Switch Theme:

Allies and Command Points.  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in sg
Dakka Veteran




I have an idea for how Allies should work so that you can have more diverse gameplay while making some of the insane soups less powerful.

All factions can ally with one another.

One detachment must be declared the primary detachment. The Warlord is chosen from this detachment.

For another detachment with fewer than 3 similar keywords, lose 1 Command Point. For example, Ultramarines allying with Dark Angels.

For another detachment with fewer than 2 similar keywords, lose 2 Command Points. For example, Space Marines allying with Astra Militarum.

For another detachment with no similar keywords, lose 3 Command Points and cannot use Strategems from any detachment with no similar keywords to the primary detachment.
What do you guys think?
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




So Tau auto loose command points for every detachment after the first because reasons, necrons feel the same pain. As they both only have 2 faction keywords. The equivelent of Adaptes Astartes and Chapter.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Ice_can wrote:
So Tau auto loose command points for every detachment after the first because reasons, necrons feel the same pain. As they both only have 2 faction keywords. The equivelent of Adaptes Astartes and Chapter.


Yeah this is my fear that the GW FAQ Hammer hits everything at the faction level ,,, where <Space Marine> <Imp Knights> is at the same hierarchy level as <Dynasty> < Sept> for those codexes that are already mono faction.
   
Made in us
Powerful Phoenix Lord





Dallas area, TX

The most effective fix is a 2-fold change:

Reset the CP bonuses for detachments to factory settings (so Battalions go back to 3CPs) and bump Battle Forged to at least 5CP. Now Factions have a more equal way to access CPs. The disparity isn't so wide between Soup factions that can get cheap Battalions and Mono- or themed factions that don't

The second change is to then only allow detachments to use CPs on Stratagems that their detachment has access to only.
Battle Forged CPs can be used for any Stratagems, but detachment CPs should only apply to Strats that come with that detachment.

Note, that this is different than limiting the CPs to detachments specifically. Example:
Blood Angel Battalion +3CP
Blood Angel Outrider +1CP
Guard Battalion +3CPs
Battle Forged +5CPs

This list has a total of 12CPs, but only 5 of those can be used on whatever Strat you want. The 3 Guards CPs can ONLY be used on Guard Strats (or the BRB ones).
So you can potentially spend 8CPs on Guard Strats in the game.
Both Blood Angel Detachments have access to the exact same Strats (both BAs and BRBs) and in this manner, their CPs can be considered in the same "Pool". So you can spend up to 9CPs on BA strats throughout the game on units that are from either BA detahcment

-

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/09/21 13:57:26


   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Galef wrote:
The most effective fix is a 2-fold change:

Reset the CP bonuses for detachments to factory settings (so Battalions go back to 3CPs) and bump Battle Forged to at least 5CP. Now Factions have a more equal way to access CPs. The disparity isn't so wide between Soup factions that can get cheap Battalions and Mono- or themed factions that don't

The second change is to then only allow detachments to use CPs on Stratagems that their detachment has access to only.
Battle Forged CPs can be used for any Stratagems, but detachment CPs should only apply to Strats that come with that detachment.

Note, that this is different than limiting the CPs to detachments specifically. Example:
Blood Angel Battalion +3CP
Blood Angel Outrider +1CP
Guard Battalion +3CPs
Battle Forged +5CPs

This list has a total of 12CPs, but only 5 of those can be used on whatever Strat you want. The 3 Guards CPs can ONLY be used on Guard Strats (or the BRB ones).
So you can potentially spend 8CPs on Guard Strats in the game.
Both Blood Angel Detachments have access to the exact same Strats (both BAs and BRBs) and in this manner, their CPs can be considered in the same "Pool". So you can spend up to 9CPs on BA strats throughout the game on units that are from either BA detahcment

-

Thats the closest I've seen to a no sharing proposal that is atleast workable for the CP deprived factions like assasins etc

I'm not sure making the battle forged CP a flat number works that well though at 5 CP it's probably enough for 1k Games but for 1-2k it probably needs to be 7CP going on rough parity of double battalion or a single brigade as a base for most army builds. And maybe scale again at 2-3K to 9CP.
   
Made in us
Powerful Phoenix Lord





Dallas area, TX

Oh yeah, I'm not 100% of BF being 5CPs, my main point is that BF should be more CPs than Battalions.
It still boggles my mind why GW FAQ'd them from 3 to 5 instead of just upping the BF CP from 3 to 5.
An alternate option that I like would be BF giving 2-3CPs per 500pts of your army size. That way CPs can indeed scale.

But I really feel CPs should only be used for the Strats available to the detachments that generated the CPs, but not necessarily the detachment only.
So a detachment with faction X generates CPs for stratagem available for faction X. If you take another faction X detachment, those CPs can be shared.
But faction Y stratagems can only use CPs generated by faction Y detachments (and BF CPs)

-

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/09/21 15:00:11


   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Galef wrote:
Oh yeah, I'm not 100% of BF being 5CPs, my main point is that BF should be more CPs than Battalions.
It still boggles my mind why GW FAQ'd them from 3 to 5 instead of just upping the BF CP from 3 to 5.
An alternate option that I like would be BF giving 2-3CPs per 500pts of your army size. That way CPs can indeed scale.

But I really feel CPs should only be used for the Strats available to the detachments that generated the CPs, but not necessarily the detachment only.
So a detachment with faction X generates CPs for stratagem available for faction X. If you take another faction X detachment, those CPs can be shared.
But faction Y stratagems can only use CPs generated by faction Y detachments (and BF CPs)

-
It's maybe a little more complicated than ideally GW would probably like but it's much better than all the other suggestions I have seen. Giving the larger Battleforged CP pull to be shared means the mini factiona that can't battalion are still usable.
   
Made in sg
Dakka Veteran




Forgot about some factions having fewer key words. Maybe GW can add more keywords to these army that makes up the entirety of the factions like Tyranids or Orks. They should really release more armies for these factions as well.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 Galef wrote:
The most effective fix is a 2-fold change:

Reset the CP bonuses for detachments to factory settings (so Battalions go back to 3CPs) and bump Battle Forged to at least 5CP. Now Factions have a more equal way to access CPs. The disparity isn't so wide between Soup factions that can get cheap Battalions and Mono- or themed factions that don't

The second change is to then only allow detachments to use CPs on Stratagems that their detachment has access to only.
Battle Forged CPs can be used for any Stratagems, but detachment CPs should only apply to Strats that come with that detachment.

Note, that this is different than limiting the CPs to detachments specifically. Example:
Blood Angel Battalion +3CP
Blood Angel Outrider +1CP
Guard Battalion +3CPs
Battle Forged +5CPs

This list has a total of 12CPs, but only 5 of those can be used on whatever Strat you want. The 3 Guards CPs can ONLY be used on Guard Strats (or the BRB ones).
So you can potentially spend 8CPs on Guard Strats in the game.
Both Blood Angel Detachments have access to the exact same Strats (both BAs and BRBs) and in this manner, their CPs can be considered in the same "Pool". So you can spend up to 9CPs on BA strats throughout the game on units that are from either BA detahcment

-


This wouldn't be a bad way to go, but it does leave some armies like custodes and knights without much CP to work with. Effectively infinite CP is certainly too much, but I tend to find that 10-13 is where I want my CP to end up in an average, friendly game. What's the argument against Xeno's proposal of starting with X CP based on the points of the game and then spending those CP to unlock additional detachments? Your proposal is fine, Galef, but the resulting CP for some armies would be a little low for my taste.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
 
Forum Index » 40K Proposed Rules
Go to: