and eat it alive in one turn. Sorry I got off topic...

Anyways, so my question is; As it was pointed out to me I can only take certain combinations of gear, in this case, a Chainfist with a Stormbolter or a Thunder Hammer with a Storm Shield, I can no longer pick and chose everything. Is this right? Or am I free to keep fielding perhaps my second favorite units in my army.

You can paint your models however you want. What is actually legal for the rules you want to use depends on the codex you're using.

 alextroy wrote:
At the risk of being not particualarly helpful, which Codex are you using and what does it say?

Every Codex is different. A legal load out for a Terminator is different for Space Marines, Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, and Deathwatch.

I'm using the Deathwatch codex. I apologize, I thought I had made that clear.

I don't think it is a good idea to post the rules like this here.

btt: As mentioned above you only can take the thunderhammer + storm shield combination. If you could take a chainfist + storm shield it would be noted different. See SM or BA Vanguard Veterans for example (storm shield and an item from list x).

Termies come in set loadouts these days. Chainfist and Storm Shield is not a legal combo. You could play counts-as Thunder Hammer if you like the look but don’t want to remodel your unit.

Not legal for normal Terminators, but a Dark Angel Master in Terminator armour can take a chain fist and storm shield. Might be true for other chapters, don't have the book to hand.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Additional note, though of course you're talking about doing this for fun rather than power gaming, it should be noted that Chain Fists are hilariously overpriced this edition in my opinion.

It's 10 points more than a power fist, and all that gets you is 1 extra AP (when you already have -3), and changes damage from d3 to 2.

Given Terminators are already overpriced anyway, I can't ever justify taking chainfists.

Stux wrote:
Not legal for normal Terminators, but a Dark Angel Master in Terminator armour can take a chain fist and storm shield. Might be true for other chapters, don't have the book to hand.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Additional note, though of course you're talking about doing this for fun rather than power gaming, it should be noted that Chain Fists are hilariously overpriced this edition in my opinion.

It's 10 points more than a power fist, and all that gets you is 1 extra AP (when you already have -3), and changes damage from d3 to 2.

Given Terminators are already overpriced anyway, I can't ever justify taking chainfists.

Well. 10 pts for extra AP and better damage value is something.

tneva82 wrote:

Well. 10 pts for extra AP and better damage value is something.

It's not nothing, I just don't think it's worth anywhere near 10 extra points on an already overpriced model.

-3 AP handily deals with almost everything. -4 will only make a significant difference against models with a 2+ save that don't have an invuln. So pointless against other Terminators for example, but will help a little against Lands Raiders.

The damage is the same average, but more consistent. So it's better against 2W models so you're guaranteed not to waste damage, but no better against many wound models, which are where the extra AP is more likely to get value.

It should be about 14 to 16 points really, not 22. Or better, give it a special rule that actually helps it crack vehicles better which is what it's supposed to do. Maybe 4 damage Vs models with the VEHICLE keyword or something like that.

Chainfists used to be +2pts compared to Power Fists. They forgot to amend their price when Power Fists got reduced.

 JohnnyHell wrote:
Chainfists used to be +2pts compared to Power Fists. They forgot to amend their price when Power Fists got reduced.

Ah, there we go!

Chaos get them for 14pts now actually

Have you ever been able to have chainfists with storm shields?

Thommy H wrote:
Have you ever been able to have chainfists with storm shields?

As I say, you still can on some characters. But I don't remember it being a thing on regular squads either. But then I was out for a few editions, so I can't be sure.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Traditionally storm shields and chainfists were always sold as a left arm, which would have put aot of people off doing it even if it were legal, especially back in the days of metal minis.

Stux wrote:


As I say, you still can on some characters. But I don't remember it being a thing on regular squads either. But then I was out for a few editions, so I can't be sure.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Traditionally storm shields and chainfists were always sold as a left arm, which would have put aot of people off doing it even if it were legal, especially back in the days of metal minis.

I've been playing since 2nd Edition - you might have been able to mix and match back then, but I think the combos were still fixed (it would have taken a fair bit of conversion work on the metals anyway, as you say). Certainly in 3rd onwards you either had PF/PS/CF and bolter or LC or TH/SS because that was when they split them into Terminator and Terminator Assault Squads. You could swap in a PF/SB guy in the BRB Marine list, although basically every weapon counted as a PF so it wasn't that important...

Anyway, happy to be corrected, but I'm like 95% sure that chainfist and storm shield has never been a legal combo for any kind of Terminator squad. Not even Deathwing!

It is legal for Wolf Guard Terminators.

 alextroy wrote:
It is legal for Wolf Guard Terminators.

Oh, everything's legal for Wolf Guard! You can't count them!

You used to be able to, but sadly it has changed. However, as pointed out in the thread earlier, some captains can still do this legally. Cataphractii Captains as well, so theres a non chapter spisific one. Thankfully, most of the models were in Cataphractii armor because I liked the look. So I have some saving grace.

As for why, when yes they are effectively better average power fists (which I will be running most of these guys as, as I really don't like the idea of breaking these guys apart just for the sake of WYSIWYG) at almost 2x the current price (Fix your gak GW), I always found the fluff of what Chainfists are hilarious, which was the biggest draw for me. Hell, a good section of my combined army is just because the fluff or idea was hilarious or interesting. Both Cannon and Fannon. Like one of my dreadnoughts is based with a Sister in training holding onto one of it's close combat fists, ala Big Daddy & Little Sister.

I didn't see this mentioned yet: in 8th edition, WYSIWYG is not a rule.

You can have a model with a Chainfist and a Storm Shield. But the Chainfist would need to count as something else, i.e. a Thunderhammer.

My Grey Knight Paladins have Storm Shields and Thunderhammers, which is not legal for GK in 8th. No one is going to get me to remove those Shields, however, because they look so cool.

It wasn't legal in 5th through 7th either. Just drago gets a stormshield.

Yeh as mentioned the best solution is to use them as Counts-As Thunderhammers, since nothing else can be together with a Storm Shield on a Terminator. That's what I do with my Assault Terminators, Tartaros armour (because it looks cool) with Storm Shields and "Thunder Spears" because Spartan theme.

I also have an identical spear for one of my Captains when I arm him with a thunderhammer and make that clear when I put him on the table.

The most important part of "counts-as" is being clear and consistent, which is why I use another type of spear for my Power Lances on my Vanguard Veterans.