Jay and Silent Bob....2?

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**Alpharius**

A Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back...sequel/re-boot?

https://www.cbr.com/kevin-smith-jay-silent-bob-reboot-announcement/

Now, Smith has further elaborated on the project with a photo including producer Jordan Monsanto, with whom he spent the beginning of 2019 “having a #JayAndSilentBobReboot pre-pre-production meeting.” The plot of the movie revolves around Jay and Silent Bob leaving New Jersey to stop a reboot of the Bluntman and Chronic movie titled Bluntman v Chronic.

Sign me up!

Yeah, the first one was dumb fun, but it was fun.

This one has epic trainwreck potential too, but even then, there's some value it that too!

**beast_gts**

I'm cautiously excited - 'Jay & Silent Bob’s Super Groovy Cartoon Movie' was a bit of a miss for me.

**DarkTraveler777**

I was just flipping through Hulu and landed on Jay and Silent Bob Strikes Back and marveled that it came out in 2001. How can that movie be almost 20 years old?!

Sadly, there won't be the road head scenes with George Carlin and Carrie Fisher to laugh at, but I am on board for another Jay and Silent Bob film.

**Turnip Jedi**

Kev and I haven't see eye to eye for a while now, his faux outsider persona, the weed*, his Depp worship, but anything has to be a step up from his recent output especially if he's got someone to curb his poorer ideas

* not some great Weed enemy its just he bangs on and on about it like the tedious teen stoners we all stopped being 25 years ago

**DarkTraveler777**

Turnip Jedi wrote:
Kev and I haven't see eye to eye for a while now, his faux outsider persona, the weed*, his Depp worship but anything has to be a step up from his recent output

* not some great Weed enemy its just he bangs on and on about it like the tedious teen stoners we all stopped being 25 years ago

To be fair, Kevin Smith didn't get "into" weed until later in his adult life, so he might be making up for lost time.

More seriously, even before he embraced marijuana his brand was linked with weed culture, so it kinda benefits him to bang that drum for his audience.

I just wish he'd stop wearing that damn hockey jersey everywhere.

**Yodhrin**

I mean that's kinda the thing though - Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back came out when a lot of us would have been highschoolers who actually smoked weed and found stoner comedy hilarious, but that was 18 years ago.

It's possible he can come up with something fun & new, but if it just ends up as "Strike Back, but with hastag-topical and Trump jokes" it'll be a hard pass IMO.

**DarkTraveler777**

Yodhrin wrote:
I mean that's kinda the thing though - Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back came out when a lot of us would have been highschoolers who actually smoked weed and found stoner comedy hilarious, but that was 18 years ago.

I hear you, especially regarding the "stoner comedy" genre, it isn't for everyone, and it definitely ages out for a lot of people.

Also, adults smoke weed, not just teens. I don't agree with you that age is the only reason some of us found these movies funny. What about "classic" stoner comedies by the likes of Cheech and Chong? They are juvenile in tone and content, but I wouldn't necessarily say they were for juveniles. I don't think any of Smith's movies really are appropriate for kids. Adults who want an immature laugh, sure, but I wouldn't label any of Smith's stoner comedies as high school fare.

Yodhrin wrote:
It's possible he can come up with something fun & new, but if it just ends up as "Strike Back, but with hastag-topical and Trump jokes" it'll be a hard pass IMO.

Did you see Clerks 2? I liked Clerks 2, but not necessarily as much as Clerks, and in some ways it just mimicked the first movie with more current pop media references (Transformers and LotR vs Star Wars for example). So, you may unfortunately be on to something in terms of what to expect with this one. I am also hoping for something new and creative, but even if I just get old Jay and old Silent Bob riffing it will likely tickle my nostalgia bone enough to be worth the price of admission.

**LunarSol**

To me, Kevin Smith is one of those artists whose writing was based a lot on expressing his personal insecurities. As he found an audience, he gained a lot of confidence and was better able to express his immaturities, but lost a lot of the nuance that made his early stuff connect with people. Nerd culture became mainstream, but the strength of his stuff wasn't really the nerd references as much as the feelings of being an outsider. Much of the joy of his films come from the ability to really get across both the joy of reveling in geekdom and the challenges of projecting a shell of normalcy when the real world comes crashing in.

