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I was thinking about running, amongst other combination, 10 man scion troop squads all with hotshot lasguns for the following reasons:
1)They're cheaper than valkyries and taurox primes, which really adds up when you take 3 or 4 of them
2)They've got t7 over the t6 of the regular taurox
3)They've got a capacity of 12 over the 10 of the taurox

Combining them with Regimental Doctrines you can get:
1)Catachan chimeras that reroll the amount of shots on 2 heavy flamers (including overwatch)
2)Valhallan chimeras that double wounds remaining for the damage table meaning they'll still be quick and shooty for longer
3)Vostroyan's increased range and therefore rapid fire range
4)Armageddon ignoring AP -1 for longer survival against medium strength weapons like autocannons and heavy bolters/flamers equivalent
5)Tallern moving and firing their heavy weapons without penalty

These equal or better getting extra rolls on 6s for taurox primes at half range IMO

The reason the capacity of 12 is great is that you can take full strength scion squads and still fit the tempestor primes inside to give them orders when they jump out. FRSF on hotshots means 36 AP-2 shots, perfect for mowing down enemy infantry. I was thinking of running 2 or 3 10 man squads in 3 chimeras ahead of my Cadian Batallion gunline to get table control, take care of infantry, block deepstrikers etc. I'd take a Catachan vanguard for example and bring a psyker for HQ and a commisar and 2 astropaths so I could legally take 3 chimeras as catachan as dedicated transports and keep my cadian doctrine on the battalion. You could even chuck yarrick in with them, a ministorum priest, couple of psykers and commissars in the extra room in the chimeras to make them even better at taking out infantry as your tanks and artillery shoot from the back edge of the table surrounded by regular guard infantry squads as a barrier.

Mostly I like the idea of getting hotshots into rapid fire range which they can't do when they deepstrike. Without a prime near them, who can't drop down til turn 2 now, they can't double the amount of shots. And for that to be most effective they need to be at full strength, hence the protection from the chimeras. Anyone got any practice/insight/thoughts into this idea and what 3 units of scions in 3 chimeras would be useful in teaming up with in terms of a guard list?

Cheers

Well it's bleeding power but if you don't mind that much it's okay.

But btw rather than 10 take 2x5. More flexible and tougher. You need to think good reason to NOT have 2x5. Either way you can load up your units to same transport.

Because then you waste orders on smaller units. You can only take 3 primes now so it's essential you don't waste the orders. It could work with 2 primes and 4 5 man squads but I prefer ordering 4 10 man squads

If tallarn, upgrade to the gryphonne pattern chimera, that way you have 3x heavy bolters per and that third one comes out a bit discounted.

Since it sounds like you want these to be mobile tallarn is a good choice. They won't be the murder machines that the Gatling/hotshot taurox prime is though, but they will get your units there.

Also consider, by doing this, you are losing access to scions detachment rules of all those exploding 6s.

I really like 10 man Scion squads though. I just deep strike a Scion commander in orders range when they get out of their prime.

 Smotejob wrote:
If tallarn, upgrade to the gryphonne pattern chimera, that way you have 3x heavy bolters per and that third one comes out a bit discounted.

Since it sounds like you want these to be mobile tallarn is a good choice. They won't be the murder machines that the Gatling/hotshot taurox prime is though, but they will get your units there.

Also consider, by doing this, you are losing access to scions detachment rules of all those exploding 6s.

I really like 10 man Scion squads though. I just deep strike a Scion commander in orders range when they get out of their prime.

You could always take the Tallarn tanks in another detachment, though. E.g. 3 Hydras and a Tank Commander or something in a Spearhead. (Hydras are surprisingly good for Tallarn, imo, given the sheer amount of popular Fly-keyworded stuff. Hitting on 3s on the move with 8 autocannon shots is pretty neat).

I have taken separate detachments guys. Battalion of scions, Brigade of cadian and vanguard of whatever I want the transports to be. That way I take one HQ like a primaris pyker and 3 elites like commisars/astropaths/crusaders and can take the 4 chimeras as anything I want.

