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[edit: I've updated my list, see below]

Hi all,
I'm just getting started, and have an Imperial Guard army and and Eldar army to get me going. I want a gentle start, and my friend and I agreed 1K points is a good spot to learn the game. The Guard army is basically troops with mortars, one basilisk, and Leman Russ Battle Tanks. I wanted to build an Eldar army that would be fun and a reasonable match up. Here's what I came up with. Anything you would change, fix, or otherwise do differently? I'm a newbie, so any tips or explanation you wouldn't mind offering would be very much appreciated.

Thanks in advance



++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [23 PL, 407pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

+ HQ [10 PL, 187pts] +

Autarch [4 PL, 77pts]: Banshee Mask, Forceshield [6pts], Star Glaive [6pts]

Farseer [6 PL, 110pts]: 1. Guide, 2. Doom, 3: Falcon's Swiftness, Craftworlds Warlord, Shiftshroud of Alanssair, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops [13 PL, 220pts] +

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 60pts]
. 5x Dire Avenger [60pts]: 5x Avenger Shuriken Catapult [20pts]

Guardian Defenders [5 PL, 80pts]: 10x Guardian Defender [80pts]

Guardian Defenders [5 PL, 80pts]: 10x Guardian Defender [80pts]

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [33 PL, 592pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

+ HQ [6 PL, 112pts] +

Autarch Skyrunner [6 PL, 112pts]: Avenger Shuriken Catapult [4pts], Banshee Mask, Laser Lance [8pts], Twin Shuriken Catapult [5pts]

+ Heavy Support [27 PL, 480pts] +

Fire Prism [9 PL, 160pts]: Twin Shuriken Catapult [5pts]

Fire Prism [9 PL, 160pts]: Twin Shuriken Catapult [5pts]

Fire Prism [9 PL, 160pts]: Twin Shuriken Catapult [5pts]

++ Total: [56 PL, 999pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

Your troops have no special weapons or anything at all to help them. Nor transports to safely get them into position. They will all probably get shot off the table by bolter Fire really fast. The fire prisms are powerful but you can’t hold objectives with them easily. But with linked fire and pulsed laser discharge they will melt anything in the board. Unless some kind of deep striking unit gets on top of them and kills them fast I presume all the Autarchs are for rerolling 1’s.

You are missing the most powerful eldar units in the game. Shining spears and dark reapers. If you used dark reapers you could use forewarned and blow away any reinforcements arriving.

So I see a lack of mobility and durability with troop choices. Not that eldar are that durable usually. Maybe drop the fire prisms and get a wave serpent or two and a squad of dark reapers?

I think fire prisms are ok, but you can drop one and the autarch for at least a wave serpent or two. You lose 1cp but it'll be worth it.

Well, I'd take three Serpents instead of three Fire Prisms.
At this pt level, they are deadly enough.

Second not getting Fire Prisms. I would do this if you like vehicles:

Battalion Alaitoc

HQ
Farseer Skyrunner
Warlock Skyrunner

Troops (Rangers also works)
5x Dire Avenger: 5x Avenger Shuriken Catapult, Exarch
5x Dire Avenger: 5x Avenger Shuriken Catapult, Exarch
5x Dire Avenger: 5x Avenger Shuriken Catapult, Exarch

Flyer
Hemlock Wraithfighter

Dedicated Transport
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin Shuriken Cannon
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin Shuriken Cannon
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin Shuriken Cannon


Alaitoc
This craftworld attribute makes the enemy -1 to hit all your units from more than 12" away, very good.

Farseer & Warlock Skyrunner
Psykers on jetbikes gives them mobility and toughness letting them move around buffing your units and debuffing the enemy, very good.

Troops
The more elite troops which can dish out some good firepower, Rangers are an alternative if you don't mind resin instead of plastic, ok.

Flyer
Psyker flyer which works in conjunction with Farseer for Doom and Jinx power on the enemy you want gone, autohitting flamer, -2 to hit and FNP, very good.

Wave Serpents
Your gunboat/tank/transport for keeping your troops safe and kill the enemy, tough, fast and shooty, good.

I like it!

I also have most of those figures, so I like that too!

I think I'll skip the flyer for now, don't have one, they're expensive.

Since my Dire Avengers are only 6 figures/unit, why not take a Falcon? Are Wave Serpents really that much better? I've heard that, but don't quite understand why (particularly if you only need to shuttle around 6-elf units, right?) They are cheaper, I think, so there's that - which also kinda doesn't make sense if they're better, right?