**Turnip Jedi**

LunarSol wrote:
To me, Kevin Smith is one of those artists whose writing was based a lot on expressing his personal insecurities. As he found an audience, he gained a lot of confidence and was better able to express his immaturities, but lost a lot of the nuance that made his early stuff connect with people. Nerd culture became mainstream, but the strength of his stuff wasn't really the nerd references as much as the feelings of being an outsider. Much of the joy of his films come from the ability to really get across both the joy of reveling in geekdom and the challenges of projecting a shell of normalcy when the real world comes crashing in.

well put, I think it all came to a point around Zak and Miri, which whilst maintaining his Cynicism redeemed by Love with added dick and fart jokes lightly drizzled in geek sauce schtick, it definitely felt like going through the motions, and at around the same the rise of 'mainstream geek' due to Big Bang, the MCU etc pushing him in an uncomfortable direction, still not sure picking up the maryjanes was the best reaction

**DarkTraveler777**

Turnip Jedi wrote:
LunarSol wrote:
To me, Kevin Smith is one of those artists whose writing was based a lot on expressing his personal insecurities. As he found an audience, he gained a lot of confidence and was better able to express his immaturities, but lost a lot of the nuance that made his early stuff connect with people. Nerd culture became mainstream, but the strength of his stuff wasn't really the nerd references as much as the feelings of being an outsider. Much of the joy of his films come from the ability to really get across both the joy of reveling in geekdom and the challenges of projecting a shell of normalcy when the real world comes crashing in.

well put, I think it all came to a point around Zak and Miri, which whilst maintaining his Cynicism redeemed by Love with added dick and fart jokes lightly drizzled in geek sauce schtick, it definitely felt like going through the motions, and at around the same the rise of 'mainstream geek' due to Big Bang, the MCU etc pushing him in an uncomfortable direction, still not sure picking up the maryjanes was the best reaction

Yep, it was Zack and Miri that was kinda the "ah ha" moment for Smith that his formula wasn't working.

Old article but it has some relevant bits:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/katla-mcglynn/kevin-smith-talks-angry-y_b_309496.html

Smith’s growing pains in the aftermath of “Zack and Miri” begged the question: has Judd Apatow cornered the slacker/bromance comedy market for good? In a sense, yes. But Smith admits it’s all part of the nature of filmmaking and a natural progression.

“I saw ‘Slacker’ and Hal Hartley’s movies when I was 21. Richard Linklater’s film was a wandering, meandering student film that was fascinating to watch. Hal Hartley’s stuff had people speaking in surrealistic, almost theatrical speech patterns. These two dudes did something where I was like, ‘Ok, I want to do that too but I think I can change it just enough where it’s better,’” Smith said. “And now, Judd does the same thing. Judd watched a bunch of movies, some of them were mine and he’s very kind about shouting me out, but all he did was say ‘I liked this and if I change it just enough I can make it mine.’ And now he’s doing better, just like my gak did better than Hal and Richard’s gak did in the beginning. Look, it’s such an incestuous medium, film.”

Smith doesn’t resent Apatow for borrowing his realistic dialogue (think about the porn preferences conversation at the top of “Superbad”) nor does he mind Simon Pegg (the British Kevin Smith in a lot of ways) using cues from his films in his own work. “They saw my gak and it informed their gak. I saw ‘Shawn Of The Dead’ and it informed ‘Reaper.’ We pass the ball back and forth because it’s one of those mediums where you’re always going to be influenced by everything you’ve ever seen,” Smith said.

Found this interesting too:

Kevin Smith wrote:“It’s sad when you realize you can’t be the angry young man anymore. The angry young man is barely ever interesting, and tolerable in his 20s. But his late 20s? Early 30s? God forbid late 30s? You can’t anymore. I’m in a business where I get to make pretend for a living, so what the feth am I angry about? There’s nothing anymore; I’m a very content, middle aged man,” Smith said. “People are like ‘Ah when are Jay and Silent Bob coming back?’ And I’m like ‘I don’t think they are. I’m fuckin’ 39! I can’t just put my fuckin’ hat on backwards.”

Well that last part of the quote didn't age well.

**Lance845**

If they made this movie who would it even be for?

As mentioned, the people who knew and liked Jay and Bob have outgrown them. The people who played Jay and Bob have outgrown them. The people who would be most interested in Jay and Bobs antics now have no idea who they are.

There is just no reason to make this movie.

**Blackie**

They're just following the hollywood trend to do a sequel, remake or even tv series of brands that were dead since 20+ years, nothing new here.

I deeply loved the first movies directed by Kevin Smith and hated pretty much everything he directed in the last 10 years. I'd definitely skip this new unneened Jay & Silent Bob reunion.

**Lance845**

I like Clerks 1, Mallrats, Chasing Amy, and Dogma is probably his best work. MAAAAYBE Jersey Girl.

Pretty much everything else he has done is crap. Especially when he writes Batman comics. Cacophony is a Kevin Smith wishes he was Batman fan fiction. Pure garbage.

**hotsauceman1**

But aren't they museum guards in Central City now?

**Dreadwinter**

hotsauceman1 wrote:
But aren't they museum guards in Central City now?

I could get behind a Night at the Museum reboot with these two.

**Voss**

Lance845 wrote:
I like Clerks 1, Mallrats, Chasing Amy, and Dogma is probably his best work. MAAAAYBE Jersey Girl.
.

I couldn't identify with or deal with jersey girl. The starting premise is completely ruined by 5 seconds of thought and what a hot-shot New York agent/lawyer/or whatever would do anyway: hire a nanny.

For the rest- I liked most of them at the time, though never really thought much of the self-insert stoner stuff, that was way more a thing in J&SB. Now though... There are particular scenes that are funny, some that are interesting, and whole lot of dull filler. Except for clerks- The lack of transitions in clerks (which helped make it 'artsy' at the time) just let him skip the aspects of film-making he was bad at. But at this point I'd have a hard time sitting down and just watching them straight thru. It wouldn't feel particularly rewarding or interesting.

Part of the problem is the very authenticity (except for the general lack of non-white people, except the one angry homosexual black guy from Chasing Amy, who feels very inauthentic and there for shock value). Yep, suburban New Jersey is actually like that, and Kevin obviously grew up there... But it isn't actually interesting to watch. It's the blandest turn of the century Americana possible, with mundane obscenities and fairly cliche discussions about sex and farts.

Dogma is weird just for how poorly it grasps the religion it's trying to mock and praise simultaneously.

**Lance845**

Voss wrote:
Lance845 wrote:
I like Clerks 1, Mallrats, Chasing Amy, and Dogma is probably his best work. MAAAAYBE Jersey Girl.
.

I couldn't identify with or deal with jersey girl. The starting premise is completely ruined by 5 seconds of thought and what a hot-shot New York agent/lawyer/or whatever would do anyway: hire a nanny.

For the rest- I liked most of them at the time, though never really thought much of the self-insert stoner stuff, that was way more a thing in J&SB. Now though... There are particular scenes that are funny, some that are interesting, and whole lot of dull filler. Except for clerks- The lack of transitions in clerks (which helped make it 'artsy' at the time) just let him skip the aspects of film-making he was bad at. But at this point I'd have a hard time sitting down and just watching them straight thru. It wouldn't feel particularly rewarding or interesting.

Part of the problem is the very authenticity (except for the general lack of non-white people, except the one angry homosexual black guy from Chasing Amy, who feels very inauthentic and there for shock value). Yep, suburban New Jersey is actually like that, and Kevin obviously grew up there... But it isn't actually interesting to watch. It's the blandest turn of the century Americana possible, with mundane obscenities and fairly cliche discussions about sex and farts.

Dogma is weird just for how poorly it grasps the religion it's trying to mock and praise simultaneously.

Actually I am from central Jersey. The mall from Mall Rats is one of 3 that were within 15 minutes from where I lived (Menlo Park Mall). Redbank (where Jay and Silent Bobs Secret Stash exists) wasn't that far away (also redbank is a gak hole and the secret stash is over priced, small, and crap).

The white washing is VERY inauthentic. NJ is a crazy melting pot with people of all kinds of nationalities packed in and around each other. My schools had a majority white, but not if you added up all the minorities. A ton of hispanics from all over (I had a crush on a girl from Columbia, knew a kid from Mexico, am still friends with a guy from Peru etc etc...), indians (as in from India, Native Americans are basically the only racial group I had no exposure to over there), Asians, and blacks. I myself am a European mutt with italian, irish, scottish (turns out I am a black macgregor), french and others.

None of his stuff is super accurate depictions of anything except probably the fact that Mallrats exist and kids did just go to the mall all the time and bs.

**Blackie**

Well according to wikipedia New Jersey Racial Breakdown of Population had 79.3% of whites in 1990, above 80% in the 80s when Kevin Smith grew up.

It's amazing how people could squat a movie because of white washing. In this specific case it's not even the case of white washing, according to the racial makeup of the state.

It's also amazing that some movies have the full cast made of black people, could win the most important accademy award, and no one would talk about black washing, despite the fact that a city with only black dudes doesn't exist in the USA.

And since when comedies are extremely authentic?

**Lance845**

Oh don't even get started.

Nobody was raging against Kevin Smith or calling him a racist. The movies are a product of their time and they don't age well because of it.

As to black populations in the united states there is a large multi state area referred to as the "Black Belt". which is generally more than 80% affrican american with other races mixed into the other 20% so that whites MAYBE make up 10% of the population.

And in Middlesex County (either where the movies take place or damn near them) the racial break down according to wikipedia is significantly different from state wide.
Which is currently 58.6% white 9.69% black 21.4% asian 18% hispanic, and so on.

Red Bank (where kevin smith is actually from) isn't much different.
63% white. 12.42 black, 18.56 other races, including a massive hispanic presence.

**timetowaste85**

Ok...unless I’m missing something, I’ll be the first to say it. I would love to see a sequel. I’m a Kevin Smith can, and I won’t deny it. Loved Clerks 1&2, Mallrats, Dogma and J&SB SB. I didn’t like Chasing Amy much, because the first half was great, and second half was unenjoyable. A second Jay and Silent Bob would be fun, and I’m eagerly awaiting the rumored Clerks 3 (that he planned to do to show where Dante and Randal are at during multiple milestones in their lives). Clerks 3 > J&SB2, but I’ll still watch both quite happily!!

**Bromsy**

Yeah, Dogma is by far the best - I still have some hopes for Moose Jaws... but it's more of a "How could anyone screw up that premise...." kind of thin hope.