That way I keep the exploding sixes and almost guarantee 3 or 4 hotshot lasgun units being in half range turn 2. Can't stress enough how good they can be shooting 36 times with extra hits on sixes. You can't deepstrike hotshots in range so that's what I like this list. Removing the dakka of the taurox is fine IMO because they're a target and get shot up early while most people don't care about chimeras. If they do target them, then you're gun line isn't being shot so it's a win win. I'll play test tallern gryphonnes for sure, that's a great idea!

ravenerioli wrote:
I have taken separate detachments guys. Battalion of scions, Brigade of cadian and vanguard of whatever I want the transports to be. That way I take one HQ like a primaris pyker and 3 elites like commisars/astropaths/crusaders and can take the 4 chimeras as anything I want.

That way I keep the exploding sixes and almost guarantee 3 or 4 hotshot lasgun units being in half range turn 2. Can't stress enough how good they can be shooting 36 times with extra hits on sixes. You can't deepstrike hotshots in range so that's what I like this list. Removing the dakka of the taurox is fine IMO because they're a target and get shot up early while most people don't care about chimeras. If they do target them, then you're gun line isn't being shot so it's a win win. I'll play test tallern gryphonnes for sure, that's a great idea!

You could even pick a custom regiment and then give it the Storm Troopers doctrine, so your Chimeras get the exploding 6s at half range too.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
You could even pick a custom regiment and then give it the Storm Troopers doctrine, so your Chimeras get the exploding 6s at half range too.

Not that you would ever want to do that. +1 BS from Tallarn is way more of a firepower buff than exploding 6s, and that's not even considering the advantage of access to relics and stratagems.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
You could even pick a custom regiment and then give it the Storm Troopers doctrine, so your Chimeras get the exploding 6s at half range too.

Not that you would ever want to do that. +1 BS from Tallarn is way more of a firepower buff than exploding 6s, and that's not even considering the advantage of access to relics and stratagems.

The Tallarn buff is cooler, but having the transports crewed by faux-Scions is pretty neat from a lore perspective too.
Not that I'd expect you to understand.

ravenerioli wrote:
Because then you waste orders on smaller units. You can only take 3 primes now so it's essential you don't waste the orders. It could work with 2 primes and 4 5 man squads but I prefer ordering 4 10 man squads

Well i find 7 orders per turn enough. Especially when factoring extra survibility. Pricey models so tougher is good.

If you take the "not stormtroopers, honest" doctrine, you still have to put them in a separate detachment anyway.

 Mmmpi wrote:
If you take the "not stormtroopers, honest" doctrine, you still have to put them in a separate detachment anyway.

Right, yes, that's mentioned.

Oh. 36 of those is brutal to anything t5 or less.

I'll do a bit of play testing and get back to you guys, tallern gryphonnes or catachan double heavy flamer seems to be the best way to go atm

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
The Tallarn buff is cooler, but having the transports crewed by faux-Scions is pretty neat from a lore perspective too.
Not that I'd expect you to understand.

You can have them crewed by faux-scions while using the Tallarn doctrine, but I wouldn't expect you to understand how people can be flexible with their rules instead of defining the One True Fluff for their army and rejecting anything that doesn't comply with their 50 page document on exactly what rules their army must use. In fact, it is probably fluffier to represent them with "my regiment is so well trained that they can fire on the move without losing accuracy" instead of "16% of the time my regiment shoots so accurately that the rate of fire of their guns magically increases" nonsense.

But that's entirely separate from this thread, which is located in the tactics section not the fluff section. In this context the only question is which doctrine is more effective, and the answer is indisputably Tallarn. +1 BS is a bigger firepower buff than an extra shot on 6s, without even considering any relic/stratagem benefits you might get for calling your Chimera models "Tallarn" instead of "LFSDGJLFG, using the storm trooper doctrine".