I do have Dark Reapers, so I might look into replacing the flyer with DR. I also have lots of jetbikes, many of which would be happy to proxy in as shining spears (they are currently spear-less)

Thanks again for all your help

 pancakeonions wrote:
I like it!

I also have most of those figures, so I like that too!

I think I'll skip the flyer for now, don't have one, they're expensive.

Since my Dire Avengers are only 6 figures/unit, why not take a Falcon? Are Wave Serpents really that much better? I've heard that, but don't quite understand why (particularly if you only need to shuttle around 6-elf units, right?) They are cheaper, I think, so there's that - which also kinda doesn't make sense if they're better, right?

I do have Dark Reapers, so I might look into replacing the flyer with DR. I also have lots of jetbikes, many of which would be happy to proxy in as shining spears (they are currently spear-less)

Thanks again for all your help

Great!
The falcon is more expensive, can only hold 6 models, lacks the Serpent Shield which is very good and competes with other Heavy support slots like Dark reapers. It's the survivability that makes the Wave Serpent so good compared to the Falcon.
Dark reapers or shining spears are both good, try to fit both if you can instead of the flyer but for your next purchase consider the a Hemlock (or 3), it's really good.

And a dead-sexy model, too!

So I'll be going up against IG, and their list currently fields 3 LR battle tanks (the generic kind) and one basilisk. Will wave serpents be able to handle three tanks and a mobile artillery?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And just to re-iterate: I may be taking the IG! Since I'm building the lists, I want my friend the option of choosing his army. So I'd like the two forces to be fun against each other, and well suited to each other.

So any suggestions to keeping the battle balanced and fun will certainly be most appreciated!

Think this would be a pretty good and interesting matchup if you have the models.

Battalion Detachment Cadian

HQ
Company Commander: Chainsword, Grand Strategist, Kurov's Aquila, Laspistol, Warlord
Primaris Psyker: Nightshroud, Psychic Barrier, Laspistol

Troops
Infantry Squad: 7x Guardsman, 1x HWT Mortar, 1x Sergeant, Laspistol, Chainsword
Infantry Squad: 7x Guardsman, 1x HWT Mortar, 1x Sergeant, Laspistol, Chainsword
Infantry Squad: 7x Guardsman, 1x HWT Mortar, 1x Sergeant, Laspistol, Chainsword

Heavy Support
Heavy Weapons Squad: 3x Mortar
Heavy Weapons Squad: 3x Mortar
Heavy Weapons Squad: 3x Mortar

Spearhead Detachment Cadian

HQ
Knight Commander Pask: Battle Cannon, Lascannon, Heavy Bolters, Storm Bolter

Heavy Support
Basilisk: Heavy Bolter
Leman Russ Battle Tank: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters, Storm Bolter
Leman Russ Battle Tank: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters, Storm Bolter

The best advice I can give you is to think about the role of each unit in your army. What weaknesses do you need to cover? Can you take out light infantry (guardsmen), heavy infantry (space marines, or worse) , medium vehicles (rhinos, chimaeras) and heavy vehicles (leman russes, land raiders)?

My thoughts on your list:

The foot autarch, what do you intend to use him for? If you want him to buff a firebase then I'd recommend giving him a reaper launcher. You could also make him the warlord to get some cp back.

The exarch upgrade is free, so nominate one of your avengers as the squad leader (and spend the 4 points to give him an extra gun)

Guardian defenders love shuriken Cannon platforms. You can use the platform to tank anti-infantry shots, which is awesome. Bonus points if you place the squad in cover for that sweet sweet 2+.

Skyrunner autarch: this guy will get close to the enemy and has bs 2+ with rerolls. I'd strongly recommend giving him a fusion gun with his lance. What do you intend to do with him though? Right now he's the only unit in your list that wants to get close, which means that your opponent will easily kill him. He needs something to hide behind (like a wave serpent, as mentioned in previous posts).

Fire prisms: these are lethal with the stratagem, and with three of them you will be able to keep linking fire. On the other hand you could get away with two at 1k (three is probably overkill)



160 points for dropping one prism could for instance buy you a shuriken Cannon for one of your defender units and a cheap wave serpent to carry them in. The laser lance autarch could back them up while using them as cover.

I also think your list is a bit top heavy for 1k (this is a matter of taste though). You're spending 299 points on your HQs. Personally I like to use one "expensive" HQ at these point levels (either a farseer or a kitted out autarch), the rest of my HQs will be spirit seers (both protect/jinx and conceal/reveal are always useful,and the other powers can be decent too).

If it were me I'd probably fold the prisms into the larger detachment, allowing me to drop one of the autarchs. Autarchs are useful, but so far I've found one to be enough for the aura buff. This saves up some points for unit upgrades (weapon platforms for the guardians, fusion gun/reaper launcher for the remaining autarch, some more dire avengers if points allow).

shortymcnostrill wrote:

...
160 points for dropping one prism could for instance buy you a shuriken Cannon for one of your defender units and a cheap wave serpent to carry them in.

...

Just to confirm, a 10-guardian unit of Defenders with a heavy weapons platform with a Shuriken Cannon can still use a wave serpent to get around in? The serpent says it can transport 12 phoenix lord (?!) or infantry models. Does the platform count as one infantry?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just for fun, and since I'm sure EVERYONE is on the edge of their seats, I've gone over things and based on what models I have, here's what I'm thinking would be fun to field (and my IG list is very similar to what X078 suggests)


++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [62 PL, 999pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

+ HQ [10 PL, 187pts] +

Autarch [4 PL, 77pts]: Banshee Mask, Forceshield [6pts], Star Glaive [6pts]

Farseer [6 PL, 110pts]: 1. Guide, 2. Doom, 3: Falcon's Swiftness, Craftworlds Warlord, Shiftshroud of Alanssair, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops [16 PL, 262pts] +

Dire Avengers [6 PL, 72pts]
. 5x Dire Avenger [60pts]: 5x Avenger Shuriken Catapult [20pts]
. Dire Avenger Exarch [12pts]: Avenger Shuriken Catapult [4pts]

Guardian Defenders [5 PL, 95pts]: 10x Guardian Defender [80pts]
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform [15pts]: Shuriken Cannon [10pts]

Guardian Defenders [5 PL, 95pts]: 10x Guardian Defender [80pts]
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform [15pts]: Shuriken Cannon [10pts]

+ Fast Attack [14 PL, 217pts] +

Shining Spears [14 PL, 217pts]
. 6x Shining Spear [186pts]: 6x Laser Lance [48pts], 6x Twin Shuriken Catapult [30pts]
. Shining Spear Exarch [31pts]: Laser Lance [8pts], Twin Shuriken Catapult [5pts]

+ Heavy Support [13 PL, 204pts] +

Dark Reapers [13 PL, 204pts]
. 5x Dark Reaper [170pts]: 5x Reaper Launcher [110pts]
. Dark Reaper Exarch [34pts]: Reaper Launcher [22pts]

+ Dedicated Transport [9 PL, 129pts] +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 129pts]: Twin Shuriken Cannon [17pts], Twin Shuriken Catapult [5pts]

++ Total: [62 PL, 999pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

Way better. Gonna have objective holding units. Speed. And lethality. Put your dark reapers in the wave serpent on deployment. Keep them safe turn 1

AM is top-tier in this edition.
In particular, three LRBTs are very shooty these days.
They can shoot twice if they dont move too far.
The same holds for Fire Prisms. Using the Alaitoc trait, you should be rather safe (hitting on 5+) from enemy fire.
So in this case, I'd take Prisms while Serpents are more the allround tanks.

Would you replace the Shining Spears with a Fire Prism? I think that leaves me 57 points, give or take, that I could use to beef up the Dire Reaper unit, or beef up some of the other units? Or some mix of the two (another Reaper, another Guardian or three?)

Fire Prism are great, but unless you take 2, I'd leave your list as-is. 2 Prisms gives you the option of Linked-Fire, which is partly the point of taking Prisms.
At 1000pts, you don't really need 3 Prisms though. I think going Serpents, Reapers and Spears is the best route for 1000pts

Although, I might trade 1 Guardian unit for another Avenger unit, and make both the Avenger units 5 total models, with the Exarch having dual catapults.
You can put both unit in the Serpent to move them where they need to be. The extra points should be use for more Reapers

-

Ah, then off to ebay I go! (don't have enough Dire Avengers, and the ones I do have are OOP metal - can't mix and match with the new plastics!!)

if I go with Guardians and a heavy weapons platform, can I transport the HWP in the Wave Serpents along with the squad?

I think so. But not sure. I never use guardians lol.

Yes... I think so too, I saw that the heavy weapons platforms have the keyword "infantry", so they'll fit aboard just fine

Cheers!